How much longer will the NHS be around for?

[Chicken Runner61]

The privatisation of the nhs would nt be to bad as long as it was reflected in national insurance contribution s.so much of tax payers money is wasted with miss management this week I ve seen 250 000 pounds thats in a week one trust through miss management and its like this nation wide.

Miss Management is she related to Miss Informed? I've seen as much wastage and poor management in privatised industries as there probably is in anything public.

 

[Chicken Runner61]

If he is rich then he is contributing lots to the funding of the NHS and we need more and more who can do this as the population ages

But he won't be if its privatised will he ? thats the point!

 

[Triggaaar]

you are well off aren't you Beorthelm? because if you are not you are very very naive.

Just like the rest of the country then

 

[Hampster Gull]

But he won't be if its privatised will he ? thats the point!

by privatised i assume you mean not free at the point of use? If so i think you are wrong, no party will win an election on that whilst we are alive. If you mean the private sector providing medical services alongside the NHS then yes of couse that will happen and all will be fine

 

[beorhthelm]

Yay Tory boy is back always defending their crap economics and policies.

Hope you are rich and never need the NHS ? you are well off aren't you Beorthelm? because if you are not you are very very naive.

bless, personal insults. dodging the first point that the supposedly socialist French health system that so many admire charge for GP appointments. ignoring the second point that today there's no policy to change the current system. if you have sight of future policy please let us know. i've used the NHS aplenty in the years, as have my family and extended family thanks, and my only complaint has been archaic GP process and systems stuck in the 1950s.

 

[Chicken Runner61]

by privatised i assume you mean not free at the point of use? If so i think you are wrong, no party will win an election on that whilst we are alive. If you mean the private sector providing medical services alongside the NHS then yes of couse that will happen and all will be fine

The private sector already provide medical services for the NHS - It was brought in ages ages ago, its one of the things that makes the NHS costly to run - Everything will be privatised eventually including your GP its just a matter on time. Don't worry you will be able to go on line and get free advice for any ailments

 

[Chicken Runner61]

bless, personal insults. dodging the first point that the supposedly socialist French health system that so many admire charge for GP appointments. ignoring the second point that today there's no policy to change the current system. if you have sight of future policy please let us know. i've used the NHS aplenty in the years, as have my family and extended family thanks, and my only complaint has been archaic GP process and systems stuck in the 1950s.

Oh what this admired system....

Nevetheless, the system is under severe financial pressure, there is a growing shortage of suitable staff in many regions, and a higher proportion of the running costs are having to be picked up by patients.
At an institutional level the organisation and financing of the system is complex and is often characterised by high levels of tension between the various parts of the system.

Most health professionals who work outside of hospitals are self-employed and depend for their income on fee paying patients whose costs are reimbursed by the social security and voluntary health insurance systems.

Patients, in turn, have been allowed to have unrestricted access to doctors and specialists with the result that no-one in the health system has had any particular incentive to keep down costs.

Over the past few years the government has introduced a series of reforms, the whole purpose of which is to increase efficiency and drive down costs. These reforms are on-going.
Social security health contributions have been increased, as have fees for medical consultations, whilst reimbursement levels have been reduced.

At an administrative level everyone is now required to register with a doctor to obtain the full level of reimbursement, medical records for patients are to be introduced, and there have been some reforms to the institutional structure.

Continuing concern about rising costs has resulted in stronger controls by government limiting the freedom of professionals and patients and controls on the prices of drugs.

To anyone from outside of France some of these reforms may appear logical and long overdue, but there is widespread concern in France about their impact.

Many health professionals consider the changes are too bureaucratic, and there are many commentators who consider that the costs of health care are going to increasingly fall upon poorer members of the community and those who are ill.

In short, like most other developed nations, France can no longer afford its health service.

 

[yxee]

More toys out the pram ... the NHS is going nowhere. And they say Tories are the ones with the scare stories...

 

[Hampster Gull]

The private sector already provide medical services for the NHS - It was brought in ages ages ago, its one of the things that makes the NHS costly to run - Everything will be privatised eventually including your GP its just a matter on time. Don't worry you will be able to go on line and get free advice for any ailments

Ok, so you mean fully privatised. I disagree, it would be election sucide and the one thing all politicians want is votes and power. But say you are right then the tories will be voted out snd you will get labour in who can reverse it all.

 

[Chicken Runner61]

bless, personal insults. dodging the first point that the supposedly socialist French health system that so many admire charge for GP appointments. ignoring the second point that today there's no policy to change the current system. if you have sight of future policy please let us know. i've used the NHS aplenty in the years, as have my family and extended family thanks, and my only complaint has been archaic GP process and systems stuck in the 1950s.

Or this one?

http://www.bloomberg.com/bw/articles/2013-01-03/frances-health-care-system-is-going-broke

 

[beorhthelm]

...In short, like most other developed nations, France can no longer afford its health service.

and, especially the concise conclusion, the article could have been written of the NHS.

