Homeless in Brighton

[ATFC Seagull]

Has the expectation changed then? That's always been the case hasn't it?

I thought you had to work hard, save for a deposit and then buy, which takes time.
Not just expect to buy after a couple of years in work.

It's the saving that basically isn't possible due to extortionate rents. All the while entry-level property prices are going up at an exponential rate compared to wages.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

And robbing Grannies of their pension.. But apart from that they did a wonderful job..

No different to the Coalition bringing in legislation to rip off pensioners (now and in the future) by changing the way workplace pensions are now uprated on an annual basis by CPI instead of RPI.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Has the expectation changed then? That's always been the case hasn't it?

I thought you had to work hard, save for a deposit and then buy, which takes time.
Not just expect to buy after a couple of years in work.

But the maths just doesn't work.

The average wage is just below £30k so let's take that as a starting point. That give you more or less £2k take home pay a month. Even a flat in B&H is generally going to set you back around £900 a month in rent. Let's throw £100 on top of that for council tax. So a person is left with £1k before food and utilities. Let's say £150 on food and another £100 on utilities. So that leaves £750 a month if that person lives like a monk. Let's be frugal and say £150 a month on going out, clothes, mobile phone, getting to work. So now we're down to £600 'spare'.

You're talking £200k for even a low end ish flat in the city. That person will be able to borrow around £105k so they need to save £95k as a deposit ( we'll ignore legal fees and stamp duty ). So with £600 'spare' a month that will only take a little over 13 years to save that - while of course house prices continue to rise at around 6% per annum which means you can add another 7 years before the person has a big enough deposit. 20 years to get on the housing ladder !!!!

 

[Hastings gull]

If you vote Tory things will only get worse, £12billion worth of welfare cuts, people in work having their housing benefit sanctioned if they don't look for more work will only add to the levels of homelessness

Well, seeing as on another thread you said that people should not live off daddy's money, but get on through their own initiative, what better way to help matters along by making a point in your will that you will be donating your house and car to Shelter. What a grand gesture!

 

[Gwylan]

But the maths just doesn't work.

The average wage is just below £30k so let's take that as a starting point. That give you more or less £2k take home pay a month. Even a flat in B&H is generally going to set you back around £900 a month in rent. Let's throw £100 on top of that for council tax. So a person is left with £1k before food and utilities. Let's say £150 on food and another £100 on utilities. So that leaves £750 a month if that person lives like a monk. Let's be frugal and say £150 a month on going out, clothes, mobile phone, getting to work. So now we're down to £600 'spare'.

You're talking £200k for even a low end ish flat in the city. That person will be able to borrow around £105k so they need to save £95k as a deposit ( we'll ignore legal fees and stamp duty ). So with £600 'spare' a month that will only take a little over 13 years to save that - while of course house prices continue to rise at around 6% per annum which means you can add another 7 years before the person has a big enough deposit. 20 years to get on the housing ladder !!!!

You forgot to take into account student loans: if your example went to college, he/she would also have to pay that back every month.

Of course, the process can be speeded up with two people saving but it also has implications for starting a family: if your sample young person wants to have a baby that's going to mean a big hit in income with a lot of extra cost. I believe the average age for a woman to have a first baby is 30 at the moment, I expect we'll see that rise in future too

 

[Norman Baker suck my lozenge]

the problem definitely isn't being ignored, a lot of the problems are financial. The council simply doesn't have the money to provide accommodation for those that need it (even people with local connection status are placed on a waiting list for hostels) and private renting comes with expensive start up costs and need for a guarantor etc.

the homelessness services in Brighton are probably the best in the country

Without wishing to trivialise ,is the short term answer not campsites?give these poor souls good quality tents with good amnesties.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

But the maths just doesn't work.

The average wage is just below £30k so let's take that as a starting point. That give you more or less £2k take home pay a month. Even a flat in B&H is generally going to set you back around £900 a month in rent. Let's throw £100 on top of that for council tax. So a person is left with £1k before food and utilities. Let's say £150 on food and another £100 on utilities. So that leaves £750 a month if that person lives like a monk. Let's be frugal and say £150 a month on going out, clothes, mobile phone, getting to work. So now we're down to £600 'spare'.

You're talking £200k for even a low end ish flat in the city. That person will be able to borrow around £105k so they need to save £95k as a deposit ( we'll ignore legal fees and stamp duty ). So with £600 'spare' a month that will only take a little over 13 years to save that - while of course house prices continue to rise at around 6% per annum which means you can add another 7 years before the person has a big enough deposit. 20 years to get on the housing ladder !!!!

This is the difference from my generation, where most youngsters worked but stayed at home with their parents, so they could save. Generally they bought a flat/house with their partner/spouse.
Nowadays youngsters want a university education, independent living & money for a deposit as well.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

There seem to be an increasing number of people sleeping rough in shop doorways in Liverpool city centre. For those that think homelessness is simply a case of fecklessness, try reading some of the case studies below.

http://www.the-basement.org.uk/case-studies-homelessness/

http://www.whitechapelcentre.co.uk/case-studies.html

 

[Barrel of Fun]

I used to work in a park in Brighton and looked after a few homeless, providing them with a base to warm up food and have a hot drink. It wasn't part of the job description... Somebody might have turned a blind eye and let them sleep in an unused bowling pavilion...

