Hillsborough Inquest

[Dandyman]

It is not all about Duckenfield, there were many other police at all levels involved. There was testimony a week or two back from a fairly senior officer who was effectively told at a meeting the day after the " Official Police line " that it was drunken, ticketless, Liverpool fans who caused all of this. He said he was bewildered as he knew that that was not the case but was told to toe the line or else.

Some officers at various levels tried to speak out at the time and were ignored or silenced. There has been heartbreaking testimony from some officers in the ground who could see what was happening and tried to get the right kind of help and to alleviate the situation. I think it's wrong to tar all the police with the same brush, in a "service " such as the Police there is going to be loyalty to the force even if it is misguided.
Think of all the talk recently of whistleblowers in the Social Services and NHS and see how they are targeted and marginalised even today and then try to imagine what happens to a good copper at Hillsborough 26 years ago ?

Agree that it's not all about Duckenfield. Chief Constable Peter Wright was in ultimate charge both at Hillsborough and Orgreave.

It was Wright's decision to pursue 95 miners on charges of riot, which carries a potential life sentence. As people will remember the prosecutions fell apart after 48 days of Police evidence, when it was demonstrated that the Police were committing perjury including PCs claiming to have arrested people when it could be shown the coppers were at a different location at the time and that their statements were written by different officers.

The South Yorkshire force were eventually made to pay out £425, 000 in damages for their lies and thuggery.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

i know people want to project some class war on Hillsborough, but something is oft overlooked. the authorities reaction to the events wasnt a crack down on football fans, but to rippout the fences and improve stadiums.

An independent inquiry and report suggested improving stadia. Nothing to do with the authorities, nothing at all.

 

[beorhthelm]

An independent inquiry and report suggested improving stadia. Nothing to do with the authorities, nothing at all.

a report could have been ignored, but they accepted it and sought to make football safe rather than go authoritarian.

 

[atfc village]

It wasn't just South Yorkshire though. Anyone who went to a football ground in the 80s was likely to have seen police piling in to fans enclosures and whacking them for no apparent reason. Some of the police behaviour needed to be seen to be believed.

But fans were not entirely blameless and the culture at a football ground was very different to what it is now. Whilst I have no doubt that South Yorkshire police are entirely culpable here, we shouldn't forget that fan behaviour could be pretty poor too. This smacks to me of exploitation of fan reputation more than anything else.

Merseyside and West Midlands OB being up there with heavy handed treatment of fans in the 80's.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

a report could have been ignored, but they accepted it and sought to make football safe rather than go authoritarian.

Technically yes. But, do you honestly believe the Taylor report could have been ignored after the death of 96 people? The authorities had no option but to accept it, to think otherwise is ludicrous.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

a report could have been ignored,

I think you know your claim was outlandish....you're clutching at straws with this statement.

 

[Dandyman]

a report could have been ignored, but they accepted it and sought to make football safe rather than go authoritarian.

They were forced to abandon the Football Spectators Act 1989 which would have made ID cards obligatory by pressure from supporters. Moynihan was still referring to fans as the "effluent tendency" in 1990.


http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm198990/cmhansrd/1990-06-27/Orals-1.html

 

[Dan Aitch]

I sincerely apologise for any offence my post may have caused you [MENTION=5965]ElderlyWilliam[/MENTION] , you're obviously a very decent bloke. Which makes it all the more of a tragedy that a significant number of your colleagues at the time conspired during the Miners Strike, Hillsborough and beyond to bring the force into disrepute, bring unnecessary suffering to the Hillsborough families and allow themselves to be used as Thatcher's private army to brutalise mining communities trying to safeguard the future of their communities.

It may well be "a significant number" - I don't know enough to be sure one way or the other. However, from my reading of some of the various reports it was clear that a number of honest, hard-working, professional, concerned and public-spirited officers had their attempts to tell the truth quashed by the more senior officers amongst them who were motivated to blame the fans, for whatever reason.

While many sectors of the working public have their c*nts, we shouldn't let our anger at what was covered up affect our opinion of the entire population of the Police, many of whom will have done nothing but their best for their whole careers.

Patronising lesson done; sorry.