How Long Will Gordon Brown Hang On

[Ernest]

Brown is reaping what he sowed when he plotted to get rid of an elected PM in Tony Blair so he can't have any complaints if someone plots to get rid of him

 

[Super Steve Earle]

They should all go & Brown should call a General Election.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Has somebody hacked into your NSc account BoF? Or are you a completely different person than I'd sort of assumed you were as a result of your cumulative posts? Not that it matters either way

Oh, and I think you'll find the fly guys in the City strangely muted on the alleged failings of Brown & Darling - who saved the vast majority of their worthless skins

Merely a bit of late evening posturing. No offence intended.

Of course they are going to be muted. As you say, B & D saved their skins, but B & D (plus Blair) are partly responsible for the massive debt we find ourselves in. Outright greed from an alleged socialist party. All contributing parties have been relatively silent over the mess they have created. Thankfully, for the financial industry, the expenses scam has taken the heat off them. I wonder if the MPs are spitting in Mr Baker's coffee?

 

[NMH]

Brown and Darling have steered us out of the near-terminal evil inflicted on us by scumbag greedhead bankers and coked-up low-IQ barrowboy traders. Brown has had a thoroughly rotten throw of the dice, but when the country's main concern is some creep fiddling a tenner on expenses for a couple of porn videos, rather than focussing on the near-collapse of the global banking system, then yeah, sure, it's not power worth clinging to. The Tories Dumb & Dumber, Cameron & Osborne, aren't fit to lick Brown & darling's boots. But f*** it, fair enough, vote 'em in, if that's what you feel. And the very best of luck

Having witnessed the debacle that The United States of America created by stalling Government and national security for 2 WHOLE YEARS because of an extremely insignificant sexual tryst by Bill Clinton - from which the GW Bush 'led' government sneaked in and f***ed up the World, I can see that the idiots of Britain are ready to emulate that in a sensitive time economically.
The tories can blame labour for the ensuing mess (as they have been doing anyway, despite their own desperately untidy closet), until the working man realises he's been screwed, easily fooled again by Maggie-worshipping c***s.
They will mostly deserve it.

 

[NMH]

Brown is reaping what he sowed when he plotted to get rid of an elected PM in Tony Blair so he can't have any complaints if someone plots to get rid of him

Good point, and one that Brown did have coming for acting the part of Brutus.
Still, let's not forget that we are riding in the trough of the WORLD financial wave, and no party could really have single-handedly steered a course away from that fact.

For all the French and German complaints, our dip in the pound for the last period might have stimulated enough attraction from international business - I am seeing/hearing a lot of foreign tourists around, and the pound appears to be picking up a little now. A 'sterling plan' that could possibly turn the ridiculed forecast for optimism into an early recoup for this country.
But hush my mouth, any talk about green shoots of recovery is a punishable offence in this country. I must away to fall on my sword.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

alright then, what do you base your prediction on apart from watching far too much hyperbolic rolling news?

I'm a radio 4 man, not keen on 24 hour news.

Prediction - labour get wiped out in both local and European elections. Big gains for Ukip in european election (they're the far right party people will allow themselves to vote for), gains for tories, libs dems and greens.

Back benchers panic and the growing revolt becomes and a tidal wave.

Brown looks like a dead man walking. He is making John Major look like Barack Obama.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Good point, and one that Brown did have coming for acting the part of Brutus.
Still, let's not forget that we are riding in the trough of the WORLD financial wave, and no party could really have single-handedly steered a course away from that fact.

Really?

 

[larus]

If I recall the figures correctly, about 25% of our countries' GDP has been generated from the financial services sector. So, all you lefties are very happy to have the corporation tax revenues, income tax revenues for the bonuses, stamp duty from the purchase of these over-inflated house prices and VAT receipts for these banking buffoons spending excess, (which get used to fund the inefficient and wasteful public sector), but then moan like f*** when it goes wrong (and somehow still blame the Tories).

The problem with this countries budget deficit is down to 'Dear Prudence' and 'Hello Darling'.
GB -I've abolished Boom and Bust.
GB -Balance the budget over the business cycle. Oh, I think I'll change the cycle now, and again, oh, and again.
GB -Only borrow to invest.

How many times did he announce in budgets new spending which happended to be a repeat of announcements from previous budgets?

