[Albion] Hughton Article in the Argus today.

[Raleigh Chopper]

Don't forget though. Wolves. These are a good side.

No they are not.
They are dynamic.

 

[Mellotron]

If he'd said "we’re not gonna become defensively solid anytime soon” I'd have had more of an issue with it because we were defensively solid until 3 months ago. On the other hand, we haven't scored more than 2 goals in a game since Palace at home (4th Dec) and that isn't changing any time soon because we don't have the players.

We spent about £50m on attacking players with pedigree in the summer. We've barely used one and played two woefully out of position. That's on Hughton, not the players.

You really think psychologically right now the thing to do is basically say "we're gonna sit in and hope for 0-0s because the strikers are shit"?

REALLY?

Look at how Warnock has Cardiff fired up. Winning every 2nd ball against us. Being stronger in the tackle and faster than us. Scoring goals against us.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

* We stayed up in the Championship because the first thing CH did was to tighten up our defence - he recognised we couldn't score for shit. Remember Millwall at home (0-1) under Sami - and they were crap.
* The next two seasons were characterised by bold free scoring play. We scored for fun.
* Last season we stayed up because our defence was superb (Dunk got an England call up) and we scored enough goals. It HAS to be worth pointing out that last season's 2nd and 3rd highest goalscorers (Gross, Jose Iz) have both been out for a large part of this season, and our new recruits up front haven't been good enough. Locadia is a flat track bully and Andone has been crap too - he is living off his Palace worldy and a couple of textbook headers, both unmarked and against by far the poorest side in the league.

These are the facts.

I have faith in CH that he will revert to a more expansive game when the opportunity presents itself, but right now just get us over the line with crappy attritional football. This is what he's done before and I think we'll reap rewards if we keep faith in him. But even if you disagree with me, he deserves a lot better than some of the rubbish in this thread insinuating that he doesn't know what he's doing and is defensive for the sake of it.

Who would believe that just two years ago today, we were celebrating getting promoted to the Prem, when just two seasons before that we were in danger of going down to League 1?

 

[LamieRobertson]

CH is a pragmatic manager defensive solidity reigns supreme, we all know that, we all admire(d) that, he's done very well because of it.

For whatever reason the club hasn't given him a free scoring team, money being the obvious one, but CH does have the final say on all transfers.

Sadly, for everyone, the pressure being applied to the team (and unimportantly the fans as well) by not having the release of even potential goals is finally coming home to roost.

Worst still is this isn't a new occurrence.

We were warned that this is how it would end, it's hard to see this as being anything other than the end.

Relegation from the Premier League screws over all the players. playing with a 'must to concede - must not concede' mantra will lead to only one outcome, and from that moment 1, 2 or 5 goals conceded it really doesn't matter.

If that is the case..lets take the scenario of you can have striker a or b ..but nothing else...neither fit the bill....but its them or nothing...then of course he would take one ..even if they aren't really up to scratch.

And lets get back to the original reason for the thread and your reply......cheap shot really isn't it...but you know you flirt between both sides of the fence
It'll be nice to have 11 men behind the ball instead of 10.


To think posters say 'CH is too rigid and doesn't react'.

 

[SollysLeftFoot]

The problem here is that people are defending Hughton arguing that we need to resort back to the way we were (pre-January) which is a criticism many have had over the past 4 months. There is no ownership of the fact that his experiment with 4-3-3 failed considerably.

Hughton can take us over the line, albeit with a limp. He's right we need to be more defensively sound but the issue here is the wording around our strikers. If you want your strikers to be putting in more effort, then you damn well encourage them not admit they cannot score..

 

[dazzer6666]

Oh right. Thanks for clearing that up. I thought we we're caught on the break trying to get an equaliser. Next time I'll make sure I get the facts from you. Cheers,

Hardly, it was a free kick. We should have been 100% able to defend it.

 

[Simster]

We spent about £50m on attacking players with pedigree in the summer. We've barely used one and played two woefully out of position. That's on Hughton, not the players.

You really think psychologically right now the thing to do is basically say "we're gonna sit in and hope for 0-0s because the strikers are shit"?

REALLY?

Look at how Warnock has Cardiff fired up. Winning every 2nd ball against us. Being stronger in the tackle and faster than us. Scoring goals against us.

Hughton didn't recruit them but does see what they can do in training all week. Locadia has had chances and not taken them, Andone not so much (injury) but he can't hold the ball up and is usually - to use horse racing terminology - well held. Ali J is pure gash, I don't care where he plays.

Again, this is you talking bollocks. He has not "basically said" "we're gonna sit in and hope for 0-0s because the strikers are shit". He's said "we are never going to score loads of goals and we need to tighten up. That's not the same thing at all. That's just looking at what we managed when we were playing well - we haven't ever scored 4 goals in this league in 2 seasons.

