[Politics] Is it time for the UK to become a republic?

[rogersix]

just seen king charles swearing at a pen on the news, some ink got on his finger and he was very upset.

i wonder how much that pen cost

 

[Machiavelli]

Yes, after this week and the selfish way we are being forced to put our lives on hold, I’m now firmly in the republic camp.

Centre Parcs are kicking out all their residents on Monday. The cycling body has issued a diktat to all cyclists not to take their bike out on Monday. Morrisons is turning its till bleep down (perhaps they could turn off their 'unexplained item in the bagging area' feature?).

 

[clapham_gull]

EV doing a trip from London to Edinburgh! How many have got that sort of range?

Why not complain about a C12 Globemaster flying south with just a coffin and half a dozen passengers?

Because sensibly and pragmatically (without blind deference clouding my judgement) I can see the difference between the need to transport the coffin of the Monarch back to London and the hypocrisy of Charles.

I'm sorry. At the centre of the sustainable transport debate is the use of domestic flights, particularly private ones and he has spent decades preaching to everyone about the environment.

Like his father he has also dipped in the "over population" debate when those Charles is annoyed about just being alive have a minimal carbon footprint compared to his own.

That said it shouldn't surprise anyone.

He's often guilty of token personal environmental decisions seemingly needing them to align with his lifestyle first.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Whilst the vast majority of the population get on with their lives, don't be fooled by what has become mainly a media event that people are responding to, not directly the death of a Monarch.

What I've witnessed over the last few days isn't something timeless, but rather the inevitable conclusion of the Royal Family allowing themselves to rebranded as celebrities and everything that goes with it.

There is something quite "gogglebox" about the whole thing when the Palace have to send out a message to stop people leaving marmalade sandwiches outside Buckingham Palace.

It's also leads to clichés from commentators, a particular one suggesting people are "part of history" if being there. As if blanket media coverage isn't enough, that goes full circle to suggest the media coverage is unreal and if you really want to experience it you should get the Tube to Green Park.

Sorry but I don’t agree, just feels like you aren’t bothered, which is your prerogative (and of course you don’t have to watch).

This is a once in a lifetime event, one of the greatest monarchs of all time has passed away….. significant I would say, with justifiable levels of coverage.

For those that don’t agree, don’t worry it will be over soon and Pointless will be back on…..

 

[Goldstone1976]

That amount of distance between cousins is almost neglible whereas Prince Philip was related more closely to him.

An uncle is of course a lot more closely related than a second cousin once removed; I’m not disputing that. What I’m disputing is that you asserted that the BBC were incorrect to say that QEII and Mountbatten were cousins. You are simply wrong - they were.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Centre Parcs are kicking out all their residents on Monday. The cycling body has issued a diktat to all cyclists not to take their bike out on Monday. Morrisons is turning its till bleep down (perhaps they could turn off their 'unexplained item in the bagging area' feature?).

As with most people I could care less what people decide to do to mourn, it’s a personal choice

What I do have an issue with is being told what we have to do when it ends up costing us money.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

As with most people I could care less what people decide to do to mourn, it’s a personal choice

What I do have an issue with is being told what we have to do when it ends up costing us money.

That’s life in Britain. Two things are certainties death and taxes.

 

[clapham_gull]

Sorry but I don’t agree.

Which is fine, but many would agree with me too and that's the issue.

Rather than the cohesive force we are led to believe The Royal Family are, their existence (or primarily that of an unelected Head of State) is an issue that is becoming more divisive, both here and across the Commonwealth.

It's a real dilemma for them.

 

[Weststander]

Whilst the vast majority of the population get on with their lives, don't be fooled by what has become mainly a media event that people are responding to, not directly the death of a Monarch.

What I've witnessed over the last few days isn't something timeless, but rather the inevitable conclusion of the Royal Family allowing themselves to rebranded as celebrities and everything that goes with it.

There is something quite "gogglebox" about the whole thing when the Palace have to send out a message to stop people leaving marmalade sandwiches outside Buckingham Palace.

It's also leads to clichés from commentators, a particular one suggesting people are "part of history" if being there. As if blanket media coverage isn't enough, that goes full circle to suggest the media coverage is unreal and if you really want to experience it you should get the Tube to Green Park.

