Is it "socially unjust" to charge young students for their university education?

[Ernest]

I think the useless degrees like 'media studies' and crap like that should be paid for whereas the serious stuff like the sciences and engineering should be free and students should be encouraged to study for them , if not where are the Doctors etc in the future coming from ?

 

[northernseagull]

Being one of those lumped with the hiked up £3k tuition fees (thankfully I'd graduated by the time £9k was introduced!) I'd say its completely unjust. Not only do I enter a society where house prices and rental prices are astronomic, I'm facing a repayment of student debt of £20k+... thats no way to repay students and young professionals who want to add something to society.

 

[Diego Napier]

It's my understanding that in England the universities have always charged for education it's just that our government used to pay for it.
The way it is now students still get it paid for at the time of education but they now leave with a mountain of debt, albeit debt they don't have to pay back until they earn over a certain threshold.
So it is arguably not especially prohibitive at the time of earning your degree.

Now of course universities have to spend untold amounts on marketing departments and staff to recruit students as they are now not only courting talented students but trying to get them to spend money. Universities now have to operate as a business. In my book that's a lose/lose situation for everyone.
I would argue that the cost of living is probably more prohibitive than university fees. Although I firmly believe the government and the taxpayer should pay for people's university education as it is an investment in all our futures. A well educated population equals a productive, innovative country that is less reliant on migrant skills. Pretty hard to argue against that whichever side of the political spectrum you hang your knickers on.

As for useless degrees that just comes down to opinion. Some would argue the more artistic degrees are useless but as Churchill himself said when being told he has to scrap the culture budget to find the war.....
"Then what the Hell are we fighting it for?!"

Good post.

 

[GreersElbow]

No. Who else is going to pay for it? The rest of us hardworking people? No chance. Stump up or get a job.

Umm where do you think tuition fee loans come from?

 

[BigGully]

Having a wife that went to university as a mature student and had to pay and then my eldest Son also going to university and had to pay, it would be nice to let someone else take the financial hit, but I cannot see why others that opt for a different career/employment pathway should somehow pick up the tab for the choice which they have made.

A choice by the way that we are told will offer greater earning potential and career prospects, its a typical left wing misunderstanding of financial consequence.

 

[Kuipers Supporters Club]

I think the useless degrees like 'media studies' and crap like that should be paid for whereas the serious stuff like the sciences and engineering should be free and students should be encouraged to study for them , if not where are the Doctors etc in the future coming from ?

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/re...ion-fees-for-five-non-arts-subjects-1-6689363

A first time for everything - supporting a UKIP policy.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

I don't think it unreasonable that the student themselves contributes to the overall cost given they will gain from it. Equally some of the cost should be bourne by the taxpayer becaue as a society we all benefit from an educated workforce and the tax they pay is likely to be more. It certainly shouldn't be free to the student though. Then again, I still believe uni should be for the educational elite and not for any Tom, Dick or Harriet who decides they want a three year piss up.

 

[Kuipers Supporters Club]

Being one of those lumped with the hiked up £3k tuition fees (thankfully I'd graduated by the time £9k was introduced!) I'd say its completely unjust. Not only do I enter a society where house prices and rental prices are astronomic, I'm facing a repayment of student debt of £20k+... thats no way to repay students and young professionals who want to add something to society.

Really, it's just another bit of tax on your earnings - which you wont even notice when you earn a wedge anyway - which you are able to get having gone to Uni.

 

[BigGully]

Being one of those lumped with the hiked up £3k tuition fees (thankfully I'd graduated by the time £9k was introduced!) I'd say its completely unjust. Not only do I enter a society where house prices and rental prices are astronomic, I'm facing a repayment of student debt of £20k+... thats no way to repay students and young professionals who want to add something to society.

I fear that you will will be one of those that go from school to college to university and a public sector job and become a union activist and want everyone else to pay for anything you choose to do, you will only see an unjust society, why not get stuck in with your degree, then use it wisely, work hard and pay for your stuff.

 

[Notters]

After all, the graduate will (in all probability) earn a lot more over the course of their working life.

...and if they do, the system works, and they will pay a lot more tax, thus funding their education.

It's a big YES from me.