He's incompetent, unelected as the PM, and has been responsible for overseeing the worst financial crisis for a century, yet some pepople still think he and Labour are doing a good job. Please, tell me what you think doing a bad job would be, because I would love to work for people like you.

 

[The Merry Prankster]

Brown and Darling have steered us out of the near-terminal evil inflicted on us by scumbag greedhead bankers and coked-up low-IQ barrowboy traders. Brown has had a thoroughly rotten throw of the dice, but when the country's main concern is some creep fiddling a tenner on expenses for a couple of porn videos, rather than focussing on the near-collapse of the global banking system, then yeah, sure, it's not power worth clinging to. The Tories Dumb & Dumber, Cameron & Osborne, aren't fit to lick Brown & darling's boots. But f*** it, fair enough, vote 'em in, if that's what you feel. And the very best of luck

I agree about the origin of the problem but if you think Brown has steered us out then I think you are in for a big shock. Whatever one´s politics this government (and Brown in particular) are not fit for purpose as I believe modern people say.

 

[vulture]

its crazy and stupid infighting by labour with a f***ing election tommorow

 

[cunning fergus]

Brown and Darling have steered us out of the near-terminal evil inflicted on us by scumbag greedhead bankers and coked-up low-IQ barrowboy traders. Brown has had a thoroughly rotten throw of the dice, but when the country's main concern is some creep fiddling a tenner on expenses for a couple of porn videos, rather than focussing on the near-collapse of the global banking system, then yeah, sure, it's not power worth clinging to. The Tories Dumb & Dumber, Cameron & Osborne, aren't fit to lick Brown & darling's boots. But f*** it, fair enough, vote 'em in, if that's what you feel. And the very best of luck

The unelected PM Brown has royally f***ed this country, and not least the core Labour voting working class. His scandalous decision to raid on Pension funds as Chancellor in 1997 should have left us in no doubt about how he operates. Spin forward a few years and we have the 10p tax change; such is his regard for the workers.

The FSA is the child of the Labour Govt and possesed in statute all the necessry powers to prevent the banking crisis. The reality was however that the Govt let the FSA give the banks an easy ride because of the tax revenues they were generating.

That is record levels of revenue by the way and soon pissed up the wall. The state of this country's finances is a national scandal and not withstanding the bank bailout which would not have been so painful had (a) the banks been better supervised and (b) debt reduced. Instead we had rank profligacy and now we are nearing deby of 80% GDP not including pensions and PFI projects.

If you want to see how bad things are keep an eye on the Gilt auctions because if the take-up drops off from current levels the BOE will not be able to hide it with quantitive easing.

As for the expenses crisis and how important it is I think the fact that the likes of Darling (and others) can excuse their fraudulent claims due to being busy etc. is a f***ing outrage. How many busy people have been charged by the HMRC because of genuine errors on their Tax returns!!!!

And there is the rub, most people are not surprised that the Tory's are involved in the expenses scandal, but it is the betrayal of the working class by those that purport to represent them that hurts more.............not that 'old money' Harman, Woodward, Follet or the other new socialist millionaires would understand that.

 

[The Merry Prankster]

The unelected PM Brown has royally f***ed this country, and not least the core Labour voting working class. His scandalous decision to raid on Pension funds as Chancellor in 1997 should have left us in no doubt about how he operates. Spin forward a few years and we have the 10p tax change; such is his regard for the workers.

The FSA is the child of the Labour Govt and possesed in statute all the necessry powers to prevent the banking crisis. The reality was however that the Govt let the FSA give the banks an easy ride because of the tax revenues they were generating.

That is record levels of revenue by the way and soon pissed up the wall. The state of this country's finances is a national scandal and not withstanding the bank bailout which would not have been so painful had (a) the banks been better supervised and (b) debt reduced. Instead we had rank profligacy and now we are nearing deby of 80% GDP not including pensions and PFI projects.

If you want to see how bad things are keep an eye on the Gilt auctions because if the take-up drops off from current levels the BOE will not be able to hide it with quantitive easing.

As for the expenses crisis and how important it is I think the fact that the likes of Darling (and others) can excuse their fraudulent claims due to being busy etc. is a f***ing outrage. How many busy people have been charged by the HMRC because of genuine errors on their Tax returns!!!!