I’d come to the conclusion over a period of time that the UK would evolve to a republic once QE2 passed away.

Even putting the entire media just now to one side, I’ve been stunned by the vast numbers of younger people (kids to thirties) showing their affection for the royals. Completely, taken aback, I read the room wrong.

It reminds me of the 2019GE. Friends/associates who were Corbynistas, also concerned other friends who were centre right, all thought Corbyn was heading to no 10 (even if it meant in a coalition). How wrong they all were.

Another lesson to me that the mood music in social media is completely unrepresentative of the wider population. Perhaps 50m people or more don’t do political online?

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Which is fine, but many would agree with me too and that's the issue.

Rather than the cohesive force we are led to believe The Royal Family are, their existence (or primarily that of an unelected Head of State) is an issue that is becoming more divisive, both here and across the Commonwealth.

It's a real dilemma for them.

Not really, ignoring the NSC poll which is artificially close, the vast majority of the Commonwealth treasure the Royal Family. This country, I accept is closer than previous, but we are a million miles away from being a republic.

 

[Bakero]

Not really, ignoring the NSC poll which is artificially close, the vast majority of the Commonwealth treasure the Royal Family. This country, I accept is closer than previous, but we are a million miles away from being a republic.

I don't disagree that the UK is a long way off becoming a republic for various reasons but I'm not sure how beloved the Royal Family is elsewhere.

Aren't multiple Commonwealth Realms planning referendums to ditch the monarchy? Just 15 of the 56 members have Charles as head of state as it is.

 

[clapham_gull]

I’ve been stunned by the vast numbers of younger people (kids to thirties) showing their affection for the royals. Completely, taken aback, I read the room wrong.

I'm not surprised to be honest, this is a huge media event globally and The Royal Family have become global celebrities, their story in the last few years resembling that of a soap opera.

Definitely not the Queen, but most others have used the press to advance a personal agenda. That agenda being their image in the press, the whole thing being quite cyclic

What I've witnessed over the last few days is the death of a very remarkable woman by anyone's definition, but whose family is viewed by many through the lens of a Celebrity Love Island.

I've had some fascinating conversations over the last few days with those who love the Royals. Most dislike Camilla because of Diana and by extension mistrust Charles. I can't repeat what they think about Meghan.

Royalist or addicted to the "drama" ? I think many confuse the two.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

I don't disagree that the UK is a long way off becoming a republic for various reasons but I'm not sure how beloved the Royal Family is elsewhere.

Aren't multiple Commonwealth Realms planning referendums to ditch the monarchy? Just 15 of the 56 members have Charles as head of state as it is.

True, but remembering membership of the Commonwealth remains voluntary and 54 countries remain. Although not hereditary, all members have unanimously agreed that King Charles should remain its Head…..

Depends how you sell it I suppose

 

[clapham_gull]

Not really, ignoring the NSC poll which is artificially close, the vast majority of the Commonwealth treasure the Royal Family. This country, I accept is closer than previous, but we are a million miles away from being a republic.

We are definitely a million miles away from being a republic, but that is everything to do with our system. It would take years to unravel even if the public supported it.

No Government would take that on, it would be like knocking down a house whilst trying to build the same one at the same time.

As for the other countries that have our Monarch as theirs, you are very wrong I'm afraid. Opinion is changing rapidly and it's relatively easy for them to change their system, particularly when the Head of State is primarily ceremonial and thousands of miles away.

 

[jcdenton08]

I’d come to the conclusion over a period of time that the UK would evolve to a republic once QE2 passed away.

Even putting the entire media just now to one side, I’ve been stunned by the vast numbers of younger people (kids to thirties) showing their affection for the royals. Completely, taken aback, I read the room wrong.

It reminds me of the 2019GE. Friends/associates who were Corbynistas, also concerned other friends who were centre right, all thought Corbyn was heading to no 10 (even if it meant in a coalition). How wrong they all were.

Another lesson to me that the mood music in social media is completely unrepresentative of the wider population. Perhaps 50m people or more don’t do political online?

Absolutely, and I respect you a lot for recognising it.

The silent majority exist.

Rule of thumb is that if someone isn’t shouting from the rooftops about a political issue, they feel the opposite to the quality social media vogue.

