[Albion] Independent Football Ombudsman rules on Albion fan ban and loyalty points deduction

[dazzer6666]

The strange thing with all of this is that we have a number of 'members' who pay the £30 membership fee who are actually fans from other clubs, mostly in London. I knew of four fans when I was working who were Chelsea, Tottenham, and Palace fans but also paid for memberships to us, so they could buy tickets at the Amex in the home end, and generally kept their allegiances quiet at these games, in order to be able to get to see their teams play away.

For them the £30 membership fees didn't put them off even if they only bought a ticket once a season when their team visited the Amex.

To me this is worse than the issue of the OP on this thread. The club must know that this goes on but if you are a 'paid up member' there's little they can do, unless they misbehave in the home stands.

I know several people who do this………Spuds, Arsenal, Chelsea fans at least. Not all STHs at their ‘big’ clubs, but like to watch the occasional PL game (as a neutral) and obviously use it when ‘their‘ team is at the Amex.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

That's the problem. If there are no restrictions, then you can lend a friend the season ticket and there is the chance that he or she might like the experience so much that they become regular fans and season ticket holders themselves. (There are 2 season ticket holders at Burnley who can trace their interest to me lending one of them a ticket.) Or you can lend the ticket to random strangers or sell it on.

Clearly Brighton believe the problem of the second sort of transfer is so great that they are willing to stop the first sort of transfer. Because certainly, if I understand the rules correctly, it would cost £50 to lend a ticket to a friend under the club rules (£20 for ticket transfer, £30 registration fee as a supporter) and there is no way my friend would have paid that.

If and when you can't sell out the ground, where will the replacement fans come from?

We are talking about an away ticket at Wolves. It’s not about selling out the Amex.

 

[dsr-burnley]

We are talking about an away ticket at Wolves. It’s not about selling out the Amex.

The post I was quoting was talking about home season tickets.

 

[El Presidente]

Yep, the family have embarrassed themselves trying to claim the moral high ground when found out trying to cheat the system. If this practice can be stopped then fans lower down the tiers will have a better chance of buying tickets. That’s the end game here.

“The family” was in fact the son who did it behind his dad’s back.

The dad was furious with him and has made that clear.

We have all done stupid things when young, you excepted presumably by your judgemental tone.

A bollocking and a warning that if done again would result in a ban would have worked far better

 

[Giraffe]

So whilst I agree that it has generally stopped some buying tickets with the intention of taking others I suspect it has stopped more from going when the original purchaser couldn’t go. It has certainly happened to us this season that one of us couldn’t go and normally we would have passed it to a mate but can’t now. You have to buy the ticket so far in advance for away games generally that inevitably plans change and this now means empty seats. Don’t see how that is progress.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

“The family” was in fact the son who did it behind his dad’s back.

The dad was furious with him and has made that clear.

We have all done stupid things when young, you excepted presumably by your judgemental tone.

A bollocking and a warning that if done again would result in a ban would have worked far better

No, I’m not an exception to that. I didn’t moan to an ombudsman though. If you make a bad decision in life you own the responsibility. This is also not all about the family. It’s about other supporters of the Albion who miss out on tickets because some cheat the system. If the club are going to put a stop to this then there has to be consequence. It’s also worth reminding that there was plenty of warning about this crackdown. Giving two chances would have undermined it from the beginning.

 

[El Presidente]

I had a ticket for Wolves, didn’t go due to circumstances, the seat went unoccupied. No winners except for Wolves.

 

[timbha]

I had a ticket for Wolves, didn’t go due to circumstances, the seat went unoccupied. No winners except for Wolves.

Did you get your loyalty points?

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

I had a ticket for Wolves, didn’t go due to circumstances, the seat went unoccupied. No winners except for Wolves.

So there needs to be a digital method for you to transfer the ticket back to the club to resell. We are all agreed on that. However that option does not exist as yet for away tickets at most clubs. So to solve your problem the club could allow you to find someone to occupy the seat, thereby undermining the LP system. Alternatively it it can protect the entire fanbase’s fair access to tickets via LP at the cost of your (and a few other) seats being empty. That’s the choice.