And there is the rub, most people are not surprised that the Tory's are involved in the expenses scandal, but it is the betrayal of the working class by those that purport to represent them that hurts more.............not that 'old money' Harman, Woodward, Follet or the other new socialist millionaires would understand that.

Spot on. If you can´t see the betrayal then ideology has blinded you.

 

[sten_super]

The unelected PM Brown has royally f***ed this country, and not least the core Labour voting working class. His scandalous decision to raid on Pension funds as Chancellor in 1997 should have left us in no doubt about how he operates. Spin forward a few years and we have the 10p tax change; such is his regard for the workers.

The FSA is the child of the Labour Govt and possesed in statute all the necessry powers to prevent the banking crisis. The reality was however that the Govt let the FSA give the banks an easy ride because of the tax revenues they were generating.

That is record levels of revenue by the way and soon pissed up the wall. The state of this country's finances is a national scandal and not withstanding the bank bailout which would not have been so painful had (a) the banks been better supervised and (b) debt reduced. Instead we had rank profligacy and now we are nearing deby of 80% GDP not including pensions and PFI projects.

If you want to see how bad things are keep an eye on the Gilt auctions because if the take-up drops off from current levels the BOE will not be able to hide it with quantitive easing.

As for the expenses crisis and how important it is I think the fact that the likes of Darling (and others) can excuse their fraudulent claims due to being busy etc. is a f***ing outrage. How many busy people have been charged by the HMRC because of genuine errors on their Tax returns!!!!

And there is the rub, most people are not surprised that the Tory's are involved in the expenses scandal, but it is the betrayal of the working class by those that purport to represent them that hurts more.............not that 'old money' Harman, Woodward, Follet or the other new socialist millionaires would understand that.

Absolutely cracking post.

I absolutely can't understand the level of support Brown gets, from the very people who's pension pots he completed destroyed in 1997. He then talks about no more boom and bust, 'justifying' incredibly high spending during a boom period, and leads the country into record levels of debt when the bust inevitably happens. Yeah, good job Gordon

 

[Acker79]

The problem is that the majority of people have conveniently forgotten how it was to live through the 18 years of the previous administration. Labour have f***ed up big time and now we are all going to pay for it.

No.

The problem is that we live in a country with lots of different opinions and lifestyles in it. There are a lot of people who are better off under a tory government, and they want that life back.

There are people who generally have ok lives under tory and under labour. But life isn't so great at the moment. Since labour are in charge, they get the blame.

So we have the tory supporters and the floating voters who all want rid of the labour government.

Things will eventually change, but they'll enjoy life for a while at first. Then the resentment from those whose life is better under labour will start to grow, and/or something else will come along and the floating voters will become dissatisfied with the conservative government and they will switch back to labour.

It's the cyclical nature of politics where there are two, or two main, parties.


There's also the generation factor. I was born in 79, the tories were already in power. There are an entire generation of people who had great childhoods, "never had to worry about paedophiles", never had to worry about knife crime, or violent crime in general, never had bad experience with taxes or money, completely unwaware of the financial struggles of our parents, this generation remember a better time, and the tories were in charge then.

It's not that we've forgotten how it was under the tories, we have a different experience of those times.

Your life under tories may not have been a picnic, doesn't mean everyone's or life in general was.

 

[simmo]

Laughable. The bankers were creaming it, UNDER the WATCH of Blair/Brown and their failed little banking big brother. They were only rumbled when the faux boom that Labour orchestrated collapsed.

They were not geniuses for fixing a global catastrophe. The solution? Put the country in a record level of debt to paper over their mismanagement and failure to see the tell-tale signs of economic trouble. Lokki 7 predicted a crash long before the smile was wiped off the faces of that one-eyed scottish twonk and the uber-browed Mr Darling.

Dumb and Dumber? I am quite surprised you didn't throw in Public School cretins or something much similar. Your regular tirades against the 'Eton crew' says much more about you than it does about them. Let me guess. You see yourself as some sort of Working Class man done good, socialist leaning, but happy to operate and reap the benefits of the capitalist system.

Totally correct.

How can Brown NOT get the majority of the blame for the state of the economy of this country. He has been either Chancellor or Prime Minister for the last 12 years!!! If the buck doesn't stop with him then who?

If your argument is greedy bankers they were only operating under the "light touch" conditions that Chancellor Brown allowed them to operate in and could have changed with government legislation during any time in his 12 years in high office.

