Outclassed
Did you stop watching after 25 minutes?
Arsenal were brilliant early doors, but we matched them all the way for the last hour or so.
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JFC - Please God make this the last time we have to watch him play in an Albion shirt...
- Thread starter albion1972
- Start date
Outclassed
Did you stop watching after 25 minutes?
Arsenal were brilliant early doors, but we matched them all the way for the last hour or so.
Outclassed
Did you stop watching after 25 minutes?
Arsenal were brilliant early doors, but we matched them all the way for the last hour or so.
take the rose tinted specs off tone......lol
They gave a footballing masterclass for 45minutes. you should be thankfull they took their foot off the gas at 2-0....
Easy 10
Brain dead MUG SHEEP
Whatever it is he brings to the team, we sure as hell didn't miss it at Fulham, Brentford or at home to Ipswich the other night.
maltaseagull
Well-known member
Agreed, but have to say he was poor overall today.
At the same time it is fair to say that "Seasoned professional football people" kept picking him as a holding midfielder ahead of Ince and Holla and the results were not good.
what does jfc bring to the team, what is he's game?! Is he a ball winner? No, is he a attacking midfielder? No, is he a defensive midfielder? No, Is he good at set plays? No, he gets the ball passes to the nearest player,that's he's game, he's 5 yards behind the ball all game
Stumpy Tim
Well-known member
Ince was one of our worst players in the first half. He was good in the second, but to make him MOM makes you look like a fool
HantsSeagull
Well-known member
I know we were largely outclassed but he was the most useless player. I watched him most of the game. He just stands around and watches the game and offers nothing. Everyone around me thinks the same. He is a waste of a place in the team.
Don Quixote
Well-known member
- Nov 4, 2008
- 8,362
When he doesn't play we seem to win.
Absolutely, Ince was very poor and looked out of his depth in the first half. Arguably one of our best players in the second though.
spring hall convert
Well-known member
You think we would have learnt after Barnes.
I might be wrong but it's a lot of the same people as well. Just have to be on the back of at least one of our players and I really don't understand why. It was O' Grady 5 games ago, when it was clear our idiot of an ex-manager wasn't using him properly.
I might be wrong but it's a lot of the same people as well. Just have to be on the back of at least one of our players and I really don't understand why. It was O' Grady 5 games ago, when it was clear our idiot of an ex-manager wasn't using him properly.
Horses Arse
Well-known member
Outclassed
Did you stop watching after 25 minutes?
Arsenal were brilliant early doors, but we matched them all the way for the last hour or so.
No, I posted the tweet at half time though and outclassed we certainly were, all the way through the first half. Chasing shadows and admiring the movement. Much better second half though and bodes well as Hughton can clearly motivate.
sir albion
New member
He's never been in form to start with...He offers absolutely nothing to the side and he is league 1 at best.He's the poster boy and nothing else.
It's like playing with 10 men when he starts...useless and well out of his depth end of...Only recall him having one great game and that was against southampton.
- Aug 8, 2005
- 27,228
The whole midfield was over run in the first half hour. The shape was wrong and the effort misplaced. Once Hughton sorted that out Ince, Holla and yes JFC played really well. People forget JFC and Ince are both still young players and will make mistakes. Doesn't make them bad players.
Shame he didn't motivate them before we started then. First half was embarrassing.
sir albion
New member
Massive gulf between ince and JFC and I mean MASSIVE
portslade seagull
Well-known member
Think he might get a rest when clearance is received for Kayal
Guerrero
New member
He was average.
Like most of the BHA players today.
Like most of the BHA players today.
For me, he isn't a terrible player, he isn't the reason we're struggling, but he hasn't produced the goods enough for many fans.
I've made the following point before in another thread, but it seems to fit here, so I'll make it again.
I think the comparisons to Barnes are ill-founded. With Barnes people were able to point to what he did on the field to argue what he contributed, when he was absent people were able to point to what we were missing.
People don't do that for JFC.
All that we hear is "well, he gets picked by Poyet/Oscar/Hyypia/England U21s" and "he's played out of position, play him as an attacking midfielder and see what we'll get".
But let's look at that:
Poyet - Picked him only a handful of times. Poyet was frequently criticised for not playing the youngsters enough, JFC wasn't someone who was playing enough to counter that criticism.
