[Albion] How to improve NS and Amex atmosphere?

[Insel affe]

OK I'll inform my pal who moved to Brighton 30+ years ago from London (having supported Arsenal as a kid) and regularly went to Withdean, but then bought a season ticket at Falmer and now also goes to most away games and sings his head off, that his presence is no longer required...

Bit dramatic, but go on then...

I know several Albion season ticket holders who admit to Brighton being there second team, even though they were born here and support their first team over the Albion sat in their seat at the Amex when the two clash. It is a fact, and I know there are many more out there.

 

[father_and_son]

I'm glad the sitting vs standing debate has reignited with people claiming that you can make just as much noise sitting down. Whilst true, it patently does not happen in practice for whatever reason.

_and_Son and I are among the few that can contribute to this debate from both sides. From when the corners were put in, we were at the front of SWC, singing with the vocal group there (hi guys).
A couple of seasons back, _and_Son declared he was tall enough to stand (and see) and we moved to the NS and were lucky enough to get seats at the back under the Police Box were we continue to sing loud and proud.

Sitting vs Standing.... Makes no difference if you actually *want* to be part of the atmosphere creators, though I see how standing means it's easier to get caught up in the excitement more and think the 'on the fence' group will be louder if standing.

However, standing doesn't make noise, you still need a focal group to start the chants and be persistent enough to get others involved. The key similarity between SWC and NSK is those few making the initial effort and getting those around them involved.

Standing/sitting... Not the issue. Enthusiastic fans starting the ball rolling... Key.

 

[Moshe Gariani]

There is already a fair few singers in the North West Corner and NSK aren't exactly a long way from them already.
Surely it would improve matters by moving the other NS singers from central/ North East side ?

Or am i mis-understanding?

Not sure what the misunderstanding is. Yes, you're right, what would work best is if some of the more central and East side NS singers joined those already towards NWC/West side area (includes NSK group under police box).

 

[blue-shifted]

What we can't afford to do as a club is be all popular front of Judea about it and start not joining in each other songs on principle.

The current situation in the north stand lends itself to a bit of we're the left side etc etc which is quite good for breaking the ice with the chronically shy/too cool for school/ decrepit misers (delete as appropriate)

Agree with those who are saying that those in the West need to stop waiting for the North and get on with it.

Also agree with those saying that there isn't an inherent design flaw in the Amex (apart from the fact that there are seats instead of terraces) which is preventing a good atmosphere being created. It's been done plenty of times. I just think we've got a bit lazy and turned into consumers rather than participants.

Thread like this are great. We need to be shaken out of our slumber.

One thing I think the club could simply do is to rebrand the north stand the singing stand. Not an idea without problems, as it sounds truly tragic and implies the other don't have to get involved. However it would subtly remind it's denizens of their wider duties.

 

[blue-shifted]

_and_Son and I are among the few that can contribute to this debate from both sides. From when the corners were put in, we were at the front of SWC, singing with the vocal group there (hi guys).
A couple of seasons back, _and_Son declared he was tall enough to stand (and see) and we moved to the NS and were lucky enough to get seats at the back under the Police Box were we continue to sing loud and proud.

Sitting vs Standing.... Makes no difference if you actually *want* to be part of the atmosphere creators, though I see how standing means it's easier to get caught up in the excitement more and think the 'on the fence' group will be louder if standing.

However, standing doesn't make noise, you still need a focal group to start the chants and be persistent enough to get others involved. The key similarity between SWC and NSK is those few making the initial effort and getting those around them involved.

Standing/sitting... Not the issue. Enthusiastic fans starting the ball rolling... Key.

How many opera singers do you see sitting down? You need to be standing up to really lean back and belt one out (and a song ) It's just the way humans are built.

 

[crookie]

Row W N1G, most around me stand and sing, but I admit it is probably only 6 or 7 rows. I'd be happy to move more centrally or towards the NW corner to congregate the singers together. Bit of a logistical nightmare for the club trying to facilitate it though, and it could only be on a voluntary basis IMHO. Fair play to @MosheGariani for bringing it up. I'd be interested to know Barber's response if you've asked him his thoughts.

 

[blue-shifted]

Dear D179,

We are contacting a number of STHs in your area of the ground to see if you can help us with some small changes to your seat positions in order to accomodate other fans. There are several options of seats available for you to choose from including some very close to where you are and others in more central positions that you might prefer. If you have a pair of seats or more then we will obviously make sure we are able to keep you together.

