[Football] How Do We Get Rid Of VAR?

[herecomesaregular]

My views:

- when I'm watching a game on TV that's not the Albion I wouldn't celebrate a goal particularly, I might enjoy it and be pleased but I don't celebrate - the VAR review and delay doesn't bother me one iota. When I'm at the Amex watching the Albion I want to celebrate us scoring immediately and in full glory, so I hate VAR. As mentioned above already, the former audience is much much bigger and worth many millions more than the audience in the ground, so the footballing shakers and movers couldn't give a shite. VAR is here to stay.

- is VAR better implemented in other leagues? I would be interested to know what fans abroad think of their version and if it's better we should copy it.

- the implementation of goal technology was a simple success. If VAR cannot be kept simple then it should not be implemented at all. It's almost as if it's a live 2-3 season trial of it with constant changes, how amateur is that?!

 

[Easy 10]

But the converse of that is people stopping for a flagged offside, when it is later proved not to be offside and they could easily have scored if they hadn't stopped.

But they still flag and stop the game when the forward reaches the ball REGARDLESS of whether its actually a goalscoring opportunity. They could be running towards the corner flag.

Its utter arse.

 

[Washie]

Once we've sacked all of the current PL referees, I'd love to know exactly where we're going to suddenly get all these fancy new fully trained totally infallible error-free ROBO referees from. Skynet ?

"It can't be reasoned with. It can't be bargained with. It doesn't feel fear, pity or remorse. And it absolutely will not stop, EVER, until you are booked for diving".

I meant more an entire upheaval of the system. I am a qualified referee, yet i was given the answers when i did one of the exams during my course. I was told how to progress easier by going up north, as they're more lenient up there. This was in order to get more refs into the game apparently.

 

[Munkfish]

Rubbish. The quality of refereeing in this country was deteriorating long before VAR and that is down to the weakness of the FA and the strong position of the PGMOL. For example, the FA have failed to crack down on simulation. They brought in a stupid rule where you can only be retrospectively punished if you were successful in conning the ref. The rule should have been any simulation and give them a 5 game ban.

That's just one example.

Only one player ever got called up on it as well.

 

[Easy 10]

I meant more an entire upheaval of the system. I am a qualified referee, yet i was given the answers when i did one of the exams during my course. I was told how to progress easier by going up north, as they're more lenient up there. This was in order to get more refs into the game apparently.

Wow. And that would make for BETTER refs ??

Look, I might be in the minority, but I don't think the refereeing pre-VAR was all that bad. They got the vast majority of decisions correct, as did the linos with offside calls. You have to accept an inevitable element of error, because its a humans making human calls. VAR hasn't eliminated that element of error in the game though- its only added another layer of controversy and magnified it.

You can forgive a mistake when a ref only gets 1 look. Its harder to forgive when some herbert sees it 15 times from 6 angles in slow motion, and STILL gets it wrong.

The tradeoff with all the negatives of VAR just ain't worth it.

 

[Super Steve Earle]

Wow. And that would make for BETTER refs ??

Look, I might be in the minority, but I don't think the refereeing pre-VAR was all that bad. They got the vast majority of decisions correct, as did the linos with offside calls. You have to accept an inevitable element of error, because its a humans making human calls. VAR hasn't eliminated that element of error in the game though- its only added another layer of controversy and magnified it.

You can forgive a mistake when a ref only gets 1 look. Its harder to forgive when some herbert sees it 15 times from 6 angles in slow motion, and STILL gets it wrong.

The tradeoff with all the negatives of VAR just ain't worth it.

