You don't seem to realise that we are subsidising them to this day, only now, the subsidy ends up underwriting the profits of the operating companies.
Rail subsidy per passenger mile - Publications - Department for Transport
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Is it time to bring the rip off railways back into public ownership?
- Thread starter Dandyman
- Start date
You don't seem to realise that we are subsidising them to this day, only now, the subsidy ends up underwriting the profits of the operating companies.
Rail subsidy per passenger mile - Publications - Department for Transport
Beach Hut
Brighton Bhuna Boy
Absolutely not, my wages have shot up since privatisation
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Uter
Well-known member
I think the subject of ownership is a bit of a red herring. I suppose replacing franchises with not for profit companies as they come up for renewal might be worth considering, but really good management, customer focus and investment are far far more important. There are good privately owned TOCs and poor state owned TOCs just as there are poor privately owned TOCs and good state owned TOCs.
Besides which, I suspect the days of huge monolithic state owned railways are numbered. It's only a matter of time before they catch the attention of European anti competition legislators.
Besides which, I suspect the days of huge monolithic state owned railways are numbered. It's only a matter of time before they catch the attention of European anti competition legislators.
HawkTheSeagull
New member
Agree with this, i mean companies like C2C, Virgin and SWT are fairly good companies with the good points you mentioned, but then you have Southeastern, Northern and the old East Coast/East Anglia - all are/were poor companies.
Not-for-profit would be good though, not far off what is currently happening for East Coast which has improved it significantly. But who would run a not-for profit company ?
Uter
Well-known member
The government would effectively have to create new not for profit companies like East Coast and Network Rail.
If we stick with private franchises then they need to be longer and linked to investment commitments. Chiltern (incidentally owned by Deutsche Bahn) have a 20 year franchise and the Evergreen investment programme which has and will further transform the line.
In the state owned corner we have London Overground who have transformed surface rail in London. They have expressed an interest in taking over franchises around London. This would be an interesting move but won't go down well in the Dft.
clapham_gull
Legacy Fan
- Aug 20, 2003
- 25,877
..and the sandwiches.
Public ownership can and does work in the majority of European countries but this country has had a transport policy based on road transport for years which has a huge impact on the railways until the focus changes from roads to public transport the railways will always be a budget black hole. Much as I would like to see the railways back in public ownership it would cost a fortune which the tax payer will have to fund.
Meade's Ball
Well-known member
I had an ooong face for the 15 minutes or so i was reading the defence minister decide that maybe private companies aren't always the models to follow thanks to G4S being a blinking disgrace in the Olympics. Catch up, you right royal pricks, and learn how to put a system together that is government-run but not completely unprofessional. Private firms have not an ounce of care for any of us and know full well even when their reputations are very slightly muddied they won't die out and still manage to pay major shareholders a sickening amount each year by doing everything on the cheap. High speed trains affordable for all to enable us to get around, get an idea of Britain as a whole rather than in our closed-off shrinking community ways. We shouldn't be in a situation to know everywhere we'll travel about 4 months in advance just to pick up affordable train tickets.
I'm gonna buy a horse and carriage and a cannon.
I'm gonna buy a horse and carriage and a cannon.
Czechmate
Well-known member
G4 have been going for years , and there record is not that good but it's a big company and that's what the government likes , with health and safety and all that shit , the uttilities should be nationalised and so the UK transport . It 's all come from Maggie Thatcher and the tories many years ago , i liked her at the time till she went mental near the end but now realise she hadn't a clue .
West Hoathly Seagull
Honorary Ruffian
I said no, because I don't think it would make any difference. It's been the policy of both parties (since 2004) to make the fare payer pay more and the taxpayer less. This is not a party political point - Germany, which is Conservative (CDU) controlled, can still manage to run a superb, well subsidised system, publicly owned, while many of the railways in Switzerland are private, but timetables are written by the state railway. Saying that, I think the privatisation was a complete bodge job, and I say that as a lifetime Conservative. I would not have done it - BR was one of the most efficient railways anywhere in Europe, but if it had to be done, I would have gone for BR PLC.
.....and Pete Waterman (but there again, HE can afford to travel by train!)
Lord Bracknell
On fire
The rail fares that will increase by RPI+3% are, of course, "regulated fares", set by the government to pursue government objectives. It's those objectives that people should be questioning.
Beach Hut
Brighton Bhuna Boy
Rail fares are pricing people out of work now which is bloody stupid in my view. However work methods have changed as more people work from home therefore less season tickets sold.
Beach Hut
Brighton Bhuna Boy
Err............
SR and FCC both run trains on the same route as does LM and Virgin - hardly a monopoly
User removed 4
New member
The railways were an embarassing shambles when they were publically owned as well, so dont try to hark back to the halcyon days of clean efficient trains running on time, because it didnt happen.
However what both labour and tory governments just cant seem to grasp , is that it's virtually impossible to run a profitable rail service at reasonable prices , even the yanks who are notoriously averse to subsidies have to do so with amtrak, i'm pretty sure the europeans do as well, while i'd be happy to see the railways nationalised again, it comes with a proviso that efficiency is paramount, I wouldn't want to swap lining the pockets of foreign shareholders , for paying the wages of lazy , poorly motivated rail staff.
User removed 4
New member
we're taxed up to the eyeballs already.
Me and you maybe, but many tax dodging individuals and businesses are taking the piss.
Lord Bracknell
On fire
Interesting to see the transfer of the West Coast Mainline franchise from Virgin to Worst Group, announced today, being described by the Government as "the best deal for the taxpayer". The interests of the rail passenger (or the wider transport-using community) don't seem to get a look in any more.