Is Messi the best you've seen?

[alfredmizen]

And no, Pele was the best .

 

[Jim Van Winkle]

Excellent at club level. However like Ronaldinho, has so far failed to perform at international level

The Ronaldinho who won the WC in 2002. If that's failing I'd like to know what you regard as success?

 

[Hotchilidog]

I'm inclined to say yes, but he is virtually inseparable from Ronaldo. What I Iike about watching Messi and Ronaldo is that they are two different styles of player. Ronaldo I feel is the more aggressive and harder working of the two, but I slightly prefer Messi's effortless style, he just glides across the pitch.

Just fortunate to be able to watch both right now. An absolute joy to watch, and a class above any others playing the game right now.

 

[brightn'ove]

one or two pieces of magic on a pitch does not mean you're the best player ever.

One or two pieces of skill? They've both been doing it week in, week out for the past decade. They've smashed scoring and assist records in the champions league, la liga, and the premier league. Clearly you haven't got a clue if all you think either of them do are 'one or two pieces of magic'.

edit: and seeing as you think Ronaldinho hasn't won a world cup quite clearly I am right.

 

[atfc village]

At the moment Messi is up there ,but will we ever see a World Cup winner out of him in a Maradona mould or an 8 goal tournament return like Ronaldo mark 1 in 2002.Forwards will always get the acclaim,imho players like Beckenbauer,Platini,Cruyff,Zidane and Zico offered more to their teams.

 

[seagulls4ever]

I watch a hell of a lot more La Liga than Premier League football. Watch 75% of ALL the live Spanish games on Sky so know the performances of each pretty well.

Messi has more goals and assists this season. http://www.foxsports.com/soccer/stats?competition=2

Messi was man of the match in pretty much every game of the World Cup. Without him and Masche they would have gone out in the group stages. How did Portugal do?

That highlights how quickly things can change then. A couple of weeks ago Ronaldo had to most assists, and a couple of months ago was WAY ahead in terms of goals. As I say, Messi is the one who is currently on form. Plus, Messi has played more games than Ronaldo this season. Ronaldo has a better goal to game ratio. But these stats are pointless, because they change every week. You said Messi was WAY out in front in terms of creativity, eye for a pass, etc which is patently not true and the point I was counteracting.

If you've never seen Ronaldo produce a performance like Messi last night then I would suggest you pay more attention to the games you are watching.

With regards to the World Cup, I think it was universally agreed that Messi unperformed and was very average. He won the player of the tournament award which me and my Barca supporting friends agreed was a joke. Honestly, I don't see how you can say he was man of the match in pretty much every game. Mascherano was the main reason they got to the final and was better than Messi in every single game. Commentators and fans alike agreed on this at the time - go and read what was written back then. As for Portugal 1. Ronaldo was playing through an injury and 2. take a look at their squad compared to Argentina's.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

Posted this before during the WC. Lionel Messi is from a statistical point of view, a complete freek

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/lionel-messi-is-impossible/

 

[Marshy]

That's my take on it too.

I do believe that Messi is one of the most gifted individuals on the ball, but there was something on the BBC website when he broke the Spanish all time league record about how he scores his goals. As of November 81% were scored with his left foot, 15% his right and 3% with his head (League only).

Just because of that I rate Cristiano Ronaldo as the more complete player.

I am in agreement. Ronaldo for me is a more complete player...

However Messi is still the best .... its a weird one I know...

Just goes to show how awesome these 2 are

 

[maltaseagull]

Impossible to say with any certainty over the decades, as footy has changed in so many ways. Yes, Pele, Maradonna, Ronaldo and Messi all have a decent claim. But for me personally it has to be ...Fred Binney!

Charlie Livesey!!!

 

[Triggaaar]

As records go he will set every one.

And they will NEVER be beaten in my opinion.

Either you think we're going to have WWIII, or you don't understand what never means.

 

[Triggaaar]

John Barnes, Gianluca Vialli, Ronaldinho, Kaka, Cristiano Ronaldo and in my view Messi at the moment have not.

John Barnes and Messi

Whilst Messi did well at the last world cup, in comparison to James Rodriguez, Arjen Robben, Thomas Muller who all looked world class last year and then add in greats like Pele, Maldini, Maradonna, Cruyff, Beckenbauer, Eusebio all of whom just set World Cups over the years alight; I don't think you can compare at the moment.

I hope that he does have that World Cup which everyone just watches him and says "Messi is the greatest player ever", but I just don't think he will and it's the same for Ronaldo and one or two pieces of magic on a pitch does not mean you're the best player ever.

Rodriguez had a good WC, but failed to get his side through one knock-out game. To compare him to Messi is ridiculous. Robben and Muller were both part of great squads, far better than poor Ronaldo has to put up with, and better than Argentina's squad too, yet Argentina still got to the final. Maradonna did well to drag a poor side to the final in '90, but the others you mention also played in good teams.