When I was finishing my second degree in 2019 at university, naturally I was surrounded by younger people in an echo chamber, being told repeatedly Corbyn is a dead cert for government, social revolution, etc etc. I pointed out one person/one vote, no matter how loudly it’s shouted.

Naturally when he loses, this same echo chamber blames the majority for not taking their view.

Small reference pools, narrow social circles. Not everyone thinks and acts the same, and if someone were say a lifelong Tory voter, they’d keep silent and vote Tory.

The loudest shouter, the one who wants to debate everything and anything, the protestor - they are the outlier and live in an insulated echo chamber of pats on the bum and delusions of revolution. The majority disagree? Well they’re just sheep, they don’t “see what I see”.

 

[Weststander]

I'm not surprised to be honest, this is a huge media event globally and The Royal Family have become global celebrities, their story in the last few years resembling that of a soap opera.

Definitely not the Queen, but most others have used the press to advance a personal agenda. That agenda being their image in the press, the whole thing being quite cyclic

What I've witnessed over the last few days is the death of a very remarkable woman by anyone's definition, but whose family is viewed by many through the lens of a Celebrity Love Island.

I've had some fascinating conversations over the last few days with those who love the Royals. Most dislike Camilla because of Diana and by extension mistrust Charles. I can't repeat what they think about Meghan.

Royalist or addicted to the "drama" ? I think many confuse the two.

I think that’s been the case since Lady Di.

I know you follow the media as ‘a profession’ or sector. I’ve been surprised by affectionate stuff about Charles/William/Kate, almost wall to wall on C4, LBC, Guardian and Independent. The occasional token hour of phone ins about a republic.

Almost as if they don’t want to receive a near fatal blow by dissenting from the universal love, from the big majority feeling patriotic right now.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

The cycling body has issued a diktat to all cyclists not to take their bike out on Monday. .

What!?

I'm definitely going out on my bike. Have you got a link to this ridiculous diktat?

 

[jcdenton08]

You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

“A diktat (from German: Diktat, [dɪkˈtaːt]) is a statute, harsh penalty or settlement imposed upon a defeated party by the victor, or a dogmatic decree.”

 

[Weststander]

Absolutely, and I respect you a lot for recognising it.

The silent majority exist.

Rule of thumb is that if someone isn’t shouting from the rooftops about a political issue, they feel the opposite to the quality social media vogue.

When I was finishing my second degree in 2019 at university, naturally I was surrounded by younger people in an echo chamber, being told repeatedly Corbyn is a dead cert for government, social revolution, etc etc. I pointed out one person/one vote, no matter how loudly it’s shouted.

Naturally when he loses, this same echo chamber blames the majority for not taking their view.

Small reference pools, narrow social circles. Not everyone thinks and acts the same, and if someone were say a lifelong Tory voter, they’d keep silent and vote Tory.

The loudest shouter, the one who wants to debate everything and anything, the protestor - they are the outlier and live in an insulated echo chamber of pats on the bum and delusions of revolution. The majority disagree? Well they’re just sheep, they don’t “see what I see”.

It’s interesting recognising and knowing this truth.

Through my work I’ve literally worked with and met probably 100’s of widely different folk across SE England and beyond, plus through interests. I get to hear what folk say.

I think there was someone here who once said they’d never knowingly met a Brexiteer and they wouldn’t want to. I enjoy hearing a mix of views.

A couple days after the 2019GE I went to a yoga class in Brighton, in the changing room was a 60 year old bloke who was furious, forcing his views on two nodding punters. He was a devout Corbynista and simply couldn’t believe the result because “Everyone he knew loved Corbyn and Momentum”.

I assume that he permanently lives in a hard left echo chamber and won’t entertain any other opinion!

Probably the same amongst families/mates who adore Farage.

 

[jcdenton08]

Yes, after this week and the selfish way we are being forced to put our lives on hold, I’m now firmly in the republic camp.

But my point, as per the above post, is that you really don’t matter. Your inconvenience for a week or so is of no interest to the majority, not the social media echo chamber.

You wanting a Republic is your right, as is anybody else’s to support anything provided it is lawful.

Doesn’t change a thing. Doesn’t matter.