[Albion] Is Graham Potter overrated as a Premier League manager?

[Bold Seagull]

Not really much to quibble with there but did we actually attack fast?

Comfortably the fastest attack of the day was Pukki sending Dunk and setting up the winner.
Thankfully they were worse than us.

I didn't see anything today that suggested our 'fast break' caught Norwich out of position.


Of the bazillion blazes over had they all been lower they would have hit a Norwich player.

They caught us piling forward which they never did. We did have some nice flowing one touch faster moves, not many but they happened. I couldn’t quibble that ample chances to win a game of football were created - I honestly don’t know what you’d change tactically when you’ve had 30 attempts on goal and a penalty, only thing I can think of is different players!

 

[warmleyseagull]

only thing I can think of is different players!

This. Potter cannot be faulted for having inadequate players. He talks a lot about performance (again today) because that is all he can say publicly, but did let slip last time about ‘lack of quality’ when questioned about lack of goals. Think Dean Smith and Claudio Ranieri and Frank Lampard; none have polished their respective inherited turds.

I am already worried that TB thinks a guy who scores for fun in Belgium will be enough of an answer next season; would hope AJ and Locadia from a better League but dismal failures would disabuse that notion.

 

[Stat Brother]

They caught us piling forward which they never did. We did have some nice flowing one touch faster moves, not many but they happened. I couldn’t quibble that ample chances to win a game of football were created - I honestly don’t know what you’d change tactically when you’ve had 30 attempts on goal and a penalty, only thing I can think of is different players!

Neither do I as 'just do it quicker' really isn't an answer.

Trossard loves one more touch.
They all love (or are coached) into one more pass.
Sanchez doesn't release the full backs.
March is released by Sanchez but cuts back.

All of today's shots were in front of the defence.
Many in front of the defence and midfield.

Do you honestly think the goal was coming?
Or do you think the 'there now' cliche applies.

Were it not for his save from Veltman what actually did Krull do today?

30 shots tells one story.
1 great save tells the other.

 

[Pavilionaire]

I don't think we will be able to judge Potter until he is able to work with a decent, fit striker. Going into this season with just Maupay, Welbeck, Connolly and Locadia was a disaster waiting to happen, and so it has proved.

When Maupay rightly got subbed there was no proper striker option from the bench. Even Burnley have better options in Cornet Weghorst, Rodriguez, Barnes and Vydra.

 

[Bold Seagull]

This. Potter cannot be faulted for having inadequate players. He talks a lot about performance (again today) because that is all he can say publicly, but did let slip last time about ‘lack of quality’ when questioned about lack of goals. Think Dean Smith and Claudio Ranieri and Frank Lampard; none have polished their respective inherited turds.

I am already worried that TB thinks a guy who scores for fun in Belgium will be enough of an answer next season; would hope AJ and Locadia from a better League but dismal failures would disabuse that notion.

Brentford struggling for goals they take a punt on Eriksen; he has 2 and a couple of assists. Villa get in Courtinho, and have Ings and Watkins. Southampton got Broja on loan. You’ve got to keep evolving, putting pressure on players. Trossard doesn’t look like he’s playing with pressure of losing his place.

Earlier in the season we were overachieving and you can’t really do that over an entire season - very few teams do. 8 games we’re 3 pts off 9th after a poor run. The club make programme notes and statements about ambition - but January was proof of where our ambition is and that’s survival. The rest is lip service. Squad is running on empty and we have few options to turn to.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Neither do I as 'just do it quicker' really isn't an answer.

Trossard loves one more touch.
They all love (or are coached) into one more pass.
Sanchez doesn't release the full backs.
March is released by Sanchez but cuts back.

All of today's shots were in front of the defence.
Many in front of the defence and midfield.

Do you honestly think the goal was coming?
Or do you think the 'there now' cliche applies.

Were it not for his save from Veltman what actually did Krull do today?

30 shots tells one story.
1 great save tells the other.

Watch MotD and you’ll see many tougher chances turned into goals.

Substitute MacA with Ward-Prowse today and the Saints man is likely taking the match ball home.

I don’t buy this quality of chances wasn’t good enough. The story of Krul only making one top drawer save confirms only that our finishing was awful.

 

[Bold Seagull]

I don't think we will be able to judge Potter until he is able to work with a decent, fit striker. Going into this season with just Maupay, Welbeck, Connolly and Locadia was a disaster waiting to happen, and so it has proved.

