heard on talk sport

[Nixonator]

Ray obviously is a bit confused. As for the general debate on capacity it seems like everyone has to be so absolute and unmoving on this issue, every time. It's fairly obvious to me.

The club are spinning this in a way that they will only reveal a small scope for installing a 'couple hundred seats here and there'. If you ask a question such as 'Can the stadium be expanded?' you will get a semi-evasive response such as 'without major structual change blabla'. Some people take this as we have to send in the bulldozers and start again which is frankly ridiculous. If you really want this question answered categorically, at the fans forum you should ask 'with 10-20M investment, could the stadium be significantly expanded?' For which the answer would be yes. I imagine the major difficulties would lie in stadium regulations (width of concourses etc), transport links and planning permission far and above the structual changes necessary and financial commitment.

Bottom line though is it's not necessary, at least for the forseeable and i'm guessing the club a) don't want what might be perceived as a course of action they may never pursue hanging in the backs of fans minds; b) admit that the consistency of our gates are just not good enough yet to justify it in any way financially and/or c) risk upsetting fans by conveying the hard truth which is that ticket sales provide very little (comparitive) revenue once you hit the money league.

Of course i'm loathed to put a maximum on our potential gates as many have made fools of themselves in the past by doing so but I think we have a healthy capacity, and without a ST waiting list of at the very least 5-7K no expansion will be considered, not to mention there are far more pertinent things to be spending money on ie. survival and consolidation.

 

[TheDuke]

Does he. What does he do at the club? I'm a Chartered Quantity Surveyor. I can't see how you would get 60K seats in to that space. Oh, I previously worked on the piling works package, for the redeveloped Twickenham Stadium South Stand. So I know what foundations are involved in this sort of thing.

At last, someone who actually knows what he is talking about. A question to you HBS. Disregarding any council/planning objections... what would you think is possible, in terms of capacity,
for the ground to be increased? Personally I believe 30K is about right unless we get into the rarified atmosphere of Barca/Man U&C/ CFC and other great European teams

 

[Triggaaar]

I would suggest that he knew more than anybody on here but I have never once said it is or would happen just the footings were adequate read into that what you want.

Apparently the sky above the Amex is clear for expansion of over 100k all seater. I've never posted about it here, because I don't know that it's going ahead, but the sky is clear should we choose to expand.

 

[Easy 10]

Some people take this as we have to send in the bulldozers and start again which is frankly ridiculous.

Its not ridiculous at all.

The arches that support the roof are deeply embedded in concrete thrust blocks buried underground. If another tier was added anywhere, those arches would have to come down and the roof taken off so it could be raised sufficiently to accommodate it. So yes, you'd pretty much have to dismantle the Amex. That might take a bulldozer or two.

Back to Withdean for a couple of years while they sort all that out ? Blimey, imagine the binfest for tickets then.

 

[hoveboyslim]

At last, someone who actually knows what he is talking about. A question to you HBS. Disregarding any council/planning objections... what would you think is possible, in terms of capacity,
for the ground to be increased? Personally I believe 30K is about right unless we get into the rarified atmosphere of Barca/Man U&C/ CFC and other great European teams

As it is now there is very limited scope. The East and West Roofs are supported on the arches so to increase on the sides would require a complete re-design, but you then you have the issue that the seating rakes back and you have nowhere to go behind the existing stands. You may be able to rebuild the North and South Stands but it would look pretty ugly when finished and wouldn't increase the capacity by much, so would probably be cost prohibitive.

30K is just fine.

 

[clapham_gull]

I expect he meant expansion from 22K to 30K.

Not sure he did. I heard something similiar albeit not with those numbers.

Cant remember who from.

Yes the stadium can be extended in a number of ways.

Firstly by ramming in more seats, a redesign of the North and lastly by removing some or all othe roof.

Anything is possible but it isn't going to happen is ?

Firstly the money

The infrastructure as it stands can't handle it and I'm quite happy with the leg room.

Sent from my LG-K520 using Tapatalk

 

[MattBackHome]

Apparently the sky above the Amex is clear for expansion of over 100k all seater. I've never posted about it here, because I don't know that it's going ahead, but the sky is clear should we choose to expand.

"I may not know anything about construction, or planning, or stadium design, or..." etc

 

[Bob'n'weave]

Sorry to bring this one up again but if we want to introduce more spectators we may have to wait until the powers that be decide on the Safe Standing issue. It is possible to go for 1.5 bods per seat space (some European clubs have 1.8 per seat), which would certainly increase the capacity. If the North went for all SS (yes!!), we would end up with 4.5k bods making a lot of noise. With more in the South and the E & W, we could go up to 35K easy, no massive redesign or expense.
The latest on SS is the FA doing a lot of research in an effort to lobby Parliament for a change in the law to allow SS in UK grounds. There is a lot of support for it but some clubs are not interested, Everton for one. Personally I think the situation is a no brainer as at least half of the NS and away supporters stand anyway. The law was brought in to make it 'safer' for fans, but the current situation makes that a bit of a joke when we have fans standing all over the UK in seated sections, which is more dangerous than terracing. WTF.

