[News] Is this the start of a UK 'Stop the kindermoord' movement?

[ConfusedGloryHunter]

Protesting/blocking roads is now illegal in the UK

Only if it is politically expedient to silence those protesting.

 

[HeaviestTed]

Only if it is politically expedient to silence those protesting.

The impression I got from video was that they were only in road for red lights, I could (am frequently) be wrong.

 

[jackanada]

If there's a road fatality in this country there seems to be a presumption of it being an unavoidable accident. If the same spot produces casualties over a number of years then it might be looked at.
Now a story to illustrate the difference in the Netherlands.
While visiting some relatives in rural Holland I noticed that just past their house there had been some roadworks. Seemed odd as if I been there about 18 months previously and all seemed in immaculate condition.
Turned out a girl on her bike had been crushed by a lorry some months before. Within a couple of weeks a team had come out and while they agreed it had just been a highly unfortunate accident they decided the bend in the road wasn't quite a constant radius, that a tree did marginally restrict the view along the road and that while not where the accident happened there was a low wall that could prevent someone swerving off the road in an emergency.
All the recommended works were done within a few months.
Bear in mind this was a low traffic country road serving only a few tiny Hamlets and was the only accident on it anyone could remember.

 

[Stat Brother]

For clarity in this discussion, those KSI figures are not just those hit by vehicles but all road related casualties.

Also clarity in this discussion you have one posters words with seemingly no intention to validate them with evidence.
As well as the figures, for England, set down by the Department of Transport.
With those numbers divided down further throughout most individual authorities and countries.

 

[ConfusedGloryHunter]

The impression I got from video was that they were only in road for red lights, I could (am frequently) be wrong.

My comment was tongue in cheek and not actually about the actions taken by these protesters.

I'm more suggesting that the police might be broadly in agreement with the protesters and so be a tad more accommodating than if say it were a far right rally or environmental activists.

Also no politician is going to want to be seen to be against them either.

 

[Bold Seagull]

The upshot of kindermood is now a culture that not only buys into less cars in towns and urban areas for safety, but also huge economic benefits.

As retail areas and pedestrian high streets are easily accessed, there is in turn more footfall, more appeal, more space and easier to get to. Far more commutes under 7 miles are made by bike or other means, this means less congestion for the businesses and trades that rely on vehicle access.

I love Brighton, but from the station to the seafront, then Old Steine to Norfolk Sq. its a shitshow compared to what it could be with wider pavements, more car exclusion, diversions for buses to create more pedestrian piazza style areas. The area from Theatre Royal to the Library is a glimpse of how good the rest could be.

 

[HeaviestTed]

My comment was tongue in cheek and not actually about the actions taken by these protesters.

I'm more suggesting that the police might be broadly in agreement with the protesters and so be a tad more accommodating than if say it were a far right rally or environmental activists.

Also no politician is going to want to be seen to be against them either.

I’m not sure all of the police are against far right demos \o/

 

[HeaviestTed]

For many it is, just ask the speeders!

I can’t they don’t hang around

 

[BrianB]

I live in Haywards Heath and am stunned by the utterly inept cycle paths locally , just one example - there's not even a pavement on Any of the road connections to Burgess Hill even though Wivelsfield Station is closer to the new housing on the southern edge of HH than the town's own station..
The recently built cycle path on Rocky Lane is all but unusable due to no dropdown and idiotic marking...

 

[worthingseagull123]

The Stop the Kindermoord Movement, along with the fuel crisis, is what transformed The Netherlands away from car culture, in the early '70's.

Stop the kindermoord was a groundswell movement of parents (mother's) who'd had enough of cars ploughing into children.
They demonstrated, blocked roads, lobbied and protested and won.

Hundreds call for safer roads at Kings Heath rally after hit-and-run

Rally organisers say people are "sick to the stomach" of dangerous driving in Birmingham.

www.bbc.co.uk

Unlike the anti LTN protests, this first protest appears to have cross section support of the local community.






Driving illegally towards a 'stop driving illegally' protest probably isn't going to end well...




... For the driver.

What is car culture?

Is chosing the quickest, most comfortable and most practical way to get around now a cultural statement?

 

[Hamilton]

The Stop the Kindermoord Movement, along with the fuel crisis, is what transformed The Netherlands away from car culture, in the early '70's.

Stop the kindermoord was a groundswell movement of parents (mother's) who'd had enough of cars ploughing into children.
They demonstrated, blocked roads, lobbied and protested and won.

Hundreds call for safer roads at Kings Heath rally after hit-and-run

Rally organisers say people are "sick to the stomach" of dangerous driving in Birmingham.

www.bbc.co.uk

Unlike the anti LTN protests, this first protest appears to have cross section support of the local community.






Driving illegally towards a 'stop driving illegally' protest probably isn't going to end well...




... For the driver.

I so hope so Stat. I so hope so.

 

[portlock seagull]

I live in Haywards Heath and am stunned by the utterly inept cycle paths locally , just one example - there's not even a pavement on Any of the road connections to Burgess Hill even though Wivelsfield Station is closer to the new housing on the southern edge of HH than the town's own station..
The recently built cycle path on Rocky Lane is all but unusable due to no dropdown and idiotic marking...

