[Misc] JFK Assassination 59 years on

[Mo Gosfield]

The first news report stated that he had been shot. I shouted upstairs to my mother and she replied....OMG.....a bit later confirmation of his death came through.
He had been warned a number of times of the dangers of visiting Dallas. His security men insisted they drove with the bullet proof bubble over the car but the President refused. It had rained earlier that morning in Dallas but as they landed from Fort Worth, the sun came out. They even built a specially raised back seat in the Lincoln so Mr and Mrs Kennedy would be above Governor Connolly and his wife and more visible to the public. Normally, Secret Service officers rode on the back of the presidential car. They were asked not to, on this occasion, after consultation with Kennedy and his aides. The first shot wasn't fatal and only wounded Kennedy. Had SS operatives been on the back of the car, they would have protected the president's body and the fatal second shot wouldn't have happened.

 

[dejavuatbtn]

I was at 1st Hove cubs at the Ralli Hall when the caretaker flew into the room and told us.
A proper “where were you when“ moment.

 

[Goldstone1976]

Moon landings - not particularly likely the 1969 one happened, no. Too many Hollywood people involved in early NASA.
Alien visitations - if the universe is as big as claimed, it is near impossible that we haven't had visitors
Aliens stored in Area 51 - not seen any compelling evidence that this is the case so this one might well be false
9/11 - may or may not have happened as described, but the executive arm (the CIA) of the yankee banks as well as the US govt had the strongest motifs to make it happen

"Mainstream" theories that seem unlikely: flat earth, the Jewish global conspiracy (there is a global conspiracy but it doesn't have any ethnic or religious origin), Marxist conspiracy theory (the idea that 'socialists' and 'communists' are taking over the world is... a funny one as it would serve no purpose), WW2/holocaust denial (politically a far more complex war than people think, but it did indeed happen and so did the killings of millions of jews).

Thanks for the detailed response, and also for your willingness to share your views.

 

[Gwylan]

Moon landings - not particularly likely the 1969 one happened, no. Too many Hollywood people involved in early NASA.
Alien visitations - if the universe is as big as claimed, it is near impossible that we haven't had visitors

How is not likely that the moon landing happened but near impossible that we haven't had visitors?

We're not able to make a 300,000 mile trip to our satellite but aliens can travel several light years, across galaxies to come here? I can, just about, understand someone holding one of those beliefs - I think they're bonkers, but I can understand why they could believe. But I don't begin to understand how someone can think moon travel is impossible but intergalactic trips aren't.

 

[Swansman]

How is not likely that the moon landing happened but near impossible that we haven't had visitors?

We're not able to make a 300,000 mile trip to our satellite but aliens can travel several light years, across galaxies to come here? I can, just about, understand someone holding one of those beliefs - I think they're bonkers, but I can understand why they could believe. But I don't begin to understand how someone can think moon travel is impossible but intergalactic trips aren't.

I've not said anything about moon travel being impossible. I'm saying I don't think it happened in 1969.

 

[beorhthelm]

The first news report stated that he had been shot. I shouted upstairs to my mother and she replied....OMG.....a bit later confirmation of his death came through.
He had been warned a number of times of the dangers of visiting Dallas. His security men insisted they drove with the bullet proof bubble over the car but the President refused. It had rained earlier that morning in Dallas but as they landed from Fort Worth, the sun came out. They even built a specially raised back seat in the Lincoln so Mr and Mrs Kennedy would be above Governor Connolly and his wife and more visible to the public. Normally, Secret Service officers rode on the back of the presidential car. They were asked not to, on this occasion, after consultation with Kennedy and his aides. The first shot wasn't fatal and only wounded Kennedy. Had SS operatives been on the back of the car, they would have protected the president's body and the fatal second shot wouldn't have happened.

second shot didnt come from the back, that much is certain. there is a credible theory that the fatal shot came from a mis-fired weapon inside the vehicle.

 

[Gwylan]

I've not said anything about moon travel being impossible. I'm saying I don't think it happened in 1969.

So, it wasn't possible in 1969, but was possible by 1972 (the last moon landing). What rapid technological advance so altered the situation within three years?

 

[pb21]

Moon landings - not particularly likely the 1969 one happened, no. Too many Hollywood people involved in early NASA.
Alien visitations - if the universe is as big as claimed, it is near impossible that we haven't had visitors
Aliens stored in Area 51 - not seen any compelling evidence that this is the case so this one might well be false
9/11 - may or may not have happened as described, but the executive arm (the CIA) of the yankee banks as well as the US govt had the strongest motifs to make it happen

"Mainstream" theories that seem unlikely: flat earth, the Jewish global conspiracy (there is a global conspiracy but it doesn't have any ethnic or religious origin), Marxist conspiracy theory (the idea that 'socialists' and 'communists' are taking over the world is... a funny one as it would serve no purpose), WW2/holocaust denial (politically a far more complex war than people think, but it did indeed happen and so did the killings of millions of jews).