 

[LU7 RED]

Amazed Zidane hasn't got as many mentions so far. He, like Maradona and Pele have dragged their teams to win a WC and his overall mastery of the ball and vision make him slightly better than Messi in my book.

Messi will really need that WC win at some point to be considered a true great - and also to move from Barca. He would be brilliant in the Prem and would still score a hatful though...even on a wet night in Stoke!

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

Amazed Zidane hasn't got as many mentions so far. He, like Maradona and Pele have dragged their teams to win a WC and his overall mastery of the ball and vision make him slightly better than Messi in my book.

Messi will really need that WC win at some point to be considered a true great - and also to move from Barca. He would be brilliant in the Prem and would still score a hatful though...even on a wet night in Stoke!

The first point I agree with (mainly because he was my favourite player growing up and always seemed a step above everyone else on the pitch) but I fear his lack of goals over the course of his career stops him from truly being amongst that top top bracket (at Real Madrid for example, he often played the same position CR7 currently plays so there is a good comparison point there yet he wasn't nearly as decisive in terms of pure output).

In regards to the second point, can someone please explain to me why he needs to move on from playing for one of the top three clubs in the whole world just to be considered a true great? And more to the point, where should he move to? Does he have to move to an underdog (ie Brighton on £5k a week) and then single-handedly win said underdog their respective top division and then the Champions League?

And more to the point, why does this (utterly idiotic line of argument) never get levelled at CR7 when he's played for the two richest clubs in both Spain and England? How does the fact that he has played in rainy Stoke make him a better footballer than Messi? In fact, how does proving himself at Man Utd on top of Real Madrid make him a better player? More to the point, when have Zidane or the real Ronaldo, or Ronaldinho or Pele or Maradona for that matter ever proven that they can do it on a wet Monday/Tuesday/Wednesday/Thursday in Stoke (it must always rain in Stoke)? Does this (God awful) logic mean that Bojan is better than Messi because he s won the Champions League/ La Liga and also won games in Stoke even when it is raining?

 

[perseus]

Pele

Best at every position on the pitch except keeper.

 

[Pevenseagull]

Best I've seen attending a game, Zidane. England v France. Only a friendly but he was incredible.

 

[beefypigeon]

I think so, yes.

Those that say Messi hasn't done it at international level, I have a similar outlook on this to [MENTION=17377]leigull[/MENTION]. He has scored 45 goals in 96 games for the argies, which is a similar strike rate to Ronaldo for Portugal (52 in 118). Argies are indeed better than portugal of course, but it was the Messi and Mascherano show at the world cup. Meanwhile, Ronaldo didn't even show up? It's also worth bearing in mind that Argentina's opposition is probably stronger than Portugals as the big boys over there tend to play each other quite regularly in the Copa America etc..

Someone mentioned that Ronaldo has the most assists this season so far. That isn't true, Messi has 14 compared to Ronaldos 11. Messi has also scored 2 more goals so far in La Liga (32 to 30).

I actually think that Ronaldo is more reliant on his team mates than Messi is. Ronaldo doesn't really get too involved in the game, he sits out wide and waits for the ball to come to him. With Messi, the whole game goes through him, he plays centrally and is the heartbeat of the team. I've rarely seen Ronaldo put in a performance like Messi did last night, an absolute class above the rest of the players on the pitch and he didn't even have the best of games by his standards.

In my opinion, he is the best player to have ever lived. I obviously can't really compare to players outside of my generation, but I'm pretty confident I won't see a better player in my lifetime. Don't get me wrong, I think Ronaldo is a great player, and is probably more 'rounded' with his superior physique and heading abilities, but he doesn't have the same kind of effect on a game that Messi does.

I also don't see how you can only qualify to be the best player ever if you have won the world cup. That's just non-nonsensical. There are plenty of truly great players that have never won a world cup, and funnily enough football is a team game. Great teams win the world cup, not great players.

 

[W.C.]

Some of the comments on here are laughable.

I'll accept the wc ones to a certain extent, and who apart from Maradona has dragged a team like Napoli to a title?

But Messi is a beautiful footballer. He is football. He's football at it's best if you ask me.

 

[boik]

I tend to vote for Cruyff when pushed as he was so much more than a goalscoring striker. He helped Holland go from being a country with no football history who were happy to just beat Belgium, into potential world champions. He helped invent "Total Football" and invented the Cruyff turn which is still applauded today. He was player of the tournament and top scorer in 74 and probably would have been in 78 too if he hadn't been intimidated into not going. He then went onto become a hugely successful manager transforming Barca into what they are today.

What more could one man have done in a career? That 74 team was the best I have seen, a complete reinvention of what football could be and he was its maestro.

 

[Withdean11]

Messi has not 'done it on a cold, wet and windy night in Stoke'. Ronaldo has.

 

[leigull]

But Messi is a beautiful footballer. He is football. He's football at it's best if you ask me.

I go along with this. Ronaldo is almost a robotic footballer to me, lots of speed, strength and power in straight lines. Messi is just so much more stylish, classy and as you say, beautiful to watch.