I got into a punch up tonight

[Knotty]

But can you describe the likes of Chelsea, man utd etc as English clubs anymore. Lets not forget how many foreign players play for them. I like to watch the blue square premier on setanta and have been to some non league games. Now thats real English footbal

United started with 6 Englishmen, Chelsea with 4. Not perfect, but compared with many other clubs, not bad.

Howver unpalatable it is, it's a fact of football life. Look down the divisions. Don't forget Kuipers, Racon and Martot and don't rule out other foreigners coming to the club. If they get us promoted we won't be complaining will we?

 

[British Bulldog]

Dave's mate goes to watch them when he can, so that's OK. But is he a better fan than those who would like to, but can't afford to?

If a fan really wants to go and watch the team they support then they'll make the effort to make sure it happens from time to time, A lot of so called fans just look for excuses not to go because deep down they cant be bothered.

 

[Knotty]

There are very few people who couldn't afford to go to Old Trafford, Stamford Bridge etc at least once in their lifetime. Yet there seem to be an awful lot of 'fans' of these clubs for whom that is the case.

Do you know that for a fact? If you do, fine. I would also say that I know a lot of Albion 'fans' who never go to a game. That doesn't make them any less of a fan.

 

[sten_super]

Do you know that for a fact? If you do, fine. I would also say that I know a lot of Albion 'fans' who never go to a game. That doesn't make them any less of a fan.

Do I know which bit for a fact?
Without meaning to get into the 'superfan' debate (mainly because I'm definitely not one!) do you really think that people that NEVER make the effort to go and see their team in the flesh are fans in the same way as season ticket holders, or people that go to away games?

 

[Wozza]

would you have felt any different if he was a Man U season ticket holder that perhaps couldn't get a ticket and therefore chose this pub to watch the game.

What is it with English fans who all believe that you must live withing spitting distance of a local club to be a "true fan".

My mate is a Bayern Munich fan. He lives in Hangleton. He get accross to Germany about 10 times a year to watch them. Is he a plastic fan because according to the logic on here he is?

What the hell does it matter where somone lives, or where they were born in relation to the support of a club?

Yeah, why support your local football team when you can 'buy in' to a big, popular team to inject some success into your miserable life, eh? Eh?

 

[Knotty]

Do I know which bit for a fact?
Without meaning to get into the 'superfan' debate (mainly because I'm definitely not one!) do you really think that people that NEVER make the effort to go and see their team in the flesh are fans in the same way as season ticket holders, or people that go to away games?

No, some are not, but I know from personal experience that some cannot go, no matter how much they love the club.

I have supported the club for 50 years. For the first ten of those I couldn't, or more accurately, my parents couldn't, afford for me to go even though I only lived 30 miles away. I then spent a number of years in Leicester and COULD afford to go to most games home and away. For the past 30 years I have lived in Kent and have been a STH.

I don't want to get into the superfan debate either, but just trying to point out that no matter where you live it isn't a crime to support a club a long way away but even if you live close, maybe you can't go.

 

[Knotty]

Yeah, why support your local football team when you can 'buy in' to a big, popular team to inject some success into your miserable life, eh? Eh?

So when I lived in Chichester, I should have supported Chichester City and not the Albion?

It's the same principle. I would love all those kids you see around in Man U or Chelsea shirts to support the Albion, but why don't they?

I live in Canterbury and in my local there are a load of football fans, but NONE of them goes to Gillingham. They support West Ham, Chelsea, Spurs, Man U and never go. Believe it or not, they are all good guys and not some kind of sub-human species. A nimber of them have become Albion 'fans' too because I have taken them to games. Should they be banned?

 

[London Calling]

Do you know that for a fact? If you do, fine. I would also say that I know a lot of Albion 'fans' who never go to a game. That doesn't make them any less of a fan.

But if you born and bred Brighton, that is different.

In our office we did a survey recently, none of the Manchester United fans were born in manchester, in fact only one was born within 25 miles, the rest were southerners. Actually, the one bloke who was born in Cheshire does go to nearly every game, which isn't bad.

One of the southerners, could tell you everyting about Man U and palyers and very opionated, but after delving, into his attendance record, I discovered despite being in his 40's and financially very secure, able to travel,


he had never been to a Man U game at all.

We are based in London, Man U are down here every over week!

Now that is the type of plastic fan, we are talking about!

The thing with Man U and English players is, yep, that have a good proportion, so in some ways they cannot be slaggd off for that.