What's you favourite conspiracy theory, that turned out to be conspiracy fact?

 

[Swansman]

So, it wasn't possible in 1969, but was possible by 1972 (the last moon landing). What rapid technological advance so altered the situation within three years?

I don't think any of the manned moon landings actually happened. It is possible to get there and it might be possible to put someone there but I don't think it has been done.

What's you favourite conspiracy theory, that turned out to be conspiracy fact?

Well, plenty of conspiracy theories are true so it happens all the time. Just need to look at the recent leadership battles in the UK - plenty of groups conspiring against each other to get their man or woman in charge.

Among the more controversial ones... CIA involvement in drug trade, or perhaps the post-civil war conspiracy theory that the private banks of the US would once again come and try to create a private US central bank, which indeed they did.

 

[Russconha]

best 'you've been framed' ever

 

[Lenny Rider]

Moon landings - not particularly likely the 1969 one happened, no. Too many Hollywood people involved in early NASA.
Alien visitations - if the universe is as big as claimed, it is near impossible that we haven't had visitors
Aliens stored in Area 51 - not seen any compelling evidence that this is the case so this one might well be false
9/11 - may or may not have happened as described, but the executive arm (the CIA) of the yankee banks as well as the US govt had the strongest motifs to make it happen

"Mainstream" theories that seem unlikely: flat earth, the Jewish global conspiracy (there is a global conspiracy but it doesn't have any ethnic or religious origin), Marxist conspiracy theory (the idea that 'socialists' and 'communists' are taking over the world is... a funny one as it would serve no purpose), WW2/holocaust denial (politically a far more complex war than people think, but it did indeed happen and so did the killings of millions of jews).

Sorry old boy too many involved in the NASA programme to have no one come forward in over 50 years and whistle blow any faked landings.

 

[Swansman]

Sorry old boy too many involved in the NASA programme to have no one come forward in over 50 years and whistle blow any faked landings.

If you whistleblow on such a thing you first get ignored by mainstream media (or in best case scenario gets portrayed as insane) and you're also playing with death. Pretty easy to make people shut up when they know what they're dealing with.

 

[beorhthelm]

If you whistleblow on such a thing you first get ignored by mainstream media (or in best case scenario gets portrayed as insane) and you're also playing with death. Pretty easy to make people shut up when they know what they're dealing with.

such a weak argument. tens of thousands of people, none have ever expressed a part in a conspriacy, no dead mans switch to release information. no Russian exposure of their cold war enemy lieing. on the other hand you have UK and Russian scientist that monitored the transmissions, deflectors on the surface, hi-res images showing landing sites with tracks and fudging moon rock examined by half a dozen institutions. zero evidence for faking, lots of evidence for it happening. i feel sorry for you and fellow travellers.

 

[Swansman]

such a weak argument. tens of thousands of people, none have ever expressed a part in a conspriacy, no dead mans switch to release information. no Russian exposure of their cold war enemy lieing. on the other hand you have UK and Russian scientist that monitored the transmissions, deflectors on the surface, hi-res images showing landing sites with tracks and fudging moon rock examined by half a dozen institutions. zero evidence for faking, lots of evidence for it happening. i feel sorry for you and fellow travellers.

Nope, not a weak argument. The "x hundred or x thousand people can't keep a secret" is a bad one, however. There's quite a number of occasions where thousands of people must have been aware of something, yet it took very long time for it to be revealed to the public. And there's surely instances where there isn't one or two brave persons among those thousands of people to reveal what really happened.

 

[Lenny Rider]

such a weak argument. tens of thousands of people, none have ever expressed a part in a conspriacy, no dead mans switch to release information. no Russian exposure of their cold war enemy lieing. on the other hand you have UK and Russian scientist that monitored the transmissions, deflectors on the surface, hi-res images showing landing sites with tracks and fudging moon rock examined by half a dozen institutions. zero evidence for faking, lots of evidence for it happening. i feel sorry for you and fellow travellers.

At the time of the 50th anniversary in 2019, H and J were talking about it on Talk Sport, over 50,000 involved too many people to all keep quiet, especially with the monetary gain it would have bought.

 

[Hugo Rune]

If you whistleblow on such a thing you first get ignored by mainstream media (or in best case scenario gets portrayed as insane) and you're also playing with death. Pretty easy to make people shut up when they know what they're dealing with.

Sadly, the moon landing conspiracy is as ridiculous as the flat earth one. You are dealing with a ‘never ending conspiracy’ if you believe that it didn’t happen at the time. NASA and the US government would have to be constantly updating the conspiracy including faking their lunar reconnaissance orbiter’s photos of the landing sites. Other nations have orbited the moon, surly they’d blow the whistle on the US so this conspiracy is global - it just grows and grows with more BS plugged into fill the gaps.

