How do you think Boris has handled it so far ?

[pb21]

I would like to know what the Government's analysis of the virus and their latest modelling is.

The UK lock-down originally came after the Imperial model/study with 100 of thousands of deaths, which was effectively endorsed by the UK Government. Presumably far more data is now available so a more representative model can be undertaken?

We hear anecdotally that significantly large numbers of people may have already had this but I haven't heard anything from the UK government or their advisers on this issue?

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

I would like to know what the Government's analysis of the virus and their latest modelling is.

The UK lock-down originally came after the Imperial model/study with 100 of thousands of deaths, which was effectively endorsed by the UK Government. Presumably far more data is now available so a more representative model can be undertaken?

We hear anecdotally that significantly large numbers of people may have already had this but I haven't heard anything from the UK government or their advisers on this issue?

I can’t believe this isn’t being mentioned more by the media.

Getting more tests on people who think they may have had it back in Jan.

If it’s been around since then it puts the death figures in a completely different light - said without talking down those who have died.

There could be millions that have had it.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Really, have you got examples of the people that were clamouring for the lockdown and are now wanting it opened up or are you just making it up to suit your agenda. What people, including Starmer, are asking for is details of what the plan will aim to be when the situation is right.

What is disrespectful to those working to save lives is blindly believing this government has done and is doing a good job.

They keep telling us that their decisions are based on scientific advice but refuse to identify who those scientists are and we now find out that Johnson's bosom buddy has been attending the meetings and, according to some that are in the meetings, has been more involved than some of the scientists would like. Yet we aren't told any of this by the government.

I don't have an agenda, I didn't vote in last election as I am not a Johnson lover and certainly wouldn't place my vote elsewhere. The examples are in this thread if you look.

As far as bosom buddies go there's been far worse in the Blair and Thatcher governments!!

 

[e77]

Getting commuters back on public transport is going to be a major problem. Apparently a commuter train going up from the coast can have 1,000 people on it when it pulls into London Bridge. We are a while away from get 1,000 people in one place anywhere else so why should trains be different?

As for masks I get they reduce the spread of the disease but my understanding is they only stop it going so far as opposed to eliminating it entirely. On packed public transport there is basically no space between people and you have to grab hold of almost anything to not fall over unless you can get a seat.

Also it would mean everyone actually having a mask and have someone police it on a train where you can't walk down the carriages.

 

[Albion Dan]

Can anyone who is comparing us with Sweden please give some justification as to how this is a valid comparison, please?

I’ve seen Norway and Sweden compared which naturally makes far more sense. FWIW, Sweden have had around 2,200 deaths and Norway have had 200. I’d be far more inclined to believe Norway have got it ‘right’ rather than Sweden.

Swedens economy will be in far better shape and therefore for more likely to avoid the probable huge amounts of deaths (far exceeding Covid) resultant in the inevitable economic collapse driven by prolonged lock down.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Getting commuters back on public transport is going to be a major problem. Apparently a commuter train going up from the coast can have 1,000 people on it when it pulls into London Bridge. We are a while away from get 1,000 people in one place anywhere else so why should trains be different?

As for masks I get they reduce the spread of the disease but my understanding is they only stop it going so far as opposed to eliminating it entirely. On packed public transport there is basically no space between people and you have to grab hold of almost anything to not fall over unless you can get a seat.

Also it would mean everyone actually having a mask and have someone police it on a train where you can't walk down the carriages.

What would be good is if there was a study to see how many of these commuters were able to continue with their work while at home and how efficient they were/are.Obviously some need to be physically at their workplaces but this could see a revolution in how many people conduct their business.

 

[Albion Dan]

Getting commuters back on public transport is going to be a major problem. Apparently a commuter train going up from the coast can have 1,000 people on it when it pulls into London Bridge. We are a while away from get 1,000 people in one place anywhere else so why should trains be different?

As for masks I get they reduce the spread of the disease but my understanding is they only stop it going so far as opposed to eliminating it entirely. On packed public transport there is basically no space between people and you have to grab hold of almost anything to not fall over unless you can get a seat.

Also it would mean everyone actually having a mask and have someone police it on a train where you can't walk down the carriages.

There will be capacity controls. We are looking to introduce mandatory reservations.

 

[Jimmy Grimble]

Swedens economy will be in far better shape and therefore for more likely to avoid the probable huge amounts of deaths (far exceeding Covid) resultant in the inevitable economic collapse driven by prolonged lock down.

Any evidence or data to back this up?

 

[Jimmy Grimble]

Norway have half the population but obviously haven't yet had half the death rate of Sweden, not even close. But Sweden on their way to herd immunity and Norway isn't. The virus has't been halted. There's no cure and despite all the optimism, there might not be one for years.

After a while, Norwegians will have to unlock their doors and go outside so they'll be looking at a similar deaths per 1000 rate. But they might also have to contend with an economy in recession and possibly a lowered immunity.

Sweden also has double the population density of Norway, which will affect things too.

You have no evidence to guarantee that they will be looking at a similar death rate though do you?

 

[beorhthelm]

There will be capacity controls. We are looking to introduce mandatory reservations.

on the railways? cant see that working at busier stations, or managing the East Croydon scrum.

 

[RossyG]

You have no evidence to guarantee that they will be looking at a similar death rate though do you?

No, as I said lower population density could be a factor, but I can’t see how hiding indoors a couple of months will change that much. They won’t spontaneously develop an immunity.

 

[CheeseRolls]

No, as I said lower population density could be a factor, but I can’t see how hiding indoors a couple of months will change that much. They won’t spontaneously develop an immunity.