Monday is starting to wear off a little so I thought I'd peak at a non Monday related thread. I don't understand why any Brighton fan would want to ditch VAR. On pitch refs carry unintended bias to the Big Six on to the pitch. VAR mostly holds them to account which is why the Big Six want to drop it. Ok, we lost out in the Kane Lallana decision, but we won in the Kane sneaky hand to control the ball disallowed goal and his multiple dives. Zaha has seen his penalty count hit the the floor. It's not perfect, but I think it works for us. Anybody who doesn't cheer a goal anymore is just cutting off their nose to spite their face and don't tell me they don't cheer like a loon when the opposition gets a goal chalked off to VAR. We all know it's a work in progress, but just look where Arsenal and Spurs and Liverpool are on a VAR levelled playing field. The Big 6 is falling apart through their own inadequacies this season, but now the refs can't use their unconscious bias as a lifeboat. If fans CHOOSE to not cheer a goal just in case, that's their loss. No need to change the system to cater for their insecurity. I know I'm in the minority and someone will bomb in with cries of 'rubbish', 'puerile conspiracy BS' etc., but no matter. I'm the one still cheering when we score and enjoying the anticipation of a goal against being VAR'd off. But in that respect I guess my glass is half full.

 

[Washie]

Wow. And that would make for BETTER refs ??

Look, I might be in the minority, but I don't think the refereeing pre-VAR was all that bad. They got the vast majority of decisions correct, as did the linos with offside calls. You have to accept an inevitable element of error, because its a humans making human calls. VAR hasn't eliminated that element of error in the game though- its only added another layer of controversy and magnified it.

You can forgive a mistake when a ref only gets 1 look. Its harder to forgive when some herbert sees it 15 times from 6 angles in slow motion, and STILL gets it wrong.

The tradeoff with all the negatives of VAR just ain't worth it.

Where did i say that? I was saying thats what has already happening at the moment, and why referees are so bad. There was also a massive call for VAR as our refs are some of the worst in the world.

 

[Easy 10]

Where did i say that? I was saying thats what has already happening at the moment, and why referees are so bad. There was also a massive call for VAR as our refs are some of the worst in the world.

Sorry. I just cannot take you seriously when you come out with unsubstantiated bobbins like that.

 

[Seagull58]

You get rid of it by having a vote where at least 14 out of 20 chief execs are in favour.

Isn't it a FIFA directive though, like when Blatter was embarrassed into introducing goal line technology?

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Two things - first - a linesmans call type thing for offsides, so a player has to be 'very' offside (however we want to define, but I would suggest no torso overlap) for the linesman to be overruled if he keeps his flag down, and second, the referee checks every single penalty or red card he gives on a screen, with no communication with the VAR ref.

Then all the VAR ref has to do is rule on blatant handballs / penalty area fouls which the ref missed, with some better definitive of blatant, but we can get to that later.

Sort out the offsides and we can celebrate goals again, and that's all that really matters with getting VAR right.

 

[Arthritic Toe]

I do not want to go back to arguments every weekend about decisions made by useless /scared/ bent referees and assistants especially when it was a clear offence that happened right in front if their eyes...

Oddly enough, that’s exactly what I want to go back to.

 

[Washie]

Sorry. I just cannot take you seriously when you come out with unsubstantiated bobbins like that.

Brain dead MUG SHEEP. Yeah you seem to have got that right

 

[Easy 10]

Brain dead MUG SHEEP. Yeah you seem to have got that right

"Our referees are the WORST in the WORLD"
"Sack. Them. ALL"

OK champ. What a great argument you've built there.

Washie. Do you...perchance...have a MAGA baseball cap ? Asking for a friend.

 

[Washie]

"Our referees are the WORST in the WORLD"
"Sack. Them. ALL"

OK champ. What a great argument you've built there.

Do you...perchance...have a MAGA baseball cap ? Asking for a friend.

We had no referees at the world cup. Even the rest of the world knew ours were bad. But because you're such blinkered old man who refuses to this country does wrong, you refuse to see it. Also, you seem to be to most MAGA out of both of us.

 

[GT49er]

Which is entirely subjective. Clear and obvious sounds like a clear cut marker for decisions but it isn’t. There are many occasions where commentators call something decisively one way and I call it the other. We are watching the same incident and that is why VAR isn’t actually a technological solution.