There is absolutely no expectation that you will be willing to move. We completely understand if you wish to stay where you are but if you are happy to help us with this then, as a show of thanks, we can offer you a £1.50 cash discount on your ST for this season and a 50p voucher to spend in the club shop.

best regards
Barbs

Corrected for you for greater realism

 

[father_and_son]

How many opera singers do you see sitting down? You need to be standing up to really lean back and belt one out (and a song ) It's just the way humans are built.

How many football chants are solos?

You only need a couple of dozen seated people to generate a decent noise and be the catalyst for it to spread.

Not saying it's better to sit, just saying it's a sh*t excuse for not singing.

 

[dazzer6666]

North Stand is missing the Judge........not the same without his titanium vocal cords kicking things off.

 

[Moshe Gariani]

Corrected for you for greater realism

Yes, it is a bit of a pipe dream that the club would understand how c.£20K spent like this could actually pay a priceless dividend...

 

[Moshe Gariani]

What we can't afford to do as a club is be all popular front of Judea about it and start not joining in each other songs on principle.

The current situation in the north stand lends itself to a bit of we're the left side etc etc which is quite good for breaking the ice with the chronically shy/too cool for school/ decrepit misers (delete as appropriate)

Agree with those who are saying that those in the West need to stop waiting for the North and get on with it.

Also agree with those saying that there isn't an inherent design flaw in the Amex (apart from the fact that there are seats instead of terraces) which is preventing a good atmosphere being created. It's been done plenty of times. I just think we've got a bit lazy and turned into consumers rather than participants.

Thread like this are great. We need to be shaken out of our slumber.

One thing I think the club could simply do is to rebrand the north stand the singing stand. Not an idea without problems, as it sounds truly tragic and implies the other don't have to get involved. However it would subtly remind it's denizens of their wider duties.

Thanks for this. The last hour or so on here has had some good contributions including people who sing in other parts of NS expressing willingness to join together in W/NW area.

I've got no idea how to progress it now.

I could e-mail Paul Barber. Key information is how many seats will be naturally available in the chosen area for next season and whether he has any interest in helping a fans-led initiative for more of the singers to congregate there.

Recent observations from GP about the effect of the atmosphere on the team might mean he is more interested than he would have been previously.

p.s. I have this thread on split screen with Judd Trump v Kyren Wilson (deciding frame...) so could be a good time to type an e-mail to Paul of a length that commands his respect...

 

[Moshe Gariani]

_and_Son and I are among the few that can contribute to this debate from both sides. From when the corners were put in, we were at the front of SWC, singing with the vocal group there (hi guys).
A couple of seasons back, _and_Son declared he was tall enough to stand (and see) and we moved to the NS and were lucky enough to get seats at the back under the Police Box were we continue to sing loud and proud.

Sitting vs Standing.... Makes no difference if you actually *want* to be part of the atmosphere creators, though I see how standing means it's easier to get caught up in the excitement more and think the 'on the fence' group will be louder if standing.

However, standing doesn't make noise, you still need a focal group to start the chants and be persistent enough to get others involved. The key similarity between SWC and NSK is those few making the initial effort and getting those around them involved.

Standing/sitting... Not the issue. Enthusiastic fans starting the ball rolling... Key.

How many would you say are in the "NSK" proper now? Is it quite a small group actually under the police box? Do you think it would work if you stayed where you are and others came into the area nearby but not actually under the box?

 

[BeHereNow]

Only been told to sit by a steward once ( FA Cup game following a complaint from a tourist that i was blocking her view)
So I don't think it's the Stewards...

possibly some other whingeing fans who don't belong there.
Safe standing would sort those out.

I’ve seen stewards telling people to sit down from about 8 rows from the back. Everyone should just stay up.

Agree with safe standing.

 

[BeHereNow]

The problem with the central area is that the other people in it have been there from 2011 and certainly won't want to move. So it is impossible to create a bigger group around where you are.

I think it is more possible further over in or towards the NW corner. I don't know how many seats are available in that area after renewal/non-renewal is complete. Possibly enough to accomodate the number wanting to move from other parts of NS or elsewhere (inc. a few teenagers graduating from FS). An influx of even 10-20 people really up for it into that area would be enough to start to make things work better. The club might need to help with some minor shuffling around within the area. Phase Two could then involve gradually building the identity of the area and allowing further inward/outward migration as people choose.

Is the elephant in the North Stand that non-NSK people just don't like the idea of moving to that area and joining together?

I’m sure fans half way down the centre of the stand wouldn’t mind my better view higher up and a bit to the left.

To me, the best place would be the centre, that seems like the natural place to try to suck the ball in. We didn’t have any singers in that corner when the atmosphere was probably at its best on average, so the noise can definitely travel to WSU from there.