As for Colin, give me a sodding break. Fine, they deserved their win on Tuesday but Colin's got Cardiff so fired up that they are two points behind us having played a game more, AND even then only because they were the beneficiaries of a crucial 3 point swing thanks to their offside goal early in the season.

 

[Bwian]

Most of that is a crock of shit. Sorry but it is. We haven't been shithouse for most of the season at all. Beating Man Utd EASILY, we even played really well at Liverpool. There are loads of examples of us playing really well actually, I'm not going to list them all.

And if you're going to use those "flukey" results as a stick to beat him with, you have to be even handed - we deserved more from other games than we got. Leicester at home, arguably Liverpool away, Fulham at home, Cardiff away was robbery, Watford at home was a 0-0 thrashing and we should have gone 3 up at West Ham before they pegged us back to 2-2. I have sympathy with your away record comment, but look at the table and you see that not many teams outside the top 6 have anything like a decent record away from home.

And the whole point is that this isn't a moment of inspiration, it's a newspaper article where all he's said is that we need to tighten up. But moaning nobs on here are just using that as a stick to beat him with, despite the fact that he's right.

No come on, list a few.

Liverpool, start of the season. We held them to a draw. We did not play 'really well'. We beat Man Utd easily, as did anybody else around that time.

We blew a 2 goal lead at West Ham, hanging on for a draw.

We blew a 2 goal lead against bottom of the table Fulham who hadn't won in 12 games or so.

We scraped a win against Huddersfield at home. We were awful.

Southampton away-awful.
Southampton home-even more awful.

Games we should be at least getting a point from and we look dreadful.

I could list loads more too.

Well done for defending him. I have stopped going to games because of the shit he serves up.

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[Stat Brother]

If that is the case..lets take the scenario of you can have striker a or b ..but nothing else...neither fit the bill....but its them or nothing...then of course he would take one ..even if they aren't really up to scratch.

I can't answer that because I have no knowledge of how the club arrange potential transfers.
All I do know is that everybody has gone to great lengths to repeatedly say 'CH makes the final decision'.

And lets get back to the original reason for the thread and your reply......cheap shot really isn't it...but you know you flirt between both sides of the fence
It'll be nice to have 11 men behind the ball instead of 10.


To think posters say 'CH is too rigid and doesn't react'.

Yes it's an incredibly cheap shot, born out of frustration not reality as CH doesn't even play with 10 men behind the ball.

I'd hope everybody flirts with both sides of the fence, CH is too important and honourable to be 'Barry Lloyded'.

Despite my knob replies around NSC, I hope everybody doesn't judge Chris' 4 years over the span of 2019, [MENTION=232]Simster[/MENTION] is doing a very good job of reminding us that.

But that doesn't mean to say I can't criticise and point at the obvious long term failing of club and manager in a goal scoring business.

 

[dazzer6666]

No come on, list a few.

Liverpool, start of the season. We held them to a draw. We did not play 'really well'. We beat Man Utd easily, as did anybody else around that time.

We blew a 2 goal lead at West Ham, hanging on for a draw.

We blew a 2 goal lead against bottom of the table Fulham who hadn't won in 12 games or so.

We scraped a win against Huddersfield at home. We were awful.

Southampton away-awful.
Southampton home-even more awful.

Games we should be at least getting a point from and we look dreadful.

I could list loads more too.

Well done for defending him. I have stopped going to games because of the shit he serves up.

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We drew with Liverpool ?

 

[Bold Seagull]

Picking out your comment about Groß and Jose being out for a large part of the season begs the question:

Why The Hell did Hughton and Barber tell us that our team and squad didn't need strengthening I January?

The are both responsible for the mess we're in. Hughton more so because he sees the squad in training every day. Every one of the 28000 or so regulars at The Amex knew the team wasn't good enough. Why was nothing done to strengthen?

Pah!

Had enough of him and Barber.

Surely it's Tony Bloom that has the say on budgets and money to be spent? January would surely have been his call?

No matter what you say, I cannot imagine Hughton wouldn't have wanted to bring players in, when he was told he couldn't, he towed the party line as he does. For all we know he had specific targets and was denied going after them.

You know blaming Bloom is crossing the line, so you just vent at the manager and CEO, and likely neither of them ultimately made that call.

 

[Nixonator]

Come on, you can't attack everything he says just because you're in the OUT camp.

He's saying we need to go back to keeping things tight, surely that is a no brainer?

What do you want him to say exactly? That we will be trying Pep's approach and going for broke?

 

[Simster]

No come on, list a few.

Liverpool, start of the season. We held them to a draw. We did not play 'really well'. We beat Man Utd easily, as did anybody else around that time.

We blew a 2 goal lead at West Ham, hanging on for a draw.

We blew a 2 goal lead against bottom of the table Fulham who hadn't won in 12 games or so.

We scraped a win against Huddersfield at home. We were awful.

Southampton away-awful.
Southampton home-even more awful.

Games we should be at least getting a point from and we look dreadful.

