HR question re employment

[Bry Nylon]

As a trade union rep the answer is ...........
Your employer can change your conditions of service (contract) providing they give statutory notice of their intention to do so in writing.
There is no requirement to consult with you or a trade union, but most do.
The notice period is one week for every complete year of employment up to a maximum of 13 weeks.
This is most often used when a company changes ownership and is covered at some depth under the TUPE (Transfer undertaking & protection of employees) regulations.
Most companies do the 13 weeks as easier to change everyone's contract at the same time rather than having some on the old and some on the new contract
Sorry, but your stuffed, you have the legal right to refuse the new contract, but we call that resigning.

An intelligent, concise response that directly answers the question posed. Shame you don't post more frequently.

 

[drew]

As a trade union rep the answer is ...........
Your employer can change your conditions of service (contract) providing they give statutory notice of their intention to do so in writing.
There is no requirement to consult with you or a trade union, but most do.
The notice period is one week for every complete year of employment up to a maximum of 13 weeks.
This is most often used when a company changes ownership and is covered at some depth under the TUPE (Transfer undertaking & protection of employees) regulations.
Most companies do the 13 weeks as easier to change everyone's contract at the same time rather than having some on the old and some on the new contract
Sorry, but your stuffed, you have the legal right to refuse the new contract, but we call that resigning.


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Really? Employers cannot just change your contract without agreement, at least according to the Government.

https://www.gov.uk/your-employment-contract-how-it-can-be-changed/getting-agreement

And from ACAS

http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=3971

My recommendation when it comes to concerns about your terms of employment is to seek recognized experts, whether that be ACAS, CAB or paying for an employment solicitor (your initial chat and advice may well be free). By all means raise a question on a football forum but don't rely on the answers.

 

[drew]

If customers are demanding a weekend response but no-one is prepared to provide that level of service then it is probably best to start looking for another job anyway. Customers will start placing their business with service providers that can meet their needs and if that isn't your company then the outcome is inevitable.

Or the company will negotiate with their employees and offer suitable remuneration.

 

[beorhthelm]

Really? Employers cannot just change your contract without agreement, at least according to the Government.

if you dont accept the new contract, and there is sound business reasons for the change, the company can justify that the existing role is redundant.

 

[wellquickwoody]

As a trade union rep the answer is ...........
Your employer can change your conditions of service (contract) providing they give statutory notice of their intention to do so in writing.
There is no requirement to consult with you or a trade union, but most do.
The notice period is one week for every complete year of employment up to a maximum of 13 weeks.
This is most often used when a company changes ownership and is covered at some depth under the TUPE (Transfer undertaking & protection of employees) regulations.
Most companies do the 13 weeks as easier to change everyone's contract at the same time rather than having some on the old and some on the new contract
Sorry, but your stuffed, you have the legal right to refuse the new contract, but we call that resigning.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Thank you.

 

[drew]

if you dont accept the new contract, and there is sound business reasons for the change, the company can justify that the existing role is redundant.

And doesn't that then possibly constitute constructive dismissal or at the very least entitle you to redundancy payment which, on only 14 months employment, wouldn't amount to much. The point I was making was against the implied suggestion by Fran211 that employers can do what they like! In this particular case the OP hasn't been employed long enough and apologies to Fran211 is he was in fact being specific about this case.

 

[Technohead]

Thank you.

Although that answer is not technically correct. Under UK legislation a contract of employment can not be changed unless it is mutually agreed between the employer and the employee. By definition therefore there has to be consultation. Failure to do so, also by definition, means that any change will be breach of contract.

As to the contract itself, this is not necessarily the bit of paper that says "Your contract", as the actual working contract can include other elements or even exclude written elements to some extent. Us trade union reps often really on something known as "custom and practice", which is where you have been doing something for so long it automatically forms part of the contract. So even if a written contract states that you are expected to work 7 days a week, but you have only ever worked Monday to Friday, custom and practice defines that actually your contract is only for work between Monday and Friday.

So, if an employer wants to change your contract of employment, they have to consult in order to try and get your agreement. If you don't agree they can, as has been stated earlier in this thread, leave your contract as it is, or terminate your existing contract, giving the correct notice, and "offer" you a new contract with the new terms incorporated. This is what an employer is effectively doing when they impose a change giving, say, 30 days notice. An employee can then except the new contract or claim unfair dismissal from the previous one, if you have a long enough qualifying period. As I stated previously, the government changed the qualifying period in 2012 from 1 year to 2 years. With this in mind I would still agree, I'm sorry to say, with Frans assessment that "your stuffed".

