I want Gustavo Dominguez Poyet back

[symyjym]

You're plan is massively flawed in as much as you failed to mention the not so impressive weekly wage we seem to offer prospective players

It's not my plan and how do you know that Bloom isn't saving now to spend later?

 

[Trelford Mills Guide Dog]

Maybe I'm getting wooshed here but the football we played under Poyet was almost identical to the football we play now. i.e. pedestrian build up and an absence of pace throughout the squad. Only difference this year is it's a tougher league, I wouldnt say we're playing much worse if at all.

Agree - however, it was about this time last season when Gus realised that simply keeping possession and making it difficult for the opposition to score would not be sufficient for us to push on in to the top 6, (as we needed to convert the steady flow of draws in to wins). This led to us throwing more caution to the wind, and winning 9 of our last 17 matches (only losing 2).

Similarly, am hoping Oscar really goes for it in the last 3rd of the season too.

 

[Grombleton]

I used to think it was Liverpool who were the club most stuck in the past.

I was wrong. It's us.

 

[kevo]

I want sexy football again

I'm with you brother.

 

[Creaky]

Wow ..... just wow ! I'm all for keeping an eye and questioning everything TB does but even I, with my most cynical hat on, don't expect TB to fund multi-million pound losses season after season. That way lies disaster.

On the face of it a reasonable statement but of course ignores the fact that TB took on majority ownership by his own choice and has since increased that majority shareholding to the point where he virtually owns the whole club.

When he made those decisions he must have been aware that he was committing himself to years of multi-million pound losses - how many clubs outside the Premier League, (even including the PL!), don't lose millions every year? - if he wasn't going to fund these losses where did he think the money was going to come from?

We are fortunate to have someone like TB who not only is able to satisfy the auditors each year that he is able and willing to cover those losses but has also invested a small fortune to provide the club with a fabulous infrastructure. That however doesn't mean that we shouldn't expect him to fund large losses every year because it is almost certain that in the short to medium term he is going to have to do this and he has essentially committed himself to doing so.

 

[poidy]

On the face of it a reasonable statement but of course ignores the fact that TB took on majority ownership by his own choice and has since increased that majority shareholding to the point where he virtually owns the whole club.

When he made those decisions he must have been aware that he was committing himself to years of multi-million pound losses - how many clubs outside the Premier League, (even including the PL!), don't lose millions every year? - if he wasn't going to fund these losses where did he think the money was going to come from?

We are fortunate to have someone like TB who not only is able to satisfy the auditors each year that he is able and willing to cover those losses but has also invested a small fortune to provide the club with a fabulous infrastructure. That however doesn't mean that we shouldn't expect him to fund large losses every year because it is almost certain that in the short to medium term he is going to have to do this and he has essentially committed himself to doing so.

Of course he has committed himself to it. The academy start up costs will be huge. We won't see a return on that for the foreseeable future and until then the running costs alone will absolutely haemorrhage funds

I wouldn't expect great things in the transfer market until we see this investment coming to fruition

 

[JCL - the new kid in town]

I don't have a copy of his contract no but from what I was told at the time we did yes

At the time we had a league 1 wage structure, of course any new signings would be on championship wage but it doesn't mean it was over budget. Besides you were told by who?

 

[rouseytastic]

At the time we had a league 1 wage structure, of course any new signings would be on championship wage but it doesn't mean it was over budget. Besides you were told by who?

When did I once mention over budget?? I said broke wage structure which as you correctly say was previously lge 1 based.

 

[Seasidesage]

Maybe I do, but we would still be out bid in the market if there was no FFP. It is convenient for us to abide by it and set the bar for the FA to have something to compare other clubs to when dishing out penalties.

That's probably true. Problem I can see us having though is we are going to need to completely change half the team pretty soon. The back four and Calderon are all in their 30's. (One reason why I was not worried about El Abd leaving) Andrews will have to be replaced and we will probably lose the keeper too. I suspect we are going to go backwards a little over the next year to 18 months and I worry that we will start to see that reflected in the attendances.

Many years of supporting this club have taught me the bandwagon nature of the support and if we tread water for awhile I can see us losing quite a bit of support in the short term...

 

[Icy Gull]

Lose or draw on Saturday and I think we'll have the first genuine Oscar out thread with quite a few voting out on my reading of NSC over the last two days....

 

[StanmoreSeagull]

Wingers with pace actually playing on the wing and staying out wide would be a start - i.e. the opposite of the Watford game!

 

[JCL - the new kid in town]

When did I once mention over budget?? I said broke wage structure which as you correctly say was previously lge 1 based.

now that's semantics. You implied by saying we broke our wage structure for CMS that we'd over spent, you may not have actually said it. Buckley probably "broke" our wage structure too and any other players we signed that summer.

And if we haven't gone over budget then there isn't a problem surely? That's what budgets are there for

 

[goldstone]

We played some of the most boring football I have seen under Poyet. All that awful tippy-tappy stuff.

I'm not saying the stuff being dished up at present is much better, but Poyet's style was hardly exciting.

 

[Baldseagull]

When did I once mention over budget?? I said broke wage structure which as you correctly say was previously lge 1 based.

Man, you should just put your hands up and say you were wrong.

 

[British Bulldog]

We played some of the most boring football I have seen under Poyet. All that awful tippy-tappy stuff.

I'm not saying the stuff being dished up at present is much better, but Poyet's style was hardly exciting.