'Clear and obvious' is VERY clear cut - just totally mis-interpretted by referees using VAR. "I've seen those given" is not clear and obvious - it's an on the field referee's decision. "That looked close" - yes it did. So what? Referee has called it. Somebody was wrestled over in the penalty area behind your back before that corner came in - "Come and have a quick look on the monitor" - but you don't have to change your decision if you don't want to.
Simple. But sadly too simple for VAR officials.

Oh, and ten seconds to intervene or the decision stands.

 

[Easy 10]

We had no referees at the world cup. Even the rest of the world knew ours were bad. But because you're such blinkered old man who refuses to this country does wrong, you refuse to see it. Also, you seem to be to most MAGA out of both of us.

Clattenburg could've been in Russia but actually opted himself out of 2018 as he was, by then, chasing the Arab cash (he had by this point reffed the Champions League and European Championships finals). Howard Webb got the 2010 World Cup Final. This notion that "the rest of the world knows our referees are bad" is a fulcrum made up inside your head.

Our referees are not quite the horrific bunch of clown-shoed incompetants that you are so eager to paint them as. They get regular pitches in UEFA tournaments at Champions League and International level.

You are blowing it out of your arse, chap.

 

[Swansman]

Clattenburg could've been in Russia but actually opted himself out of 2018 as he was, by then, chasing the Arab cash (he had by this point reffed the Champions League and European Championships finals). Howard Webb got the 2010 World Cup Final. This notion that "the rest of the world knows our referees are bad" is a fulcrum made up inside your head.

Our referees are not quite the horrific bunch of clown-shoed incompetants that you are so eager to paint them as. They get regular pitches in UEFA tournaments at Champions League and International level.

You are blowing it out of your arse, chap.

Indeed. If you read global football forums like r/soccer you'll find that English people think English refs are the worst in the world, Spanish people think Spanish refs are the worst, Dutch people think Dutch refs are the worst, and on and on.

Its a difficult job (a lot of football jobs are, but ref is maybe one of the most difficult) and people expect from refs what they never expect of themselves, a perfection that is just not humanly possible.

Personally I think English refs are in general quite good and its really not their fault that FIFA are messing around with the rules and technological shit. In a lot of leagues most of the refs are much more eager to blow the whistle and waving cards around and games get disrupted, this is rare in the PL. Sometimes they have bad days but that goes for every human on earth whether they believe it or not.

 

[trueblue]

The only way I would ever be happy with VAR staying was if each team had 2 reviews a game, if you successfully appeal a decision, you keep the review.

This pretty much guarantees 4 intrusive reviews a game (for time-wasting or a breather if nothing else) which is probably worse than most matches currently.

 

[Raleigh Chopper]

Over the years we have had some truly awful refs, does anybody remember that big, bald black guy, I can't remember his name, but he was consistantly useless and made it all about himself, as did Graham Poll and many others.
But I also remember foreign refs officiating european games and world cup games in this country who had me throwing my slippers at the tv.
Our refs are or have been not the worse but we have had some stinkers, the reason we think they are so bad is because we see them every weekend, not the foreign refs.
You also have to take into consideration the high skill level of cheating now, clearly trained into them by managers, the screaming when they are touched, the diving when hardly touched, the fact that you can no longer tackle unless the player gets a perfect tackle in.
So I think we do not have the worse refs, but I think they need a hand to get it right.
But VAR has to be totally changed to make it work.

 

[Muzzy]

Get rid! I detest it...

VAR has ruined football for most of us. The instant goal rush of adrenaline has largely gone. Every goal, penalty and foul turns into a full autopsy, slowing down the flow of the game. I do wonder if this has made our players more ponderous in our style and is affecting the reactions and speed of thought process.
It’s almost like when going back to work after 2 weeks annual leave, where it takes time to get back into everyday mundane life again.