When Maupay rightly got subbed there was no proper striker option from the bench. Even Burnley have better options in Cornet Weghorst, Rodriguez, Barnes and Vydra.

We’re in big trouble if we start to think it’s only a striker we need. We need goals, no one in our team can shoot. Seriously decent chances without much pressure for Lamptey, March, MacA, Trossard, Maupay, Welbeck, Gross - none of them hit the target. Some of these were in the box no real pressure or closing down just hit the target chances.

We need to be scouting players that have scoring stats not hoping they ‘might improve’ once we bring them here.

 

[A1X]

Yes. Decent managers don’t get beaten the same way every week.

 

[Pavilionaire]

We’re in big trouble if we start to think it’s only a striker we need. We need goals, no one in our team can shoot. Seriously decent chances without much pressure for Lamptey, March, MacA, Trossard, Maupay, Welbeck, Gross - none of them hit the target. Some of these were in the box no real pressure or closing down just hit the target chances.

We need to be scouting players that have scoring stats not hoping they ‘might improve’ once we bring them here.

That's not what I said. The thread is about Potter, we have given him a decent keeper, decent defenders and midfielders and they have done well in the 3 seasons he's had, but the same cannot be said for any of the strikers.

I believe that had Potter had the Glenn Murray of 4 years ago we'd be safe already and in the top half. Yes we need more cover at CB and RB but it is lack of goals and wasted chances that is killing us and sapping the confidence of players and fans alike. Undav will help but he is not the answer.

Sell Bissouma, bring in a player that can get on the end of a cross and show composure in front of goal, then we'll see whether Potter can deliver Bloom's top 10 finish.

 

[usernamed]

Was at the match today and enjoyed some of our football, but I felt that our hospitality extended to waiting until Norwich had everyone back and in position before beginning our attacks.

Our line-up looked really attacking, we picked a team to win the game, and I thought in terms of play we bossed both halves.

Having said that, we can’t score goals. The same players can score goals on international duty or when playing for other clubs, so the way the club approaches coaching the first team around attacking play needs rethinking, taking the pace, strength and skill of Premier League opposition into account.

Allowing the opposition time to set themselves up defensively makes scoring in the Premier League incredibly difficult. We give opposition defences that time, and they know how to soak up our attacks.

Graham Potter is lauded as a forward thinking, adaptable coach. Can we have the benefit of this adaptability in a complete rethink of our attacking play please?

I don’t know if we need new coaching staff, or new playing staff, or both, or neither, but if we can’t fix this, it will end up getting GP the sack, when there’s an awful lot he does right.

 

[Swansman]

Was at the match today and enjoyed some of our football, but I felt that our hospitality extended to waiting until Norwich had everyone back and in position before beginning our attacks.

Our line-up looked really attacking, we picked a team to win the game, and I thought in terms of play we bossed both halves.

Having said that, we can’t score goals. The same players can score goals on international duty or when playing for other clubs, so the way the club approaches coaching the first team around attacking play needs rethinking, taking the pace, strength and skill of Premier League opposition into account.

Allowing the opposition time to set themselves up defensively makes scoring in the Premier League incredibly difficult. We give opposition defences that time, and they know how to soak up our attacks.

Graham Potter is lauded as a forward thinking, adaptable coach. Can we have the benefit of this adaptability in a complete rethink of our attacking play please?

I don’t know if we need new coaching staff, or new playing staff, or both, or neither, but if we can’t fix this, it will end up getting GP the sack, when there’s an awful lot he does right.

Never understood this argument. Just because you - like Trossard - can score a goal against Benin and two against Belarus doesnt mean you can do the same thing in the Premier League. This isnt League One or Two, every PL team is better than all but 15 or so national teams.

 

[Frankworthington]

Totally clueless

I lost interest yesterday as soon as the team was announced

In the name of God man go!!

 

[Guinness Boy]

I’m 100% behind change the players, I think we’ve got a bang average squad of players that are, for the right affectionate reasons, over rated as players by the fans.

And I actually think we already have a pragmatic manager as he gets the maximum possible from this set of players. 13th place with 8 games to go and playing good football is as good as it can get with this squad.

13th is overachieving (I went for a range of 14th to 17th in my pre-season prediction post I think). Given we have Arsenal, Spurs and City away in the next three games we won't be staying there, especially when we've scored one goal in seven games. And we are certainly not playing good football at the moment. Burnley was awful, Villa was awful and yesterday was "put it on Grant Hanley or stick it in the stands".

Let's see where we are at the end of the season as I'm sure TB will not and probably cannot change anything before then.