This is it in a nutshell, albeit very simplified and condensed. The websites stated by Drew give far more information, and the TUC Worksmart website is also very good.

 

[NooBHA]

I sometimes wonder where employees think the money comes from that lands in their bank account every month. In this instance the said company may have landed a new contract to keep their heads above water and thus making sure everyone keeps their jobs, yet you often find you get nothing back from your staff apart from moans and groans if you ask them to go the extra mile on occasion.

I totally disagree..................Well not totally but slightly disagree.

The whole of western society, its buildings, its railways and so on was built on the back of a labour force.

There has to be cohesion between workers and employers. Employees expectations cannot be over demanding on an employer but by the same token we cannot ignore the rights of the employees and the labour market and go back to the ''work house'' days. So the best way to solve issues is for good cohesion and good dialogue between the employer and employee. And dare I say it, compromise on both sides.

 

[Marshy]

you need a valid reason as to why you cannot do the weekend work... do you have any children you look after at weekends for example ?

Or any long standing commitments over the weekends that would get you excused ?

 

[pb21]

It's called taking responsibility for yourself, but the far left don't want people to think for themselves do they?

Eh?! So you do everything yourself? You would never pay someone to help you? What if you were falsely charged with a crime (I presume you would only be falsely charged), would you not employ the help of a legal expert? What if you needed brain surgery (some might say that you do), would you do it yourself or employ a medical expert?

 

[wellquickwoody]

Eh?! So you do everything yourself? You would never pay someone to help you? What if you were falsely charged with a crime (I presume you would only be falsely charged), would you not employ the help of a legal expert? What if you needed brain surgery (some might say that you do), would you do it yourself or employ a medical expert?

If you look again, my post was in response to Ernest claiming that you had more rights if you were in a trade union, which was entirely inaccurate.

 

[drew]

you need a valid reason as to why you cannot do the weekend work... do you have any children you look after at weekends for example ?

Or any long standing commitments over the weekends that would get you excused ?

Why? If you take a job that is 9-5 Mon to Fri it is irrelevant whether you have or haven't any commitments at the weekend. If the contract you signed states 9-5 Mon to Fri then it is what it is. If the company takes on a contract that changes that then the company needs to negotiate with it's staff to cover extra hours or take on people that will.

When you enter into a contract surely both parties are agreeing to the terms of that contract. If you agreed a contract with someone to build you a conservatory that was 5m by 4m but they then supplied one which was 4m by 3m you aren't going to accept it (or pay the same price as you would have done for the original order).

Surely employment law is pretty much the same thing except there are grey areas due to customs and working practice.

One area where people get caught out on is when they have a contract which outlines the job and basic terms and then makes reference to the employees handbook. I've seen it where employers have changed things in the handbook which is effectively changing your contract terms and conditions. Because the single page contract they signed hasn't changed employees don't see it as a change in the terms.

 

[pb21]

If you look again, my post was in response to Ernest claiming that you had more rights if you were in a trade union, which was entirely inaccurate.

It reads as though you are criticising advice to join a union to obtain legal advice and/or representation on the basis that you you should take responsibility yourself. And also suggesting that the 6 month period is a good thing as it allows for people to take responsibility for themselves.

Of course that's not why this 6 month period exists, rather than to stop people abusing the fact that unions offer this.

I apologise for this mistake in my compression, you are clearly in favour of unions providing legal representation for their paid up members!

 

[wellquickwoody]

It reads as though you are criticising advice to join a union to obtain legal advice and/or representation on the basis that you you should take responsibility yourself. And also suggesting that the 6 month period is a good thing as it allows for people to take responsibility for themselves.

Of course that's not why this 6 month period exists, rather than to stop people abusing the fact that unions offer this.

I apologise for this mistake in my compression, you are clearly in favour of unions providing legal representation for their paid up members!

Apology accepted sir . I am in fact entirely comfortable with unions' providing legal representation for their members, even if past experience leads me to believe it is usually done only when it suits the unions interests as much as those of the member concerned. What I object to is the idea that an employee has more rights if they are in a trades union, a louder voice maybe, but exactly the same rights.

 

[Whoislloydy]

I think the rule with contracts is once a new contract is produced you have 6 months i think so either sign that contract OR another that you have negotiated. If you haven't signed it or the negotiated one, it basically automatically becomes your contract.

This was what i was lead to believe at my old job when they wanted to put Saturdays into our contract for compulsory overtime if the company required you to do so.

 

[Whoislloydy]

If you look again, my post was in response to Ernest claiming that you had more rights if you were in a trade union, which was entirely inaccurate.

Agreed, we all have the same rights. It's just a union is trained to know what are your rights and how to go about certain things.