I could list loads more too.

Well done for defending him. I have stopped going to games because of the shit he serves up.

Er, I was quoting good performances before the last 3 months because you said we have been shit all season rather than the last 3 months.

Of your 6 examples, only 3 of them (Liv a, Soton a, West H a) were from before Christmas, and we weren't particularly shit in any of 3 games you list. All that tells me is that you've made your mind up over Hughton and it doesn't matter what he says or does from now on, it'll always be wrong in your view.

 

[Bwian]

We drew with Liverpool ?

Sorry. Meant to say held them to 1 goal.

Wishful thinking maybe?

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[dazzer6666]

Sorry. Meant to say held them to 1 goal.

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LOL, felt like a win after previous batterings

 

[Simster]

I hope everybody doesn't judge Chris' 4 years over the span of 2019, [MENTION=232]Simster[/MENTION] is doing a very good job of reminding us that.

The thing is, I'm all for debate over his future - all I'm saying is let's stick to the facts when doing so. Putting words in his mouth over a newspaper article is absolutely not doing that.

Obviously I am in the camp that he deserves the chance to get us over the line and regroup next season. I think if I felt our front players were any good, he'd have more of a case to answer, but Locadia, Ali J and Andone range from poor to utter shithouse, Izquierdo and Gross are not at all but both have been complete sicknotes this time round. That leaves 54 year old Glenn Murray and Solly March.

I just don't see any new manager getting any sort of bounce from our squad when the guys up front are clearly not up to it. It's not like at Southampton where they clearly had the players available to be doing better than Hughes was managing.

If Hughton stays, and we stay up, we need to bin off some our utterly shit forwards. Then there needs to be an inquest as to who thought spending £50m on those three toilet recruits from the Dutch league was ever a good move.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

The big mistake was thinking we were safe in January.

This lead to :

1 - A failed change in system.

2 - No recruitment to the 25 man squad - in fact it was reduced from 25 players to 23 !

We stood still before starting a sleepwalk which we badly need to awaken from.

 

[LamieRobertson]

I can't answer that because I have no knowledge of how the club arrange potential transfers.
All I do know is that everybody has gone to great lengths to repeatedly say 'CH makes the final decision'.



Yes it's an incredibly cheap shot, born out of frustration not reality as CH doesn't even play with 10 men behind the ball.

I'd hope everybody flirts with both sides of the fence, CH is too important and honourable to be 'Barry Lloyded'.

Despite my knob replies around NSC, I hope everybody doesn't judge Chris' 4 years over the span of 2019, [MENTION=232]Simster[/MENTION] is doing a very good job of reminding us that.

But that doesn't mean to say I can't criticise and point at the obvious long term failing of club and manager in a goal scoring business.

Aye but it’s a perfectly reasonable scenario as a reply to CH has the final say therefore he is solely responsible

 

[Bwian]

Er, I was quoting good performances before the last 3 months because you said we have been shit all season rather than the last 3 months.

Of your 6 examples, only 3 of them (Liv a, Soton a, West H a) were from before Christmas, and we weren't particularly shit in any of 3 games you list. All that tells me is that you've made your mind up over Hughton and it doesn't matter what he says or does from now on, it'll always be wrong in your view.

Regarding Hughton, yes you are 100% correct.

I didn't list more but can if you'd like.

Everton away
Bournemouth away
Wolves at home despite winning
Burnley away
Burnley home.



So yes, Hughton needs replacing as soon as sensibly possible in my opinion. He's like a man adrift in a leaky boat, bailing out with a bucket with a hole in it.

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[Stat Brother]

The thing is, I'm all for debate over his future - all I'm saying is let's stick to the facts when doing so. Putting words in his mouth over a newspaper article is absolutely not doing that.

Obviously I am in the camp that he deserves the chance to get us over the line and regroup next season. I think if I felt our front players were any good, he'd have more of a case to answer, but Locadia, Ali J and Andone range from poor to utter shithouse, Izquierdo and Gross are not at all but both have been complete sicknotes this time round. That leaves 54 year old Glenn Murray and Solly March.

I just don't see any new manager getting any sort of bounce from our squad when the guys up front are clearly not up to it. It's not like at Southampton where they clearly had the players available to be doing better than Hughes was managing.

If Hughton stays, and we stay up, we need to bin off some our utterly shit forwards. Then there needs to be an inquest as to who thought spending £50m on those three toilet recruits from the Dutch league was ever a good move.

I'll hazard a guess plenty of Southampton fans spent the first half of the season thinking their players were shithouse, their transfer policy was failing and nobody could get a tune out such bad footballers.


Oh and I'm beginning to think CH doesn't have enough in the bank to get past the teams inevitable 'bad' start next season (irrespective as to how actually bad the start is).
I'm also questioning whether he has enough sway with those above him to say 'I need x,y & z gone and many more millions spent on a, b & c, in order to have a team that WILL score the goals you expect'.