[Politics] Keir Starmer

[BLOCK F]

Perhaps it’s you who should be ‘piping down’.

The idea of not holding the government to account at this time is truly shocking.

Despite the rhetoric of the government, we are not at war, no need for this ‘support the government - no questions asked BS’. That is exactly how nationalist governments form and thrive, you get to a position we see in China & Russia now & then eventually someone like Hitler takes control. Orwell brilliantly outlined the ‘we’re at war - everyone support the government’ in 1984 where the totalitarian dictatorship ensured a perpetual war against either of the two other superstates, this was designed for people like yourself to squeal about unconditional support for the government drunk on emotion, fear and nationalism. Trump & Johnson are reeling out the war rhetoric but have you stopped to explore what other countries are using this sort of language?

We need an effective opposition more than ever. There is nothing unreasonable about the following:

From the BBC:

Writing in the paper, Sir Keir said: "The Labour Party I lead will do our bit to offer solutions.
"But we will also speak for those who have been ignored; and where we see mistakes we are under a duty to expose them to ensure that they are rectified as soon as possible."

Now the focus must be on making sure the promise of 100,000 tests is delivered and that these tests reach those who need them most, including our frontline NHS staff," he added.


It is the opposition’s duty to hold the government to account. Are you seriously advocating they stand down from this? Do you not think that lives can be saved if the government’s mistakes are pointed out so that they can be rectified.

This is a popularist government who will follow headlines so after the media outrage about the lack of testing, the government changed it’s target to 100,000 tests per day (which was the right thing to do all along) but they need to be led to these decisions because, as we have seen, they are reactive, not proactive. They need to be held to account now to make sure they meet the new testing target, that is where an effective opposition and media come in.

Your confusion is with your blind support for the government, your message should be getting behind the government advice, NHS, key workers and all the other brilliant people who are stepping up against this awful virus, not a struggling cabinet who are totally out of their depth.

I certainly have no blind support for the Government and I am entirely behind government advice, the NHS, key workers et al and if you read other posts by me you will realise this. In particular, I have stood up for the medics and boffins, sometimes opposing the views of other posters.
Do you seriously suggest that I don't want the best possible outcome for the country and its citizens and would rather blindly support what you believe to be a failing Government? What utter drivel.
You accuse me of having blind support for the Government, but If you set aside your utter hatred of the Tory Government and looked at what I actually said in my post, I think you may see that it doesn't warrant your rant at me. I merely suggested that perhaps Keir Starmer would be better served showing a united front and express his thoughts and views behind closed doors, where no doubt many a heated discussion takes place. In no way does that preclude him from holding the Government to account. He may also benefit from being put fully in the picture as regards what is actually being done and the problems that are being met and that have to be surmounted.I do not think that is such a dreadful position to take. On a slightly different note, as a democrat, I am delighted that the Labour Party now has a leader of credibility and will hopefully restore the party into one that is capable of providing a proper alternative to the Government........unlike the previous regime.It is a view I have always held and have expressed several times on this forum.
Finally, your paragraph re totalitarian dictatorship just doesn't warrant an answer and I am insulted by the fact that you think I would be sympathetic and support such regimes.
PS I come from a long line of those who have served the NHS as surgeon, doctors and nurses and still have relatives working for the NHS, so I can do without lectures from political warriors like you telling me to get behind the NHS.

 

[Titanic]

 

[BLOCK F]

Damn right. He should applaud the bumbling mess that this government has been responsible for and help wash the blood off their hands whilst he's at it.

That's just what is needed. A free pass for the incompetent and uncaring.

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Oh for God's sake!:

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

He will run rings round Boris. He has built a reputation of getting things sorted out and having an eye for detail - everything that Boris isn't. He was a highly successful human rights barrister, and is a QC, which you don't get awarded for being a fool. He was a highly regarded Director of Public Prosecutions. He will at the very least provide the opposition that has been sadly lacking in recent months and years.

