How do you think Boris has handled it so far ? June edition

[oldboyroy]

Dare I say it, now we're down to level 3 Boris could proudly stand at today's press conference trumpeting this good news and he has delivered on his promises of sending the virus packing?!!!

 

[A1X]

I thought they'd abandoned these ratings given they've just moved from 4 to 3 but have been doing stuff they should only start doing at 3 and even 2 and 1 for the last few weeks

 

[oldboyroy]

I thought they'd abandoned these ratings given they've just moved from 4 to 3 but have been doing stuff they should only start doing at 3 and even 2 and 1 for the last few weeks

Yes your right it hasn't been shown on daily press conference for couple of weeks now but it'll be showed today that's for sure.

 

[Dick Swiveller]

Seems like the most appropriate place for my niche rant. After taking flak for not reopening gyms, the Culture Secretary tweeted that he "hoped" they could open mid July. As far as I am concerned, that is one of the most reckless statements from a minister I have ever seen. Not only does he appear to be making up policy as he goes but how on earth does the industry deal with what he has suggested? A lot of preparations had been made based on the hints it would be 4th July and a lot of staff are now being paid by companies who have zero income and just as they need to decide whether to furlough staff again, this non committal tweet confuses the issue massively. In order to open Mid July, staff would be needed for at least a week and probably longer to ready sites. If they are furloughed now, they have to remain furloughed for 3 weeks. If they are paid in expectation of Mid July and that turns out to be wrong, it will be the end of many companies and jobs as you can't keep paying people with zero income - especially as they will have to contribute to furlough costs in August if it goes that far.

Whilst Boris is doing victory laps about pubs, his government's seeming desire to waste the effect of the excellent furlough scheme with this nonsense is staggering. All businesses need targets and plans. 3 weeks for shops was good. Less time for pubs and restaurants not as good but workable. But stop/go messages with no definitive dates is terrible. Nobody expects firm dates a long way in the future but definitive dates IF science allows is a must. Half arsed tweets to stop the nasty men shouting at you is pathetic IMHO.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Seems like the most appropriate place for my niche rant. After taking flak for not reopening gyms, the Culture Secretary tweeted that he "hoped" they could open mid July. As far as I am concerned, that is one of the most reckless statements from a minister I have ever seen. Not only does he appear to be making up policy as he goes but how on earth does the industry deal with what he has suggested? A lot of preparations had been made based on the hints it would be 4th July and a lot of staff are now being paid by companies who have zero income and just as they need to decide whether to furlough staff again, this non committal tweet confuses the issue massively. In order to open Mid July, staff would be needed for at least a week and probably longer to ready sites. If they are furloughed now, they have to remain furloughed for 3 weeks. If they are paid in expectation of Mid July and that turns out to be wrong, it will be the end of many companies and jobs as you can't keep paying people with zero income - especially as they will have to contribute to furlough costs in August if it goes that far.

Whilst Boris is doing victory laps about pubs, his government's seeming desire to waste the effect of the excellent furlough scheme with this nonsense is staggering. All businesses need targets and plans. 3 weeks for shops was good. Less time for pubs and restaurants not as good but workable. But stop/go messages with no definitive dates is terrible. Nobody expects firm dates a long way in the future but definitive dates IF science allows is a must. Half arsed tweets to stop the nasty men shouting at you is pathetic IMHO.

It’s populist, there is no logic in opening pubs and not pools/gyms

As posted on the gym thread - they have a better track and trace system in place than the gov.

You scan in and out - so they know who was in if someone is reported to have it.

They are asking pubs to bring in a system that gyms already have.

Gyms/theatre are going to be more screwed over than aviation here.

 

[Dick Swiveller]

It’s populist, there is no logic in opening pubs and not pools/gyms

As posted on the gym thread - they have a better track and trace system in place than the gov.

You scan in and out - so they know who was in if someone is reported to have it.

They are asking pubs to bring in a system that gyms already have.

Gyms/theatre are going to be more screwed over than aviation here.

We could live with that if we are given a date. Make it October and we can plan. Say 4th July at the earliest, then closed indefinitely, then 2 hours later hopefully Mid July and what chance do you have? There were a few questions at the briefings that seemed to lead to a minister making a policy on the spot (And then rescinding some of them). Maybe we should get a vicar to ask.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

We could live with that if we are given a date. Make it October and we can plan. Say 4th July at the earliest, then closed indefinitely, then 2 hours later hopefully Mid July and what chance do you have? There were a few questions at the briefings that seemed to lead to a minister making a policy on the spot (And then rescinding some of them). Maybe we should get a vicar to ask.

To keep it in one place:


In general, yes. Will depend on the gym and the system used - the influx of budget gyms means insisting on an induction for PAYG visitors was pretty much removed so not every one is scanned in or logged but the majority are -

If it was the difference of opening/not opening I’m certain managers/owners would put something in place - even if it’s a staff member taking names.

Has there been any discussion with the Gov?

 

[CheeseRolls]

It’s populist, there is no logic in opening pubs and not pools/gyms

As posted on the gym thread - they have a better track and trace system in place than the gov.