This would be a great listen* for you if you are up for some self analysis: https://uk-podcasts.co.uk/podcast/the-infinite-monkey-cage/conspiracy-theories

*Warning: contains the views and work of qualified scientists

 

[Swansman]

Sadly, the moon landing conspiracy is as ridiculous as the flat earth one. You are dealing with a ‘never ending conspiracy’ if you believe that it didn’t happen at the time. NASA and the US government would have to be constantly updating the conspiracy including faking their lunar reconnaissance orbiter’s photos of the landing sites. Other nations have orbited the moon, surly they’d blow the whistle on the US so this conspiracy is global - it just grows and grows with more BS plugged into fill the gaps.

This would be a great listen* for you if you are up for some self analysis: https://uk-podcasts.co.uk/podcast/the-infinite-monkey-cage/conspiracy-theories

*Warning: contains the views and work of qualified scientists

Yup, they would.

And nah I'm good, I've heard and seen enough of the "all conspiracy theorists are crazy and all who believe everything that govts and the likes claim are perfectly sane" kind of stuff.

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

Moon landings - not particularly likely the 1969 one happened, no. Too many Hollywood people involved in early NASA.
Alien visitations - if the universe is as big as claimed, it is near impossible that we haven't had visitors
Aliens stored in Area 51 - not seen any compelling evidence that this is the case so this one might well be false
9/11 - may or may not have happened as described, but the executive arm (the CIA) of the yankee banks as well as the US govt had the strongest motifs to make it happen

"Mainstream" theories that seem unlikely: flat earth, the Jewish global conspiracy (there is a global conspiracy but it doesn't have any ethnic or religious origin), Marxist conspiracy theory (the idea that 'socialists' and 'communists' are taking over the world is... a funny one as it would serve no purpose), WW2/holocaust denial (politically a far more complex war than people think, but it did indeed happen and so did the killings of millions of jews).

Having read a great deal about the US and Russian space programmes, from the race to break the sound barrier upto the end of the Apollo missions, it is very, very ,very unlikely that they were faked. The accounts, of which there are many, explain in detail in how it was achieved but also details the f*** ups of which there are many.

The other point with this particular conspiracy is the shear number of people who would have to be in on it and who would need to stay quiet and also keep to the story. Then there are the Russians, who have never once challenged the fact that the US got to the moon. If there had been any truth in it then they would have been shouting from the roof tops.

Brian Cox did a piece on why we haven’t been visited by aliens and it boils down not to if they exist ( the law of averages indicate they do) but just the shear distances that would need to be travelled ( we are talking about 100 & 1000 of light years) which means someone needs to figure out how to not only achieve light speed, but to go at speeds at 100 times faster. The other way is to do with black holes and wormholes which is way beyond me.
I think it more likely that we have been visited by aliens than the moon landings were faked.

 

[Brovion]

Yup, they would.

And nah I'm good, I've heard and seen enough of the "all conspiracy theorists are crazy and all who believe everything that govts and the likes claim are perfectly sane" kind of stuff.

That isn't what the article says though. And no one believes EVERYTHING that governments etc say, of course they lie - only this time they didn't.

Your attitude is common though and I don't blame you for not looking as I understand that you would find it challenging. When theories (conspiracy or otherwise) are debunked their adherents usually never say "Blimey, I was wrong". Instead they double down and maintain that they ARE right despite all the evidence to the contrary, I don't expect you to be any different. You could ponder though as to how they faked it, especially the source of the radio signals from the lunar craft as it travelled to, and landed on the moon, and also having successfully faked it why they felt the need to fake it a further FIVE times.

Anyway, don't bother replying, sit there with your bag over your head, it doesn't matter to me. Have a good evening.

 

[Popeye]

Moon landings - not particularly likely the 1969 one happened, no. Too many Hollywood people involved in early NASA.
Alien visitations - if the universe is as big as claimed, it is near impossible that we haven't had visitors
Aliens stored in Area 51 - not seen any compelling evidence that this is the case so this one might well be false
9/11 - may or may not have happened as described, but the executive arm (the CIA) of the yankee banks as well as the US govt had the strongest motifs to make it happen

"Mainstream" theories that seem unlikely: flat earth, the Jewish global conspiracy (there is a global conspiracy but it doesn't have any ethnic or religious origin), Marxist conspiracy theory (the idea that 'socialists' and 'communists' are taking over the world is... a funny one as it would serve no purpose), WW2/holocaust denial (politically a far more complex war than people think, but it did indeed happen and so did the killings of millions of jews).

Doesn't shock me in the slightest that you believe in conspiracies.Moon landings were faked? Give me strength.

And perhaps 9/11 was set up by the USA?Most ridiculous f***ing thing I have ever read(Have seen this view other places also of course).As a proud patriot and Coast Guard vet,I detest viewpoints like you have to be honest.No way it was staged or set up the USA.Terrorism plain and simple.

Yeah everyone has a right to their opinion but damn.