Like I said before, the NSK don’t seem to sing any of the classics, whereas we do. If they sang a mixture of both, fans would probably join in more.

 

[Eric Youngs Contact Lense]

Only been told to sit by a steward once ( FA Cup game following a complaint from a tourist that i was blocking her view)
So I don't think it's the Stewards...

possibly some other whingeing fans who don't belong there.
Safe standing would sort those out.

I was Block F, nearer the front, level with where the steps from the concourse open into the stadium.. We were often told to sit down there by stewards, which was one reason why I moved to Row T, Block G. I even had the Stadium Manager come and sit by me at half-time, when we resisted the invitation to sit.. looking backwards at the rows of people standing, checked with the people behind me if I was annoying them/blocking their view etc. etc. That was two season ago, so may have changed, but it was annoyingly frequent enough except for the very biggest games, Palace or Sheff Wed play-off for example. The rationale, offered by the "manager" was all very logical for them asking us to sit down, well trodden verbatims around stadium licences etc, finding a reasonable balance etc.. so it does, or used to happen. Block G, towards the back good for singing, but is part of the problem being so disparate from the other groups.. a "singing section" sounds cringey, but would definitely improve the opportunity for "whole stand" singing..

 

[Weststander]

I’ve seen stewards telling people to sit down from about 8 rows from the back. Everyone should just stay up.

Agree with safe standing.

I’m in block D NS 17 rows from the front, most people stand the entire match and the stewards leave everyone alone these days.

 

[oneillco]

Bit dramatic, but go on then...

I know several Albion season ticket holders who admit to Brighton being there second team, even though they were born here and support their first team over the Albion sat in their seat at the Amex when the two clash. It is a fact, and I know there are many more out there.

Well I don't know anyone like that. So, to summarise; you think this discussion about ways to improve the atmosphere at the Amex is embarrassing, and anyway it won't work because we are overrun with second team supporters. I wonder if this same atmosphere debate on the West Ham, Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea, etc. forums arrives at the same conclusion because their fan-base is infiltrated by part time Brighton fans?

 

[Moshe Gariani]

E-mail sent to PB. :cringetastic:

(p.s. Kyren Wilson won on the final pink...)

 

[father_and_son]

How many would you say are in the "NSK" proper now? Is it quite a small group actually under the police box? Do you think it would work if you stayed where you are and others came into the area nearby but not actually under the box?

I can't speak for NSK as a group and wouldn't want to. However, from what I have seen in the last couple of seasons being in amongst them, there are maybe half a dozen 'starters' (ones who will, at volume, scream out the trigger words/phrases to get a chant started). Then I'd say you have maybe 2 dozen 'loud singers' scattered around the area (under the box, a block either side, up to 10-12 rows down from the back). These are the ones that will drive the noise as wide as we can get it. Then I'd estimate 60-80 or so 'singers' who will actively participate in most chants, but only after the first two groups have got the ball rolling. Then I'd guess another 100 or so 'part timers' happy to join in with 'Albion, Albion', 'Seagulls' & 'Withdean to Wembley' but need the game to be going our way and the crowd already active to join in with, say, 'Brighton Aces' or 'Glory Glory'.

As a group, they have been hugely welcoming of us and I don't sense any suggestion of egos at play regarding Police Box Vs Big Screen... We try but genuinely can't hear the Left Side most of the time.

Anyone moving into this area, willing to belt out the songs will be welcome I'm sure!

Ask them to move? Like the rest of the ground, people are very possessive of their seats and it would take a lot to shift this lot, just as it would most groups who have been sitting together since the Amex was built and beyond.


EDIT: Back to the key thing here. Most chants have a trigger... Normally the first or last few words that gets the Police Box making noise. If that trigger phrase were audible elsewhere (say under the Big Screen and maybe in SWC) then more could/would join in and NSK would join in with chants started elsewhere.
I definitely wouldn't advocate 'piped crowd noises' around the ground, but if two-way mic/speakers could be arranged to link the key groups (subtly) then I personally believe you'd get a massive increase in noise, eliminate a lots of the complaints about multiple chants and put the rest of the ground on notice that we do want/expect some noise to spur the team on!

 

[SAC]

Unless people are prepared to accept that people could be moved from the seat that they have previously sat in, nothing will happen as there just isn't room. There just aren't enough people who admit that there is a problem or want to find a solution to make it worth it for the club to upset those who will need to move.

Perhaps if safe standing is ever introduced it could be used as an excuse to move people and introduce a singing section.