Sounds Great ,but he spent three years trying to stall Democracy, that alone despite his qualifications will linger like a bad smell
Regards
DF

 

[drew]

I certainly have no blind support for the Government and I am entirely behind government advice, the NHS, key workers et al and if you read other posts by me you will realise this. In particular, I have stood up for the medics and boffins, sometimes opposing the views of other posters.
Do you seriously suggest that I don't want the best possible outcome for the country and its citizens and would rather blindly support what you believe to be a failing Government? What utter drivel.
You accuse me of having blind support for the Government, but If you set aside your utter hatred of the Tory Government and looked at what I actually said in my post, I think you may see that it doesn't warrant your rant at me. I merely suggested that perhaps Keir Starmer would be better served showing a united front and express his thoughts and views behind closed doors, where no doubt many a heated discussion takes place. In no way does that preclude him from holding the Government to account. He may also benefit from being put fully in the picture as regards what is actually being done and the problems that are being met and that have to be surmounted.I do not think that is such a dreadful position to take. On a slightly different note, as a democrat, I am delighted that the Labour Party now has a leader of credibility and will hopefully restore the party into one that is capable of providing a proper alternative to the Government........unlike the previous regime.It is a view I have always held and have expressed several times on this forum.
Finally, your paragraph re totalitarian dictatorship just doesn't warrant an answer and I am insulted by the fact that you think I would be sympathetic and support such regimes.
PS I come from a long line of those who have served the NHS as surgeon, doctors and nurses and still have relatives working for the NHS, so I can do without lectures from political warriors like you telling me to get behind the NHS.

You might not have a blind spot for the government but surely you recognize that, so far, they are jumping from one disaster from another, whether that be supply of PPE, number of tests, to work or not to work, to drive to a beauty spot or not etc etc. You might well support the measures in place, I do as well, but they were late being implemented and now aren't being enforced enough by the Police.

 

[BLOCK F]

You might not have a blind spot for the government but surely you recognize that, so far, they are jumping from one disaster from another, whether that be supply of PPE, number of tests, to work or not to work, to drive to a beauty spot or not etc etc. You might well support the measures in place, I do as well, but they were late being implemented and now aren't being enforced enough by the Police.

Hi Drew,
I think it is a bit harsh to say they are jumping from one disaster to another, but of course, in these unprecedented times, mistakes will have been made ,but I have faith that a huge amount of effort is being put into making sure PPE , ventilators etc. are being put in place. It does seem that the public have now got the message re social distancing etc., although having not been beyond the garden gate for 17 days, I can only judge from what I read and the news reports.I do think that police response could be better co-ordinated with some reports of over reaction and some of not enough.
Arguments will be held whether or not the measures in place were implemented too late or not. I believe the Government were guided by the scientific and medical advisors. Time will tell whether or not that advice was correct.
Like everyone else, I obviously want the best possible outcome for the country. Fingers crossed for the stats to show a peak and then a slowing down of infections as the epidemiologists predict. I suppose the acid test for any country will be the number of deaths per head of population.At the moment, I think I am right in saying we are more or less in line with other countries. I am very interested in how the Swedish approach works out; let us hope they haven't made a huge misjudgment.
Stay safe.

 

[amexer]

If I’m the first person to have made comparisons with this global crisis and the Second World War, then laugh away.

You have no problem with questioning by the opposition - Starmer has questioned the processes by which PPE has been delivered to frontline workers and the speed at which the government has acted to increase testing.

He’s also made constructive suggestions regarding vaccination centres and towards an effective lockdown exit strategy.

You’re correct. Times have changed. The stakes are high and we need those making decisions to have fewer lapses in judgement than they’ve had thus far.

I assume Corbyn and Sturmer would have waved a magic wand and have had all extra equipment needed overnight.

 

[Hampster Gull]

Very good choice. Now let’s see if he can tame the far left the the union barons. If he can and migrates today centre left he has a great chance

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I assume Corbyn and Sturmer would have waved a magic wand and have had all extra equipment needed overnight.

*Starmer

Matt Hancock said everything was ready back in January. 3.5 months later we are still struggling. The Shadow Health Secretary questioned why people flying in weren't screened, but just given a leaflet.

https://www.parliament.uk/business/news/2020/january/statement-on-wuhan-coronavirus/

 

[Worried Man Blues]

Surely it's the opposition leader's job to hold the government to account. He also made it clear he wants to work with the PM in the national interest.

I wouldn't kick you in the nuts then ask to be your friend, that's why I'm no politition

 

[amexer]

Couldnt understand why he went straight in and criticised handling of virus. Tories have made a sensible move by including him in future policy meetings about virus. Maybe he will then find out difficulties about putting everything in place.
As I said in another thread I heard both Andy Burnham and Ed Balls on TV, Both giving constructive views but also both praised the job government is doing.. Both of course no longer high profile politicians so are not trying to score points.