 

[drew]

So whilst I agree that it has generally stopped some buying tickets with the intention of taking others I suspect it has stopped more from going when the original purchaser couldn’t go. It has certainly happened to us this season that one of us couldn’t go and normally we would have passed it to a mate but can’t now. You have to buy the ticket so far in advance for away games generally that inevitably plans change and this now means empty seats. Don’t see how that is progress.

I really don't believe more have stopped going than those breaking the rules. As for buying in advance, it's normally about 4 weeks depending on the will of the tv companies! I'm guessing people would buy theatre tickets or gig tickets further in advance than that.

 

[drew]

They do. Did you not read the post?

Sorry, I should have been clearer, I was referring to your comment suggesting it's your season ticket and you can do with it what you will.

 

[amexer]

I know several people who do this………Spuds, Arsenal, Chelsea fans at least. Not all STHs at their ‘big’ clubs, but like to watch the occasional PL game (as a neutral) and obviously use it when ‘their‘ team is at the Amex.

Getting the £30s was what the sharing scheme was all about.

 

[dazzer6666]

Getting the £30s was what the sharing scheme was all about.

Nothing to do with that for those I know. They’re A+ members so they can buy matchday tickets when they want.

 

[Bozza]

I really don't believe more have stopped going than those breaking the rules. As for buying in advance, it's normally about 4 weeks depending on the will of the tv companies! I'm guessing people would buy theatre tickets or gig tickets further in advance than that.

Indeed.

But you know if you can't attend the gig or show, because someone is ill or something else comes up, you can sell/gift/whatever the ticket(s) to others.

But, to be clear, I'm not suggesting we should be able to freely do that with our football tickets, per my long post a few pages back, I'm just highlighting why it's less of a problem with gigs and shows.

 

[METALMICKY]

It feels like the club will not engage with anything unless there is a profit to be made, even if it’s really bad PR and morally questionable. Sorry if this has been covered but surely the solution is an away ticket exchange providing that for them? No doubt this could be refined - I’m a dunce - but say they take a fiver fee from every away ticket exchanged. The original owner has the points for the game removed and the recipient doesn’t get any points for it. Say this happened for 100 tickets each game over 30 away games in a calendar year = £15k. Surely that would cover the cost of implementing the scheme and the admin each season. Plus fewer empty seats, better ‘customer experience’, fewer ridiculous situations like this etc etc

Is the correct answer!

And on the issue of the club having a Safeguarding officer involved, I like the dad would have been spitting bullets! Having worked for social services I have a good appreciation of when it's appropriate.

 

[Stat Brother]

Earlier I reminded Jnr, again, if he tries to be cute with the ticketing system in order to get a mate in, he will get caught, he will get a 10 match ban & he will struggle to get to away games, I'd imagine that's exactly what the club want.


No guarantee he accepted a word of what I said, what with him being an 18 year old weapon of the highest order, but this is life.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Indeed.

But you know if you can't attend the gig or show, because someone is ill or something else comes up, you can sell/gift/whatever the ticket(s) to others.

But, to be clear, I'm not suggesting we should be able to freely do that with our football tickets, per my long post a few pages back, I'm just highlighting why it's less of a problem with gigs and shows.

I don’t think that’s a very good comparison. Gigs and shows are one offs and generally not a part of a LP system with fans potentially attending the same show every week and being rewarded accordingly.

 

[Bozza]

I don’t think that’s a very good comparison. Gigs and shows are one offs and generally not a part of a LP system with fans potentially attending the same show every week and being rewarded accordingly.

Maybe. It wasn't my comparison though - I was merely highlighting the difference between gigs and football matches to someone who did use gigs and shows as a comparison, in that the original purchaser does have an avenue to try and ensure the ticket isn't wasted.

 

[El Presidente]

So there needs to be a digital method for you to transfer the ticket back to the club to resell. We are all agreed on that. However that option does not exist as yet for away tickets at most clubs. So to solve your problem the club could allow you to find someone to occupy the seat, thereby undermining the LP system. Alternatively it it can protect the entire fanbase’s fair access to tickets via LP at the cost of your (and a few other) seats being empty. That’s the choice.

The entire fanbase does not have fair access to tickets as 1901 members can sort them for their mates without any recourse.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

And you might do exactly the same with a home ticket when they go on sale to STH friends


Also remember that 1901 members can pass on their tickets to whoever they choose

If you join the tunnel club you’re allowed to bring in those on banner orders apparently