Oscar - Had to deal with injuries to Crofts, Stephens, Orlandi, and out of form David, a Bridcutt who wasn't in the right frame of mind. When he had most or all of them available, JFC wasn't in the starting line up.
Hyypia - Is the man who people have criticised for picking the wrong players (particularly his not picking of Ince). When his selections are being question, there's an inconsistency to using him picking JFC as a defence of Jake. He also had Stephens and Crofts out for most of his run, and out of shape Agustien.
U21s - Are there a lot of under 21 English midfielders getting first team time at this level or higher that haven't pushed into the England first team? Is being considered good enough to play against other kids really that good of an argument on it's own?
When people defend his performance with "he's played out of position", there is an implied acceptance that he isn't performing that well, it isn't a denial of under-performance, but a mitigation for it.
How long does he need to be playing in a position before he starts to show improvement in it? (Ashley Barnes playing the lone striker role for the first time last season, started to show an improvement after 6 games, after being shifted out wide, Barnes improved to the point we often looked weaker when he wasn't there to protect the left back) If you are naturally a skilled attacking player being played in a defensive role, your natural attacking tendencies will leak out occasionally, you'll get drawn into making that attacking run, you'll get caught too far forward, you will get into attacking positions and try to make things happen. He hasn't shown any of that. He's had time to improve in that role.
Under Hughton, we've had Holla and Ince as defensive midfielders, and after so long playing a defensive role, JFC should be allowed time to become re-accustomed to his "natural position" but he needs to step up.
People who see something in him need to stop using managers picking him and his position as a defence of what many people consider to be poor performances and start basing their arguments on what Jake actually does on the pitch, what he actually brings to the team, if they want to address the growing criticism of him and convince their fellow supporters of his merits.
I've made the following point before in another thread, but it seems to fit here, so I'll make it again.
I think the comparisons to Barnes are ill-founded. With Barnes people were able to point to what he did on the field to argue what he contributed, when he was absent people were able to point to what we were missing.
People don't do that for JFC.
All that we hear is "well, he gets picked by Poyet/Oscar/Hyypia/England U21s" and "he's played out of position, play him as an attacking midfielder and see what we'll get".
But let's look at that:
Poyet - Picked him only a handful of times. Poyet was frequently criticised for not playing the youngsters enough, JFC wasn't someone who was playing enough to counter that criticism.
Oscar - Had to deal with injuries to Crofts, Stephens, Orlandi, and out of form David, a Bridcutt who wasn't in the right frame of mind. When he had most or all of them available, JFC wasn't in the starting line up.
Hyypia - Is the man who people have criticised for picking the wrong players (particularly his not picking of Ince). When his selections are being question, there's an inconsistency to using him picking JFC as a defence of Jake. He also had Stephens and Crofts out for most of his run, and out of shape Agustien.
U21s - Are there a lot of under 21 English midfielders getting first team time at this level or higher that haven't pushed into the England first team? Is being considered good enough to play against other kids really that good of an argument on it's own?
When people defend his performance with "he's played out of position", there is an implied acceptance that he isn't performing that well, it isn't a denial of under-performance, but a mitigation for it.
How long does he need to be playing in a position before he starts to show improvement in it? (Ashley Barnes playing the lone striker role for the first time last season, started to show an improvement after 6 games, after being shifted out wide, Barnes improved to the point we often looked weaker when he wasn't there to protect the left back) If you are naturally a skilled attacking player being played in a defensive role, your natural attacking tendencies will leak out occasionally, you'll get drawn into making that attacking run, you'll get caught too far forward, you will get into attacking positions and try to make things happen. He hasn't shown any of that. He's had time to improve in that role.
Under Hughton, we've had Holla and Ince as defensive midfielders, and after so long playing a defensive role, JFC should be allowed time to become re-accustomed to his "natural position" but he needs to step up.
People who see something in him need to stop using managers picking him and his position as a defence of what many people consider to be poor performances and start basing their arguments on what Jake actually does on the pitch, what he actually brings to the team, if they want to address the growing criticism of him and convince their fellow supporters of his merits.
HawkTheSeagull
New member
Some people always need a hate figure and they have settled on JFC.
He didnt have a bad game, but in the role he plays - he doesnt really stand out. There were worse players out there today than him, yet he gets singled out. Again, people always want to moan about something or someone.
He didnt have a bad game, but in the role he plays - he doesnt really stand out. There were worse players out there today than him, yet he gets singled out. Again, people always want to moan about something or someone.