But their financial muscle, perpetuated by Champios League and the Premiership, means, they will attract the best of the young. Such as the Beckham, could have walked to Leyton O, West Ham was 10 mins away, Arsenal 20 mins and Spurs a little bit more. All would have developed him.

In addition, they can cherry pick the best of British talent, Carrick, Rooney, Hargreaves. Take Hargreaves, B Munich are Germany's big fish but they could not compete with the clout of Man U.

Having more English and British players in the Prem will overall develop a better equality between teams and help the English national game.

Have we really stopped being the nation that produced the world best goal keepers or is it easier for Wenger, to choose another Frenchie, because it suits his style.

LC?

 

[sten_super]

No, some are not, but I know from personal experience that some cannot go, no matter how much they love the club.

I have supported the club for 50 years. For the first ten of those I couldn't, or more accurately, my parents couldn't, afford for me to go even though I only lived 30 miles away. I then spent a number of years in Leicester and COULD afford to go to most games home and away. For the past 30 years I have lived in Kent and have been a STH.

I don't want to get into the superfan debate either, but just trying to point out that no matter where you live it isn't a crime to support a club a long way away but even if you live close, maybe you can't go.

I appreciate that; I didn't mean to tar all fans that don't go to games with the same brush. By 'plastic' fans, I mean fans that can't be bothered to go to games. That would rather sit in a pub in Haywards Heath (or wherever) with their 3 other Man Utd 'supporting' mates in their Man Utd shirts watching the game on the big screen then spend a few hours on the train to Manchester to actually see a game.

 

[Dave the OAP]

But can you describe the likes of Chelsea, man utd etc as English clubs anymore. Lets not forget how many foreign players play for them. I like to watch the blue square premier on setanta and have been to some non league games. Now thats real English footbal

Ok but what about Aston Villa, Portsmouth, Arsenal QPR Tottenham....they are "owned" by foreign owners.....clubs that are plc are owned in effect by city institutions.

Yes they are English Clubs, they are based in England, they play in the English Premier league ( apart from QPR) and they represent the English game.

The same argument could be said by people who drive Vauxhalls...." I drive an English car"....No you dont you drive and American car, the parent company of Vauxhall is General Motors Corporation of America. Hell, even Mini's are now BMW's.

I think this "plastic fan" stuff is a bit luddite to be honest

 

[Knotty]

I appreciate that; I didn't mean to tar all fans that don't go to games with the same brush. By 'plastic' fans, I mean fans that can't be bothered to go to games. That would rather sit in a pub in Haywards Heath (or wherever) with their 3 other Man Utd 'supporting' mates in their Man Utd shirts watching the game on the big screen then spend a few hours on the train to Manchester to actually see a game.

I agree that the 'plastic' ones are agreat shame but I can't eally get so angry about it as some. Everyone has a choice and I can see why young kids would want to support a successful glamorous club. TV has created this, but it's here; we can't change it.

Is it really worth all the hostility and abuse that emanates from some? I'd like to think they have more important things to worry about.

For me, I'd love to see the Albion stripes on kids in cities, in bars and on beaches all over the world and I wouldn't care if they were 'plastic'!

 

[Dave the OAP]

Yeah, why support your local football team when you can 'buy in' to a big, popular team to inject some success into your miserable life, eh? Eh?

and what is wrong with that? You may not want to support your "local" club. Your local team may be shite. Your children may want to support a sucessful club. that is seen on TV.

In your world is there some sort of Law that says if you live in xxxxx you must suport xxxxx?


Where I live, there is three families who all go to London to watch Chelsea. One of them was originally Brighton fans and gave up when we upped sticks to Gillingham ( he was and Exexutive Club member). His kids never went to Brighton...they are not even on their radar. Are they "plastic fans"?

 

[Buzzer]

Okay. In hindsight I should have kept my mouth shut and just walked away. But if you lot had been there, Munkfish will back me up here, you'd have seen how nauseating it was. The plastic mancs were going berserk. A hundred or so singing "We'll support you ever more" and "we all follow United...". Sorry, but they don't. And when the bloke presumed that I was a plastic manc too and said "WE..". Well, I snapped.

We all give it the big one on here about how the premiership has ruined the English game and is killing clubs like Brighton. There's a thread practically every week. This was one of those moments when I thought enough is enough. Sorry all you Voice Of Reason types but I love the Albion and I am a better football fan than those tossers. Not because I'm a STH, not because I stand up in the middle of a pub full of Chelsea and Manu fans and sing Albion songs. It's because I support a team for some reason other than they are successful. These plastic mancs aren't the fictitious Man U fan who can't afford to go the games either. They pay £40 for a top, spend £30 in the pub. How can you pretend to be that ecstatic about a win, spend that much money yet not be arsed to go to the games?