It worked in league 1 but in the Championship it was only after January last year that it started to kick on and produce better football and results but even then it failed at the important time, That's why I don't get people moaning about Oscar when he's only had just over half a season in the job and one injury after another to contend with.

 

[Cowfold Seagull]

You could become a Sunderland supporter...

Good suggestion. Seriously I wonder if there are people out there who support a football manager rather than a football club?, and follow them wherever they go, club to club?


Makes a mental note to self ... buy a Sunderland season ticket next year.

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

Can someone tell me why we haven't spent a penny on transfer fees...Oh yeah because we are still crippled at the debt Poyet spent on wages and fee's before he dropped us all in the shite.....Jesus,,,,you wouldn't want back a partner after finding them on there knees, with a queue of blokes lining up with their strides around their ankles......although some people on here probably would come to think of it.

You realise the manager doesn't even get CLOSE to choosing the wage we pay the players, right?

The manager doesn't even TOUCH the money. If they want a player they are told whether they are allowed them.

Any **** up on money is from the people above. And this isn't pro-poyet. this is pro-manager.

If I was a manager and the chief exec/chairman said "If you want him you can have him" then that's good enough for me. I'd trust that they would know whether we can afford it or not.

By the way, hows your prediction that Poyet would DEFINITELY go down with Sunderland going?

 

[symyjym]

That's probably true. Problem I can see us having though is we are going to need to completely change half the team pretty soon. The back four and Calderon are all in their 30's. (One reason why I was not worried about El Abd leaving) Andrews will have to be replaced and we will probably lose the keeper too. I suspect we are going to go backwards a little over the next year to 18 months and I worry that we will start to see that reflected in the attendances.

Many years of supporting this club have taught me the bandwagon nature of the support and if we tread water for awhile I can see us losing quite a bit of support in the short term...

Yep the defense of Bruno, Calde, Greer and Upson are at the end of their careers and could not compete in the Prem now, but I don't see that as a problem, more of a fixable inevitability. We need two young CB’s to form a new partnership and if Greers and Upsons job next year is to help bring some through and do not mind stepping back from the always being in the starting 11 they could be useful. It could be that Greer and Upson don't start together and they only play alongside Dev players.

Probably the biggest setback in our future defense was Poyet ruling out using our own Cook, Elphic and Hall. He stuck with Greer and El Abd and brought in Upson who have been very good for us, but long term this could have been a backwards step not using our home grown who have much longer careers.

With regards to Kuz as good a keeper as he is there are lots of really good younger keepers in the Prem, so even if a Prem club wanted him he would be only be on the bench. He could go to another Championship club or he could chose to stay here for the rebuild.

I don’t think we will lose support, we never had a problem before we got to the old first division, and it is only the relegation from top fight that sees the turnout drop.

 

[Seasidesage]

Yep the defense of Bruno, Calde, Greer and Upson are at the end of their careers and could not compete in the Prem now, but I don't see that as a problem, more of a fixable inevitability. We need two young CB’s to form a new partnership and if Greers and Upsons job next year is to help bring some through and do not mind stepping back from the always being in the starting 11 they could be useful. It could be that Greer and Upson don't start together and they only play alongside Dev players.

Probably the biggest setback in our future defense was Poyet ruling out using our own Cook, Elphic and Hall. He stuck with Greer and El Abd and brought in Upson who have been very good for us, but long term this could have been a backwards step not using our home grown who have much longer careers.

With regards to Kuz as good a keeper as he is there are lots of really good younger keepers in the Prem, so even if a Prem club wanted him he would be only be on the bench. He could go to another Championship club or he could chose to stay here for the rebuild.

I don’t think we will lose support, we never had a problem before we got to the old first division, and it is only the relegation from top fight that sees the turnout drop.

We'll agree to differ on the support bit but again some good sensible points there. I agree with the need to bed down a new CB next season or later this if the play offs do go away. Dunk needs another run to decide if he is up to it or not. Dallison was possibly sold on coming here for that reason as he appeared to be pretty highly thought of at Arsenal so maybe he expects to be fast tracked into the side?

We will need 2 new RB's over the next 18 months or so, I'd lose Bruno as I think he is going to start to struggle once he loses his recovery powers as he gets the wrong side of his man an awful lot. Think we are looking at a season or two of reconstruction before we can challenge again though especially if we are struggling to compete for ready made players.

I do think that the current structure is working well in terms of bringing players through from the DS. Dunk, March, JFC and especially Ince all have a really good chance of having a career at Championship standard or higher and historically that is way above the average of players we have produced and this is before the training ground gets underway. I think we could have a really good side in 2/3 seasons time built with a mix of home grown and purchased players how many on here will be prepared to wait that is the question?

 

[British Bulldog]

Correct but it is money TB has spent out of his pocket (grateful don't get me wrong) but was it messed art to spend it there and then just to complete the stadium (plenty of empty seats regardless of what the attendances say) and could lancing not have been built in stages leaving TB to invest some of what was spent on the squad.
Perhaps I'm totally wrong and I don't expect him to be chucking money around left right and centre on players

If I remember rightly one of the reasons for completing the stadium in the way we did was it was cheaper than doing it in a number of stages, I'm not sure how you would go about building the training ground/academy in stages though? The buildings would still have had to be built and the land would still have had to be purchased in one go and that's where the majority of expense has gone.