Leeds. FIVE points?

[hans kraay fan club]

I keep hearing mention of the possibility that dirty Leeds will accept a FIVE point reduction in their punishment.

Obviously this would suit them, in that it would very much strengthen their chances of making the play-offs, but I just cannot see how this scenario can be feasible?

Surely the arbitration panel is looking at the legalities of the FL sanction, and is empowered with making a simple decision, i.e. Did the FL have the authority to impose the sanction? They either did or didn't, as far as I can understand. They can't be 'a bit wrong' can they?

 

[Easy 10]

Its the kind of fudging compromise the Football Association and the FAPL would specialise in, but i'm confident the Football League will stick to their guns on this.

They are, after all, holding the ACE CARD in that they have it in writing from Leeds that they will accept the 15 point deduction in return for the Golden Share being reinstated. The 15 point deduction will stand - any other decision would cause CARNAGE.

 

[steward 433]

Leeds still face court over a winding up petition so pretty soon they might not even exist *prays hard*

 

[clapham_gull]

Playing devils advocate here....

I'm not defending Leeds actions, but it does seem a little bit odd where this arbitrary 15 point deduction came from.

Problem is that the league had never had to deal with a situation like this and possibly that might work in Leeds favour.

As for the signing of the agreement they didn't have a choice (*) and said from the beginning they would appeal.

(*) Which I understand has some significance in Law.

 

[bright1064]

They are, after all, holding the ACE CARD in that they have it in writing from Leeds that they will accept the 15 point deduction in return for the Golden Share being reinstated. The 15 point deduction will stand - any other decision would cause CARNAGE.

And there is the common sense the football league should be looking to use for this situation. You summed it up perfectly mate

Leeds can't just click their fingers when they need the points, that in completely unfair on EVERY other football team in the league.

It would be morally wrong on the FL's part

 

[Yorkie]

I think the 5 points comes from the usual 'punishment' for administration is 10 points. So they seem to think they have been over punished.

Maybe they should have been relegated two divisions like Swindon for financial irregularities, there had been a precedent for that.

 

[steward 433]

Maybe they should have been relegated two divisions like Swindon for financial irregularities, there had been a precedent for that.

Agreed 15 points was far too lenient

 

[clapham_gull]

Playing devils advocate again.. (and I'll reiterate that they signed the contract because they didn't have a choice)

It was the Inland Revenue that appealed against the original CVA.

This issue is more to do them being pissed off they are not a preferred creditor in cases like this.

Leeds could argue the fact that they had a CVA in place, the football creditors were paid off (to make the league happy), but it was a third party that forced them into the route they took.

It was a general league issue rather than a specific Leeds United one.

 

[clapham_gull]

I think the 5 points comes from the usual 'punishment' for administration is 10 points. So they seem to think they have been over punished.

Maybe they should have been relegated two divisions like Swindon for financial irregularities, there had been a precedent for that.

Very different case Yorkie, very different set of circumstances. This 15 points has nothing to do with them going into administration, rather the circumstances of them coming out of it.

May seem like I'm splitting hairs, but thats the basis of the 15 deduction.

 

[steward 433]

They did have a bloody choice though and took the easiest route of the choices given them!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Easy 10]

I'm not defending Leeds actions, but it does seem a little bit odd where this arbitrary 15 point deduction came from.

In exceptional circumstances though, abritrary decisions happen all the time. Ben Thatcher was only booked for cutting Pedro Mendez in half a couple of years ago. The FA looked at it again though and banned him for 8 games (when the usual line is "if the refs already seen it and dealt with it, we can't do anything").

I daresay the Football League don't have a specific rule or punishment in place if a player takes to the field with a pet llama that subsequently savages the opposition goalkeeper in a frenzied attack during a goalmouth scramble. But they'd still have to act and dish out a suitable punishment they see as fitting for the crime.

 

[clapham_gull]

In exceptional circumstances though, abritrary decisions happen all the time. Ben Thatcher was only booked for cutting Pedro Mendez in half a couple of years ago. The FA looked at it again though and banned him for 8 games (when the usual line is "if the refs already seen it and dealt with it, we can't do anything).

I daresay the Football League don't have a specific rule or punishment in place if a player takes to the field with a pet llama that subsequently savages the opposition goalkeeper in a frenzied attack during a goalmouth scramble. But they'd still have to act and dish out a punishment they see as fitting for the crime.

You see the rule doesn't actually use "exceptional circumstances" in that context.

Looks like it's actually badly worded. What is says is something like the leagues preferred way of coming of a administraion is via a CVA, unless exceptional circumstances exist. Or something like that..

Says nothing about the extra points deduction you get if there are "exceptional circumstances".

I'm playing devils advocate Easy - but Leeds solicitors will be all over it.

Weren't Leeds actually deducted points for irregularities - what irregularities were there ? Wasn't a big city administrator in charge at the time, why havent the regulators been knocking on their door ?

 

[vulture]

Bates is looking to sell the club asap......he knows that if they are in the championship rather than league 1 he will get loads more............bates does not give 2 flying fucks about leeds....only about his bank balance.....if leeds were in 14th with no chance of making the playoffs even with 5 or 15 points back he would not be stirring up all this shit....

Its the leeds fans I feel sorry for having a chairman like that...

 

[Easy 10]

Its all down to interpretation though innit.
I just can't see Leeds getting away with it.

 

[Bozza]

Its the leeds fans I feel sorry for having a chairman like that...

Why? He took over a heavily debt laden club that was in freefall. When he leaves (with his pockets full of cash) the club will be in the Championship and either debt free or largely debt free. The club will be in a great position to challenge for a return to the Premiership, and that wasn't the case before Bates came along.

Granted the methods that have been used to get there are completely despicable, but they will have been bloody effective.

 

[clapham_gull]

Its all down to interpretation though innit.

I love a barrister to use that defence in court

 

[Yorkie]

It's not the same club. They did the same as Leicester and formed a new club. Leeds UtdAFC07.

 

[Easy 10]

I love a barrister to use that defence in court

"You say tomatos"

 

[vulture]

Why? He took over a heavily debt laden club that was in freefall. When he leaves (with his pockets full of cash) the club will be in the Championship and either debt free or largely debt free. The club will be in a great position to challenge for a return to the Premiership, and that wasn't the case before Bates came along.

Granted the methods that have been used to get there are completely despicable, but they will have been bloody effective.

Agree...but he is making Leeds one if not the most unpopular club in the whole of the league......A club with the history of Leeds should accept the 15 point penalty with grace and they would if any other person was in charge of the club....it scares the shit out of me to think that some posters on here wanted bates as chairman not so long ago.

 

[clapham_gull]

"You say tomatos"

I'd probably launch into "I am what I am...." then leg it.