I am getting frustrated with reading your posts. It is like watching someone who thinks they are a juggler, but they can never manage with more than two balls and yet every day here you are saying watch me I'm a juggler.

Slowing the spread of the virus through isolation, ensures that capacity for critical care beds is not exceeded.
It is not a case that people who were going to die will die anyway. This simplistic argument is insulting to all the critical care staff who are putting themselves at risk to save lives on a daily basis.
This a novel virus, it has been around for less than a year and Herd Immunity is not a given.
Lessons are being learnt and shared on a daily basis around the world on what forms of treatment are most effective and on how to best avoid spreading infection. These will result in lives being saved.

Clearly there is a massive economic impact to isolation. Sweden has chosen this course, because it believes that the Healthcare provision and the number of ICU beds available was sufficient to cope. This is so far removed from where the UK was at the start of this year and even now, where we have the Nightingale hospitals and no staff.

 

[RossyG]

I am getting frustrated with reading your posts. It is like watching someone who thinks they are a juggler, but they can never manage with more than two balls and yet every day here you are saying watch me I'm a juggler.

Don’t read them then. But this might interest you.

An Israeli scientist called Isaac Ben-Israel has studied data from all over the world and says that infections follow the same trajectory no matter how tight or loose the restrictions. He says:

“It turns out that a similar pattern — rapid increase in infections that reaches a peak in the sixth week and declines from the eighth week — is common to all countries in which the disease was discovered, regardless of their response policies.”

 

[Albion Dan]

Any evidence or data to back this up?

Common sense. All their shops and enterprises are trading. If you want evidence on the drastic impact on mortality from long term recession and poverty I can find you plenty, as can you with a simple google search. Trust me the way we are heading it will make covid death look insignificant.

Sweden claims success:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...ys-herd-immunity-imminent/ar-BB12T5Rt?ocid=sf

 

[Albion Dan]

Sweden has chosen this course, because it believes that the Healthcare provision and the number of ICU beds available was sufficient to cope. This is so far removed from where the UK was at the start of this year and even now, where we have the Nightingale hospitals and no staff.

Even now? Really? The articles I've seen suggest the Nightingale hospitals have staff but nowhere near getting any patients as the beds aren't needed. Still plenty in normal hospitals, which incidentally away from Covid and ICU are like ghost towns as people who need help are having life expectancy reduced and worst as they are unable to get the treatment of have the operations they need.

 

[vegster]

The majority of the British people are willing our Government to succeed and defeat this ******* virus, then there is the Shills and the Lord Haw-Haws itching for our democratically elected government to fail.
I won’t forgive or forget these shysters that love to make mischief.

Easy to forget that one persons freedom fighter is another persons terrorist. Love the quote about Lord Haw Haw, a British born fascist convert who swapped sides during a war, does that imply questioning of the government makes you #TeamCoronavirus then ? The death toll is still terrible and care workers are daily putting their lives at risk and they must be supported and defended at all costs, no political shenanigans should be allowed to restrict obtaining PPE and ventilators.

I think you will find that people are not itching for the government to fail, the government are failing already, they are agitating for the government to get itself organised. The overall poor performance by the government spokesmen while Johnson has been absent has only magnified the problems, Johnson will have to punch well above his weight in order to get on top of the testing, PPE and Lockdown reductions.

And will you forgive and forget that if Johnson takes the common sense option to extend the Brexit Transition period due to the huge backlog of legislation that has not been agreed, will you become a Lord Haw Haw or will you scuttle back under a rock like you did the last time Brexit was delayed ? It might help to remember that the greatest British Prime Minister we ever had ( You know the one ) frequently found himself in opposition to his own party and his own government before being in the right place at the right time, but that was forgiven and forgotten.

 

[Baker lite]

Easy to forget that one persons freedom fighter is another persons terrorist. Love the quote about Lord Haw Haw, a British born fascist convert who swapped sides during a war, does that imply questioning of the government makes you #TeamCoronavirus then ? The death toll is still terrible and care workers are daily putting their lives at risk and they must be supported and defended at all costs, no political shenanigans should be allowed to restrict obtaining PPE and ventilators.

I think you will find that people are not itching for the government to fail, the government are failing already, they are agitating for the government to get itself organised. The overall poor performance by the government spokesmen while Johnson has been absent has only magnified the problems, Johnson will have to punch well above his weight in order to get on top of the testing, PPE and Lockdown reductions.

And will you forgive and forget that if Johnson takes the common sense option to extend the Brexit Transition period due to the huge backlog of legislation that has not been agreed, will you become a Lord Haw Haw or will you scuttle back under a rock like you did the last time Brexit was delayed ? It might help to remember that the greatest British Prime Minister we ever had ( You know the one ) frequently found himself in opposition to his own party and his own government before being in the right place at the right time, but that was forgiven and forgotten.

‘Germany calling’...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Machiavelli]

Hiding indoors isn’t a cure. There is no cure. It’s just a delay.

But if people under forty who aren’t obese or have any serious health conditions went back to “normal” albeit it with social distancing then we could start working on herd immunity and they could also volunteer to donate blood with antibodies, which seems to do the trick.

You are Dominic Cummings, and I claim my £5.

 

[dazzer6666]

I can’t believe this isn’t being mentioned more by the media.

Getting more tests on people who think they may have had it back in Jan.

If it’s been around since then it puts the death figures in a completely different light - said without talking down those who have died.

There could be millions that have had it.

...........because there is no reliable antibody test developed/available yet. Simple.

 

[RossyG]

You are Dominic Cummings, and I claim my £5.

Didn't you already do that joke?

But if he said that then I agree with him.