Nah. We did alright earlier in the season playing bright attractive football. Hard words will be had, I am sure, at board level. My guess is that Tony will prefer to give him more money than bring in the latest clone of Big Sam, Dyche, Sparkie or Roy. Or Hughton. I hope so, anyway. Keep the phenotype.

Edit and I know they are top six, but they have spent like Viv Nichols and they are still basically shit, with no phenotype. Manchester United I mean

And by pragmatic, in reply to both of you, I don't mean Big Sam or any of the other lazy stereotypes. I give you (again) Steve Cooper who did better than Potter at Swansea and transformed a dreadful Forest squad. I give you Stevie G, novice coach who out thought Potter twice because he was more interested in getting the three points than a passing vanity project. Yes, he had Coutinho in the second of those games but other players to out do us in those matches include Watkins, Cash and the bang average Mings.

 

[Reddleman]

13th is overachieving (I went for a range of 14th to 17th in my pre-season prediction post I think). Given we have Arsenal, Spurs and City away in the next three games we won't be staying there, especially when we've scored one goal in seven games. And we are certainly not playing good football at the moment. Burnley was awful, Villa was awful and yesterday was "put it on Grant Hanley or stick it in the stands".

Let's see where we are at the end of the season as I'm sure TB will not and probably cannot change anything before then.



And by pragmatic, in reply to both of you, I don't mean Big Sam or any of the other lazy stereotypes. I give you (again) Steve Cooper who did better than Potter at Swansea and transformed a dreadful Forest squad. I give you Stevie G, novice coach who out thought Potter twice because he was more interested in getting the three points than a passing vanity project. Yes, he had Coutinho in the second of those games but other players to out do us in those matches include Watkins, Cash and the bang average Mings.

You totally undermined yourself with your Gerrard point. Villa are two points better off than us despite him adding Coutinho and Digne in January. They also have Watkins who despite your dig is a far better striker than we have on the books, they also have Ings. Give Potter Watkins and Ings and I guarantee you we finish above Villa.

 

[Icy Gull]

You totally undermined yourself with your Gerrard point. Villa are two points better off than us despite him adding Coutinho and Digne in January. They also have Watkins who despite your dig is a far better striker than we have on the books, they also have Ings. Give Potter Watkins and Ings and I guarantee you we finish above Villa.

I suggest you may be wasting your time.

Some, as you will see from the comments after every defeat regardless of chances created, will blame the manager, others will be pissed off and worried but accept that the main reason for where we are is down to our paucity of goal scorers with PL quality.

There is no definitive correct answer though, although imo the season swung in the second half against United. A team brimming with confidence has morphed into one with none

 

[BadFish]

Never comfortable with under and over rated he is what he is. Needs to arrest this run of form though. Not sure he will still be with us at the beginning of next season if he doesn't.

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[saafend_seagull]

I would be quite happy having 30 shots and dominating every game to be honest, we are bound to score sooner or later with even half the attempts

27 of the shots were aimless from outside the box.

Said it many times GP is overrated. He plays way too defensive for any big club to go near him.


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[saafend_seagull]

I don't think we will be able to judge Potter until he is able to work with a decent, fit striker. Going into this season with just Maupay, Welbeck, Connolly and Locadia was a disaster waiting to happen, and so it has proved.

When Maupay rightly got subbed there was no proper striker option from the bench. Even Burnley have better options in Cornet Weghorst, Rodriguez, Barnes and Vydra.

Burnley cant score either? Lol.


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[Bold Seagull]

27 of the shots were aimless from outside the box.

Said it many times GP is overrated. He plays way too defensive for any big club to go near him.


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According to WhoScored, and with my own eyes, 55% of our shots were inside the box, so that was 17 of them. That leaves 13 of them from outside.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

I’m 100% behind change the players, I think we’ve got a bang average squad of players that are, for the right affectionate reasons, over rated as players by the fans.

And I actually think we already have a pragmatic manager as he gets the maximum possible from this set of players. 13th place with 8 games to go and playing good football is as good as it can get with this squad.

Very true.

He can only work and improve with what he’s got.

Potter set us up perfectly for this fixture and we dominated from the outset, a testament to though (me included) who were worried about a Norwich performance, there wasn’t one


His set up allowed for 31 attempts on goal and we were in full control of the match, the players take the full responsibility for converting

People often talk about XG and I agree this doesn’t win you games but it importantly shows the blame lies with the players


We need to shift a few this summer and start blooding the talented youth we have acquired, after all this is the model