You scan in and out - so they know who was in if someone is reported to have it.

They are asking pubs to bring in a system that gyms already have.

Gyms/theatre are going to be more screwed over than aviation here.

There have already been documented super spreader cases from people singing in church.
Gyms it has to be about airborne viruses. What is a safe distance from someone puffing and panting whilst going flat out on a treadmill? Swimming pools you would think chlorine would be a decent virus killer. Again I think this is more about warm damp air outside the pool.

 

[Garry Nelson's teacher]

If as we keep getting told 'the plan has worked', can we assume, then, that the plan was to deliver 60,000 deaths?

 

[nicko31]

If as we keep getting told 'the plan has worked', can we assume, then, that the plan was to deliver 60,000 deaths?

Project "Boomer Remover", maybe it was the Cummings plan all along.

 

[A1X]

[TWEET]1275546923093590018[/TWEET]

 

[A1X]

Project "Boomer Remover", maybe it was the Cummings plan all along.

Interesting tactic with your core vote...

 

[beorhthelm]

If as we keep getting told 'the plan has worked', can we assume, then, that the plan was to deliver 60,000 deaths?

plan was "flatten the curve" and to protect the NHS, those were the only stated objectives. we still dont really know what policy implementation detail lead to high excess death, or alternatives that would not.

 

[nicko31]

plan was "flatten the curve" and to protect the NHS, those were the only stated objectives. we still dont really know what policy implementation detail lead to high excess death, or alternatives that would not.

Think we have high excess because we were poorly prepared for a pandemic, it crept up on Johnson, he thought he could wing it, then locked down too late and had to just fight fires.

We have been playing catch up ever since. Right now he's staring down the barrel of a shocking legacy, but it aren't over, he could yet should leadership...

 

[Is it PotG?]

Right now he's staring down the barrel of a shocking legacy, but it aren't over, he could yet should leadership...

U Ok hun? Bit early for ale.

 

[Garry Nelson's teacher]

plan was "flatten the curve" and to protect the NHS, those were the only stated objectives. we still don't really know what policy implementation detail lead to high excess death, or alternatives that would not.

Let's start from the fair assumption that they probably got some things wrong (unless the policy objective really was to have 60K+ excess deaths).

Here are some candidates

- Johnson's shaking hands with Covid victims
- late lockdown
- farce on PPE
- policy on care homes
- underprepared NHS/negligent strategic planning
- the Cummings affair
- the tracking app shambles
- poor messaging
- late implementation of quarantine
- Johnson constant over hyping of our capabilities (world beating this; world class that)

TBH it's hard to locate anything that went right? Surely this will go down as the most single disastrous mismanagement by a government in recent history?

 

[JC Footy Genius]

plan was "flatten the curve" and to protect the NHS, those were the only stated objectives. we still dont really know what policy implementation detail lead to high excess death, or alternatives that would not.

Success on both stated objectives then plus supporting thousands of businesses also sustaining millions of jobs through the furlough scheme ... not that hard to locate some positives if you take the party political blinkers off ..

 

[beorhthelm]

Let's start from the fair assumption that they probably got some things wrong (unless the policy objective really was to have 60K+ excess deaths).

Here are some candidates

- Johnson's shaking hands with Covid victims
- late lockdown
- farce on PPE
- policy on care homes
- underprepared NHS/negligent strategic planning
- the Cummings affair
- the tracking app shambles
- poor messaging
- late implementation of quarantine
- Johnson constant over hyping of our capabilities (world beating this; world class that)

TBH it's hard to locate anything that went right? Surely this will go down as the most single disastrous mismanagement by a government in recent history?

they've got lots wrong and lack leadership. those in bold are reasons for excess death, rest is pith. we dont know why or who directed those policies, and they are the same errors in Scotland, Wales, and across europe. one theory is they implemented plans for a flu epidemic, the more severe affect of Covid meant that didnt work. focusing on exact numbers is not helpful, if we'd been in line with european averages, maybe 10k lower, would it be a good result?

 

[darkwolf666]

Success on both stated objectives then plus supporting thousands of businesses also sustaining millions of jobs through the furlough scheme ... not that hard to locate some positives if you take the party political blinkers off ..

That would be so funny, if it wasn’t so ironic!

 

[darkwolf666]

Let's start from the fair assumption that they probably got some things wrong (unless the policy objective really was to have 60K+ excess deaths).

Here are some candidates

- Johnson's shaking hands with Covid victims
- late lockdown
- farce on PPE
- policy on care homes
- underprepared NHS/negligent strategic planning
- the Cummings affair
- the tracking app shambles
- poor messaging
- late implementation of quarantine
- Johnson constant over hyping of our capabilities (world beating this; world class that)

TBH it's hard to locate anything that went right? Surely this will go down as the most single disastrous mismanagement by a government in recent history?

I will add to that - 16th March - avoid pubs, office and travelling. How many people died in the week from then to lockdown a week later.

Dithering
Lies