 

[pb21]

I don’t think it’s socially unjust to charge. I went to university when the fees were approximately £1,000 per year, which I think is a fair amount to contribute.
I also disagree with those differentiating between the science and art subjects, they are both just as important IMO.

 

[northernseagull]

I fear that you will will be one of those that go from school to college to university and a public sector job and become a union activist and want everyone else to pay for anything you choose to do, you will only see an unjust society, why not get stuck in with your degree, then use it wisely, work hard and pay for your stuff.

Do you fear a lot of things in life? You sound like a worrier... such an obnoxious post.

 

[BigGully]

Do you fear a lot of things in life? You sound like a worrier... such an obnoxious post.

It was a little tongue in cheek, I have no view on what you might do other than what my family has done, research and assess its worth and if you still wish to go to university go and earn your degree, then on the other side try to find the career that made your decision to attend uni in the first place worthwhile.

It is difficult to guarantee anything in the longer term these days, but with a decent degree you should gain some advantage in the workplace and you might find a decent salary and hopefully a fulfilling career , just pay your dues and dont expect others to pay it for you.

 

[GT49er]

The real problem lies not with student loans and tuition fees (though I'm totally against both) but with the daft idea, which I think was the Labour government's, that it should aim for, what was it, 70 or 75%? of people going to university. Now every tin-pot art or catering college in the land is calling itself a university and offering degrees to almost anyone in almost any useless subject. Now I loved the Beatles, but a degree in the Beatles? Come on! And yes, there really is one.
University education should be free to UK young people - but only to those who work hard and achieve high enough standards in secondary education. Vocational courses and apprenticeships are more appropriate for those who don't - or dare I say it, a real job .......

 

[Baldseagull]

...and if they do, the system works, and they will pay a lot more tax, thus funding their education.

It's a big YES from me.

Or they will be part of the half million people emigrating from this country every year, but don't worry because half a million under educated migrants are coming the other way.

 

[northernseagull]

It was a little tongue in cheek, I have no view on what you might do other than what my family has done, research and assess its worth and if you still wish to go to university go and earn your degree, then on the other side try to find the career that made your decision to attend uni in the first place worthwhile.

It is difficult to guarantee anything in the longer term these days, but with a decent degree you should gain some advantage in the workplace and you might find a decent salary and hopefully a fulfilling career , just pay your dues and dont expect others to pay it for you.

Personally I felt your post was a complete generalisation of a segment of today's society. I contribute towards the repayments of my debt, but I find the quantifying amounts of my debt to be largely unsustainable and as the post asked.. unjust. How is it right that young adults before they've even earnt a decent first salary are lumped with debt because they want to learn and contribute towards the society we live in. Compare this to other generations...cheap housing and free education. Or compare it Scotland, free education full stop...

I'm not suggesting for a second that society shouldn't contribute towards its own personal development, merely not cripple society with debt before they've even set foot on the professional doorstep.

 

[Baldseagull]

I think free education to A-level is far enough. Beyond that, pay.

 

[dazzer6666]

Uni is free in Scotland - for Scottish students. Mostly paid for by English taxes of course. English students in Scotland are 'foreign' and have to pay........

 

[Baldseagull]

Personally I felt your post was a complete generalisation of a segment of today's society. I contribute towards the repayments of my debt, but I find the quantifying amounts of my debt to be largely unsustainable and as the post asked.. unjust. How is it right that young adults before they've even earnt a decent first salary are lumped with debt because they want to learn and contribute towards the society we live in. Compare this to other generations...cheap housing and free education. Or compare it Scotland, free education full stop...

I'm not suggesting for a second that society shouldn't contribute towards its own personal development, merely not cripple society with debt before they've even set foot on the professional doorstep.

No one forced you to go to University did they?
Yep the good old days of free Uni, jobs for life and cheap housing, when only the top few percent could get in. You probably would not have made the cut (statistically), at least you have had access to cheap loans to be able to go. University was just not an option for 90 percent of school leavers in the good old days.
As you mention other generations, I have to point out that one of the reasons we are potless today, is the generosity of the past, particularly pensions.

 

[Baldseagull]

Uni is free in Scotland - for Scottish students. Mostly paid for by English taxes of course. English students in Scotland are 'foreign' and have to pay........

If you are from anywhere else in Europe it is free in Scotland, just not for English and Welsh.