 

[Chicken Runner61]

More toys out the pram ... the NHS is going nowhere. And they say Tories are the ones with the scare stories...

£1.5m donated by private health-care investors to the Conservative Party, and £1.5bn worth of NHS contracts granted to private health firms would intimate you are wrong

 

[Chicken Runner61]

and, especially the concise conclusion, the article could have been written of the NHS.

But it wasn't was it - half nay most of the reason the NHS is costing too much is down to the people you defend and the policies that started underThatcher and co to undermine the NHS by bringing in managers and accountants and then private companies to justify privatisation.

 

[Hampster Gull]

But it wasn't was it - half nay most of the reason the NHS is costing too much is down to the people you defend and the policies that started underThatcher and co to undermine the NHS by bringing in managers and accountants and then private companies to justify privatisation.

Ah, the let the nhs spend as much as it wants line. it needs no financial discipline or constraints.

 

[yxee]

£1.5m donated by private health-care investors to the Conservative Party, and £1.5bn worth of NHS contracts granted to private health firms would intimate you are wrong

So the NHS outsources jobs to the private sector. Why would that mean it is not likely to be around for much longer? This is more about certain people's pathological fears of the private sector than it is about any genuine risk to free healthcare at the point of service.

 

[beorhthelm]

But it wasn't was it - half nay most of the reason the NHS is costing too much is down to the people you defend and the policies that started underThatcher and co to undermine the NHS by bringing in managers and accountants and then private companies to justify privatisation.

im confused now because i wasnt defending anyone, just opposing your view of how the system will apparently change so quickly.

as for the cost, your myopic partisan view cant see whats in front of you, even when conveyed from an independent thrid party comment on a foreign system: the cost to health services are down to the demands upon it, not political or economic structures.

 

[Chicken Runner61]

im confused now because i wasnt defending anyone, just opposing your view of how the system will apparently change so quickly.

as for the cost, your myopic partisan view cant see whats in front of you, even when conveyed from an independent thrid party comment on a foreign system: the cost to health services are down to the demands upon it, not political or economic structures.

You really cannot be that stupid - You know dam well the costs to the NHS are being manipulated by using private firms to do work that the NHS could do if properly funded - its being used politically and economically to turn it into a state insurance provider not a state deliverer.

You know the aim is to privatise the whole lot and leave a pauper's service for anyone that can't afford insurance. Thats what been planned all along

 

[RexCathedra]

Ten years. By then it's just an insurance clearing-house.

There'll be some lump-sum grants to councils to make sure the number of people dying in doorways is kept to an acceptable minimum. This will be called 'The NHS' so no one can say 'You did away with the NHS!' without Tories pointing to it and saying "No, we didn't! It's right here!"

The subventions will shrink every year, and eventually will be such that no practitioners will take, or can afford to take, patients under the scheme anyways.

It's the best part of what the US has today, and what Paul Ryan and the GOP want to roll out whenever they get a compliant president to not-veto the legislation.

Good luck. You've had such success emulating our post-secondary education funding model, why not try again?

 

[Flex Your Head]

A 'company' exists for one reason, and one reason alone: to make a profit. It's as simple as that. Private or PLC, it's all about making money and hitting targets.

I don't want a company deciding my mother's cancer treatment.

I don't want a company deciding which patients can generate a profit for them and which can't.


Before the last election David Cameron repeatedly promised that there would be no more top down reorganisations of the NHS. This was repeated in the Coalition Agreement.

“So I make this commitment to the NHS and all who work in it. No more pointless reorganisations.”
David Cameron, speech to Conservative Party conference, 4 October 2006

“The NHS needs no more pointless organisational upheaval. It needs no more top-down reorganisations.”
Andrew Lansley, Conservative Party press release, 11 July 2007

"But first I want to tell you what we're not going to do. There will be no more of those pointless re-organisations that aim for change but instead bring chaos."
David Cameron, speech to the Royal College of Nursing, 11 May 2009

“With the Conservatives there will be no more of the tiresome, meddlesome, top-down re-structures that have dominated the last decade of the NHS.”
David Cameron, speech at the Royal College of Pathologists, 2 November 2009

"We will stop the top-down reorganisations of the NHS that have got in the way of patient care."
Coalition Agreement, 20 May 2010, p. 24


Within weeks, and despite opposition from health professionals, patients and the public, the Tories imposed the biggest top-down reorganisation in NHS history.

Since then, over £852,000,000 has been spent on redundancy payments to NHS staff at primary care trusts and strategic health authorities.

But hey, you Tories just carry on making out that anyone who raises a concern is misguided or worse. I've got 6 family members working in the NHS all of whom are genuinely gobsmacked at the shit that is happening but not being reported.

You'll miss it when it's gone.

 

[Kosmonaut]

You know the aim is to privatise the whole lot and leave a pauper's service for anyone that can't afford insurance. Thats what been planned all along

[citation needed]