 

[jonny.rainbow]

View attachment 121800

Grow up.

 

[Bakero]

 

[Raleigh Chopper]

Sounds Great ,but he spent three years trying to stall Democracy, that alone despite his qualifications will linger like a bad smell
Regards
DF

And of course proroguing parliament is not stalling democracy is it numbnuts.
Have a cap, thicko
Regards
RC

 

[drew]

Couldnt understand why he went straight in and criticised handling of virus. Tories have made a sensible move by including him in future policy meetings about virus. Maybe he will then find out difficulties about putting everything in place.
As I said in another thread I heard both Andy Burnham and Ed Balls on TV, Both giving constructive views but also both praised the job government is doing.. Both of course no longer high profile politicians so are not trying to score points.

Well that's alright then. PPE arrived on time and we're currently doing 100k tests. I must have misread that bit about nurses, doctors and HCAs dying.

I also didn't hear about stories of Gov depts not replying to emails and the like of those in industries that can help with supplies.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Couldnt understand why he went straight in and criticised handling of virus. Tories have made a sensible move by including him in future policy meetings about virus. Maybe he will then find out difficulties about putting everything in place.
As I said in another thread I heard both Andy Burnham and Ed Balls on TV, Both giving constructive views but also both praised the job government is doing.. Both of course no longer high profile politicians so are not trying to score points.

I agree.

Gave a really good interview on Andrew Marr, then I see a headline later on about serious mistakes......


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[Pretty pink fairy]

And of course proroguing parliament is not stalling democracy is it numbnuts.
Have a cap, thicko
Regards
RC

Oh dear another fail ,think about what you're posting ,have cap on me ....



Regards
DF

 

[hans kraay fan club]

I assume Corbyn and Sturmer would have waved a magic wand and have had all extra equipment needed overnight.

It didn’t need a magic wand, to not stubbornly refuse to accept the 10,000 ventilators available through the EU scheme (nor to lie about it afterwards).

It didn’t need a magic wand to take up industry offers to develop and supply more.

It didn’t need a magic wand to close the schools two weeks earlier, before the virus took real hold.

Keep supporting the government blindly, if you think the severity of the situation, absolves them of any objective or constructive criticism. Some of us will continue to call out dangerous bad decisions, when we see them being made.

 

[Biscuit Barrel]

It didn’t need a magic wand, to not stubbornly refuse to accept the 10,000 ventilators available through the EU scheme (nor to lie about it afterwards).

It didn’t need a magic wand to take up industry offers to develop and supply more.

Different experts in different countries have different ideas how the virus should be tackled. Sweden has only just closed schools because they feel it is better to keep them open as children are not high risk and do not spread the disease. Not my view, just trying to highlight that there are lots of different opinions about the best way to go and there is no hand book a government can pick up and follow to eradicat the virus.

It didn’t need a magic wand to close the schools two weeks earlier, before the virus took real hold.

Keep supporting the government blindly, if you think the severity of the situation, absolves them of any objective or constructive criticism. Some of us will continue to call out dangerous bad decisions, when we see them being made.

The Government have said they have enough ventilators at the moment, with more coming.

They might well be lying, but I have not read that a patient has not been placed on a ventilator because the hospital had run out.

Other EU countries have had far higher death rates than the UK. Did they not get enough ventilators for the EU? My last point is not a dig at the EU, just a question.

Other countries have handled the virus differently. Sweden has only just closed its schools. This.is because their experts think that children are at a very low risk and do not really transmit the disease. This just highlights that there are lots of different opinions and unfortunately there is not a hand book that governments can pick up and follow to to end the virus.

I guess we will only find out which countries handled the situation the best once it is all over.

 

[Deleted member 2719]

Like what? Shop for essentials or go for your one daily exercise? Or do the bins need putting out?

Paint the shed, mend the kids bikes, cut my sons hair, charge the battery on the missus car and my motorbike and watch an episode of Frasier.

Ps the shed is NOT red.

From reading this and other quotes from you on here, I think you are seriously deluded and in for a few big shocks.

Fair enough, what shocks should I be expecting