The two I befriended with didn't want to sleep in a hostel. They were full of drug addicts, violent people and alcoholics. Not the scene for all homeless people.

Sadly, there are people that do not fit in to society and the chances offered don't meet their needs.

I enjoyed helping them out and giving them a bit of human contact.

 

[Peter Ward]

Don't vote Tory for a start.

 

[Lush]

You lot must be young there has always been quite a high profile of homelessness in Brighton, I would suspect that Brighton would be one of the better environments to be homeless, climate, tolerant and I suspect a quite progressive number of charities and initiatives to help them be clothed, sheltered and fed.

Its really not the type of issue to start bouncing around political point scoring as there must be a set of circumstances that might befall any of us that would at least make us absolutely desperate.

This is a complex problem driven mainly by mental health and drug dependency issues, with an element actually choosing that this how they might like to live again driven by mental health and drug dependency issues.

If any of you think they are unwashed, begging and swigging out of a 'whitelightning' bottle at 9am because their benefits have been trimmed are just being unfairly flippant towards them and their struggles.

Good assessment. In many ways the term 'homeless' fudges the issue. Some are genuinely homeless but many live in hostel accommodation. However if you are violent or try and deal drugs you will be thrown out.

Most people in the hostels are either mentally ill or have drug or alcohol issues. You could argue that what you're seeing are the consequences of 'care in the community'. If people have a hostel place they then have an address and can claim benefits, but if you have a £50 a day heroin habit eg it won't go far, which is often why you'll find people sitting on the streets asking for change. There are opportunities to get clean, but it takes a mental strength that many don't have.

A better term perhaps would be 'mentally vulnerable' rather than homeless.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

You lot must be young there has always been quite a high profile of homelessness in Brighton, I would suspect that Brighton would be one of the better environments to be homeless, climate, tolerant and I suspect a quite progressive number of charities and initiatives to help them be clothed, sheltered and fed.

A pavement is a pavement. If they are sleeping rough, they are clearly not getting the help they need. I'm sure a few degrees in temperature makes zero difference.

There are plenty of examples of our fair city being not so tolerant. Not all of them make the paper.

 

[Lush]

I also think that the popular perception of food banks feeding hard-up low-income families isn't entirely accurate. If you have a drug habit and someone will give you food, that leaves you with more money to buy drugs.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I also think that the popular perception of food banks feeding hard-up low-income families isn't entirely accurate. If you have a drug habit and someone will give you food, that leaves you with more money to buy drugs.

You need to be referred to a food bank with a voucher. That's generally someone who has a delay in getting benefits, or not receiving statutory sick pay from their employer.

 

[beorhthelm]

typical politicaly biased arguements, completely detracting from the root cause - not enough housing to meet demand for a couple of decades. you can throw money at it, let everyone have a £1000 allowance for housing benefit if you want, it wont solve much if there isnt the housing stock available. probably increase the problems as rents increase.

For the first time in a century, in the last 10 years, home ownership has dropped. This trend is expected to continue indefinitely due to the extreme difficulty of buying a home for regular young people.

to get political though, given your general politics shoudnt you be in support of home ownership dropping as you are against capitialism? i'm bemusment when I hear the left complaining about deposits and cost of buying a property, especially the MPs. shouldn't they be calling for rented accomodation to be addressed, not Tory inspired home ownership? i know Clause 4 died, but its as if it never lived.

 

[Seasidesage]

A disgrace that we can spend billions on foreign aid and cannot care for our own homeless and old. At the risk of sounding all UKIP or something we need to help our own people first...

.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

the problem definitely isn't being ignored, a lot of the problems are financial. The council simply doesn't have the money to provide accommodation for those that need it (even people with local connection status are placed on a waiting list for hostels) and private renting comes with expensive start up costs and need for a guarantor etc.

The homelessness services in brighton are probably the best in the country

yeah ,those half way houses are full of piss heads and junkies GRAND PARADE FOR EXAMPLE
regards
DR

 

[GreersElbow]

Well, you would say that, wouldn't you?

Labour's only financial crime was not putting these people in jail.

So, uh. What crimes were committed? Because the crash was the result of a US housing bubble bursting and due to globalised banks and US bank subsidiaries, it spread around the world as opposed to illegal trading.

 

[beorhthelm]

If I was the leader of the country, I would ban the ownership of more than 3 properties by any person or organisation. Peoples homes should NOT be an investment for the rich. Buy-to-let is also a problem that needs addressing. 1 in 5 homes now owned by landlords, that will be 1 in 3 by 2030 if trends continue.

Property is a key component of wealth in this capitalist economy - it is the most significant disparity between rich and poor. It needs to be as fair as possible.

your position is bewilderingly confused, why not limit to 1? you seem to be advocating some disparity of wealth, but then saying there shouldnt be any. if the buy-to-let is such a problem, who would provide rental accomodation, is it best provided by business, by non-profits or by the state? (thats a rhetorical question, i know which you prefer, with no doubt an army of civil servants administering every property)

 

[happypig]

A disgrace that we can spend billions on foreign aid and cannot care for our own homeless and old. At the risk of sounding all UKIP or something we need to help our own people first...

.

Alternatively, scrap Trident and build council houses. Better to spend the money on housing our own than buying a foreign weapon which we'll never use to kill foreigners..