I'm not proud of what I did but I'm not ashamed either. You know what, I'd do it again.

(p.s. yes it was hot, no - my mates aren't from Chelsea although 2 of the 3 go to at least 20 games every season, my jacket was fine as was my hair. I love you all)

 

[Lokki 7]

BUZZER


Walking back through London Bridge station after the game last night I passed 3 twats shouting Chelsea, so I of course gave them a couple of "Seagulls!" back (yes, I was pissed). Their response was to aggressively square up to me and and tell me that Brighton had won nothing this season. Good comedy timing.

 

[Dave the OAP]

BUZZER:

Walking back through London Bridge station after the game last night I passed 3 twats shouting Chelsea, so I of course gave them a couple of "Seagulls!" back (yes, I was pissed). Their response was to aggressively square up to me and and tell me that Brighton had won nothing this season. Good comedy timing.

technically speaking they were right though

 

[Knotty]

tell me that Brighton had won nothing this season. Good comedy timing.

Brilliant!

 

[Brovion]

would you have felt any different if he was a Man U season ticket holder that perhaps couldn't get a ticket and therefore chose this pub to watch the game.

What is it with English fans who all believe that you must live withing spitting distance of a local club to be a "true fan".

My mate is a Bayern Munich fan. He lives in Hangleton. He get accross to Germany about 10 times a year to watch them. Is he a plastic fan because according to the logic on here he is?

What the hell does it matter where somone lives, or where they were born in relation to the support of a club?

Because football is so much more than just cheering for the winners. Yes some of the people might be exiled Mancs but I bet 95% of them support Man U simply because they're big and successful; if things had worked out differently they'd all be supporting Man City. Maybe we should all support Germany or Argentina at international level? Why should we support England?

And yes your mate, unless he has some connection with Munich, is a plastic fan - albeit a slightly better-off one. Why did he choose them?

 

[London Calling]

To developp this further, we live in what is now a Arsenal area, all the african kids where their tops, half the turkish kids, mixed in with a few Turkish sides.

Once Hackney was split between three sides:

Tottenham in the north (the Jewish area)
Arsenal in the middle (my area) and
West Ham in the south and east!

But no more.

The children already know Brighton is special (4, 2 and 7 months - well he doesn't yet).

They have Brighton bears, we have wooden seagulls.

Will I want my kids to stand out with their Brighton shirts? Beatrice already stands out as being about the only little girl for miles with blond hair.

Ultimately, I will favour Brighton, but they were born, within the old Bow Bells, so it will be their choice. The fact I won't be forking out £60 quid plus to watch the Gunners, may effect a final decision.

LC

 

[Man of Harveys]

Where I live, there is three families who all go to London to watch Chelsea. One of them was originally Brighton fans and gave up when we upped sticks to Gillingham ( he was and Exexutive Club member). His kids never went to Brighton...they are not even on their radar. Are they "plastic fans"?

Erm...yup. And they sound like right twats too.

 

[Hannibal smith]

Do you not find the plastics nauseating though Dave ? They "adopt" the biggest, most successful club in the country for no reason other than the fact that they are the biggest, most succesful club in the country. Then in their JJB-purchased shirt, they proceed to lord it over all the other fans, looking down their noses sneering at the smaller clubs, boast about "their teams" achievements, celebrate wildly in front of a TV screen as if it really means something to them when United pick up yet another pot, when the truth of the matter is that they know about one eighth of f***-all about what supporting a football club is ACTUALLY all about.

My pub last night had its share of proper plastics. One in a Man U top from the days of SHARP, probably dusted off from 1987 acted like it was more important than life or death. This after he missed 15 minutes of the game outside smoking fags, another 10 talking loudly to his mate with half an eye on the TV about bollocks and not withstanding the fact he turned up 15 minutes after it started saying 'I thought it was an 8 O'clock kick off'

Then Anelka misses and he goes mental and knocks a table of drinks over.

Why the need to do this? Most of us in the pub last night struggled to find a reason to like either of these odious teams. It was only Bobby Charlton refusing a medal and showed what decency is all about when I actually felt it was worth watching (well, alright Drobga getting sent off and Ronaldo missing a pen was well worth watching too) and could stop thinking about 30 ways to chin one of the twats.