 

[Gwylan]

Totally correct.

How can Brown NOT get the majority of the blame for the state of the economy of this country. He has been either Chancellor or Prime Minister for the last 12 years!!! If the buck doesn't stop with him then who?

If your argument is greedy bankers they were only operating under the "light touch" conditions that Chancellor Brown allowed them to operate in and could have changed with government legislation during any time in his 12 years in high office.

I don't disagree with any of this. What perplexes me though is why anyone thinks the Tories would have been any different - the usual Conservative complaint is that there's too much government regulation and not too little (I know you're not saying that specifically BTW).

I think that Brown has made a complete cawl mwch (to use a Welsh expression) of the economy and there's no way that I'd vote for him but I honestly can't see why the Conservatives would have been any different nor that they have the solutions to get us out of the mess.

 

[Don't get me started]

The unelected PM Brown has royally f***ed this country, and not least the core Labour voting working class. His scandalous decision to raid on Pension funds as Chancellor in 1997 should have left us in no doubt about how he operates. Spin forward a few years and we have the 10p tax change; such is his regard for the workers.

The FSA is the child of the Labour Govt and possesed in statute all the necessry powers to prevent the banking crisis. The reality was however that the Govt let the FSA give the banks an easy ride because of the tax revenues they were generating.

That is record levels of revenue by the way and soon pissed up the wall. The state of this country's finances is a national scandal and not withstanding the bank bailout which would not have been so painful had (a) the banks been better supervised and (b) debt reduced. Instead we had rank profligacy and now we are nearing deby of 80% GDP not including pensions and PFI projects.

If you want to see how bad things are keep an eye on the Gilt auctions because if the take-up drops off from current levels the BOE will not be able to hide it with quantitive easing.

As for the expenses crisis and how important it is I think the fact that the likes of Darling (and others) can excuse their fraudulent claims due to being busy etc. is a f***ing outrage. How many busy people have been charged by the HMRC because of genuine errors on their Tax returns!!!!

And there is the rub, most people are not surprised that the Tory's are involved in the expenses scandal, but it is the betrayal of the working class by those that purport to represent them that hurts more.............not that 'old money' Harman, Woodward, Follet or the other new socialist millionaires would understand that.

What he said except to add that by fuelling the boom with extra revenues through his 66 or so stealth taxes, from 1997, my 10 year old daughter could have been chancellor and not done a bad job either. He is a con man in my book, and dont even think about getting me on the errotion of civil liberties and how he is destroying this country or I may explode

 

[simmo]

I don't disagree with any of this. What perplexes me though is why anyone thinks the Tories would have been any different - the usual Conservative complaint is that there's too much government regulation and not too little (I know you're not saying that specifically BTW).

I think that Brown has made a complete cawl mwch (to use a Welsh expression) of the economy and there's no way that I'd vote for him but I honestly can't see why the Conservatives would have been any different nor that they have the solutions to get us out of the mess.

My personal opinion is that I think we would be in a similar situation if the Tories were in power too, but that is the beauty of being in opposition, Cameron et al can say we wouldn't have done it like this and we will never know.

The events that are occuring at the moment are global and nothing the Tories could have done would have prevented that but what they can say is that if they were in charge we would be in a better position to deal with the situation.

They can offer evidence that when times were good Brown was blowing money like it was going out of fashion. I can remember them running an advertising campaign saying how many government appointed civil servants there were (the advert had a load of bowler hats) and that these were not "real" jobs just people pushing paper around. They can also say things like that they wouldn't have sold the gold off at almost the lowest price imaginable.

The main charge really against Brown in my opinion that when times were good he blew all the revenues on nonsence and things that we have nothing to show for, now times are bad and it is a rainy day, we have no money and have to borrow, borrow, borrow, leaving a long standing belief that many non Labour voters have in that the Labour party cannot be trusted with the economy are spendthrift and leave us always in huge financial difficulties.

 

[Dr Q]

Is it just me, or does Hazel Blears have a face you just couldn't tire of punching!

 

[mr sheen]

Is it just me, or does Hazel Blears have a face you just couldn't tire of punching!

To quote Frank Skinner, who was at the time talking of Bonny Langford, a face you can't help but expect monkey shit to come out of.