In fairness, Lycra’s don’t use official cycle paths when there’s a choice between them and holding cars up on the main road. Just an observation!

 

[1066familyman]

What is car culture?

Is chosing the quickest, most comfortable and most practical way to get around now a cultural statement?

For me, car culture is:

When a society allows cars to dominate over every other form of transport, especially active transport. Contributing to the flat refusal from any Government to properly finance a fully functioning and fit for purpose public transport system.

When the cost of car culture is not fully costed, both in terms of damage to public health and damage to the environment.

When the punishment doesn't fit the crime in regard to sentencing for deaths and injuries caused by car drivers.

The willingness to let car owners use their phone whilst driving with very little fear of ever being caught or punished.

The willingness to allow car owners to park on any pavement they like, again, with very little fear of ever being caught or punished.

The continued insistence that where bike lanes are provided, cars will still have right of way over the cyclist. See 'Dutch roundabouts' for reference.

The woeful lack of good cycling infrastructure, causing many people who would actually be willing to do the short commute to work to instead opt for the car, out of fear for their own safety as a cyclist on a UK road.






I'm sure there's more, but that's a few examples off the top of my head. Anyone who doesn't think we live in 'car culture' must be walking around ( probably driving around as it goes) with their eyes shut.

 

[1066familyman]

In fairness, Lycra’s don’t use official cycle paths when there’s a choice between them and holding cars up on the main road. Just an observation!

In fairness, considerate Lycras will opt for a road rather than a shared cycle path if they expect to be going faster than 10mph.

 

[portlock seagull]

In fairness, considerate Lycras will opt for a road rather than a shared cycle path if they expect to be going faster than 10mph.

In fairness to Lycras, if I’m going faster than 30mph I opt for the cycle path

 

[1066familyman]

In fairness to Lycras, if I’m going faster than 30mph I opt for the cycle path

Sorry, you've lost me there.

 

[theboybilly]

According to stats, which I've just checked, there were 17 pedestrians aged under-16 killed in 2021, and an average of about 25-30 per year in the 10 years prior.

Whilst each one of them is a sad loss

In fairness, Lycra’s don’t use official cycle paths when there’s a choice between them and holding cars up on the main road. Just an observation!

What's an 'Official cycle path' when it's at home? Most of 'em pay lip-service to the requirements of everyday cyclists (this is the main reason why there are not so many cyclists about as there could be)
Badly thought-out routes that neither go anywhere useful, run out paint in the most ridiculous places (another sore point) or don't even join up with continuing safe infrastructure means that many won't chance their lives in heavy traffic with people that, let's speak plainly here, don't give a stuff about the safety of others whether walking, cycling or just standing by the side of the road. Motorists sat in their cocooned steel cage just don't want their 'more important than anybody else's' journey being held up. Sod them and the horse they didn't ride in on. Let's start making the effort to get cars off the road. How many local journeys really need a car? I mean REALLY need a car. We're choking our towns in both air quality and space and all the time killing people. The number of front gardens in my town, Shoreham, has dwindled now to almost zero, concreted over to store 2, 3, 4 or more cars and vans. There has to be a better way. Cars are never the answer

 

[Stat Brother]

For me, car culture is:

When a society allows cars to dominate over every other form of transport, especially active transport. Contributing to the flat refusal from any Government to properly finance a fully functioning and fit for purpose public transport system.

When the cost of car culture is not fully costed, both in terms of damage to public health and damage to the environment.

When the punishment doesn't fit the crime in regard to sentencing for deaths and injuries caused by car drivers.

The willingness to let car owners use their phone whilst driving with very little fear of ever being caught or punished.

The willingness to allow car owners to park on any pavement they like, again, with very little fear of ever being caught or punished.

The continued insistence that where bike lanes are provided, cars will still have right of way over the cyclist. See 'Dutch roundabouts' for reference.

The woeful lack of good cycling infrastructure, causing many people who would actually be willing to do the short commute to work to instead opt for the car, out of fear for their own safety as a cyclist on a UK road.






I'm sure there's more, but that's a few examples off the top of my head. Anyone who doesn't think we live in 'car culture' must be walking around ( probably driving around as it goes) with their eyes shut.

Unfortunately you've played right into the hands of those who seemingly get their gratification from demonising a small, but the only ones they see, subsection of one form of one aspect of active travel.

As right as you are, the 'more' in question ought to be.

Prohibitively expensive rail travel.
Poor service.
Poor use of the infrastructure they have.
Minimal investment.
Followed by massive white elephant investment.
Much of which can be said of buses too.

All of which points to 'just drive, it's easier, and it doesn't really matter how many people you kill, don't worry we've got your back'.

While £100m is spent on one road junction at Stockbury and nobody bats an eyelid.

 

[rogersix]

What is car culture?

Is chosing the quickest, most comfortable and most practical way to get around now a cultural statement?

do you remember the last time you were right?

 

[rogersix]

In fairness, Lycra’s don’t use official cycle paths when there’s a choice between them and holding cars up on the main road. Just an observation!

it cos most cycle paths don't go from anywhere, to anywhere. they are designed by motorists, for motorists. they are put where there's room as a tick box exercise, and are usually unfit for purpose.

if you don't believe me, try it