 

[Everest]

It is possible to go for 1.5 bods per seat space

Technically yes.

But NOT here.
The exits aren't big enough, amongst other things.

This has been discussed many times before.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

Sorry to bring this one up again but if we want to introduce more spectators we may have to wait until the powers that be decide on the Safe Standing issue. It is possible to go for 1.5 bods per seat space (some European clubs have 1.8 per seat), which would certainly increase the capacity. If the North went for all SS (yes!!), we would end up with 4.5k bods making a lot of noise. With more in the South and the E & W, we could go up to 35K easy, no massive redesign or expense. :

Except that the club have declared many, many times that any possible SS in the North Stand would be 1:1 as that is all the facilities are designed to safely accommodate (vomitories, emergency exits, toilets, etc)

 

[sully]

At last, someone who actually knows what he is talking about. A question to you HBS. Disregarding any council/planning objections... what would you think is possible, in terms of capacity,
for the ground to be increased? Personally I believe 30K is about right unless we get into the rarified atmosphere of Barca/Man U&C/ CFC and other great European teams

I'm a Chartered Quantity Surveyor, too, but it doesn't make me a structural engineer!

However, my experience, common sense and knowledge of the structure that was erected makes it pretty clear that the roof is going no higher, so no higher tiers can be added.

 

[Stat Brother]

Take a look at the additional land take at White Hart Lane to see what expanding to 60k looks like. It's not happening at the AMEX any time soon.

Well this clearly shows how little you know:-



The size difference is almost negligible.
In no way does this image look like the 60,000 seater stadium is able to eat it's 40k sibling.

 

[BeHereNow]

Ray obviously is a bit confused. As for the general debate on capacity it seems like everyone has to be so absolute and unmoving on this issue, every time. It's fairly obvious to me.

The club are spinning this in a way that they will only reveal a small scope for installing a 'couple hundred seats here and there'. If you ask a question such as 'Can the stadium be expanded?' you will get a semi-evasive response such as 'without major structual change blabla'. Some people take this as we have to send in the bulldozers and start again which is frankly ridiculous. If you really want this question answered categorically, at the fans forum you should ask 'with 10-20M investment, could the stadium be significantly expanded?' For which the answer would be yes. I imagine the major difficulties would lie in stadium regulations (width of concourses etc), transport links and planning permission far and above the structual changes necessary and financial commitment.

Bottom line though is it's not necessary, at least for the forseeable and i'm guessing the club a) don't want what might be perceived as a course of action they may never pursue hanging in the backs of fans minds; b) admit that the consistency of our gates are just not good enough yet to justify it in any way financially and/or c) risk upsetting fans by conveying the hard truth which is that ticket sales provide very little (comparitive) revenue once you hit the money league.

Of course i'm loathed to put a maximum on our potential gates as many have made fools of themselves in the past by doing so but I think we have a healthy capacity, and without a ST waiting list of at the very least 5-7K no expansion will be considered, not to mention there are far more pertinent things to be spending money on ie. survival and consolidation.

Absolutely agree.

The only way I can think of adding to the capicity (apart from extra seats in the corners) is taking the roofs off the North and South stands, adding maybe another 15 rows and putting the roofs back on top of the arches. The concourses would probably have to be enlarged and everything behind the stands push further back. Doesn't really seem cost effective. Would make a great atmosphere though.

 

[hoveboyslim]

I'm a Chartered Quantity Surveyor, too, but it doesn't make me a structural engineer!

However, my experience, common sense and knowledge of the structure that was erected makes it pretty clear that the roof is going no higher, so no higher tiers can be added.

Agreed. I did consider referencing a Structural Engineer, but again based on my experience there appears little room for expansion.

 

[Easy 10]

Absolutely agree.

The only way I can think of adding to the capicity (apart from extra seats in the corners) is taking the roofs off the North and South stands, adding maybe another 15 rows and putting the roofs back on top of the arches. The concourses would probably have to be enlarged and everything behind the stands push further back. Doesn't really seem cost effective. Would make a great atmosphere though.

The north and south stand roofs are also supported by the arches though - there is a "ring of steel" that goes right around the whole lot. Those arches lean back against each other, counterbalancing each others weight, and in effect "pulling" the roofs up into place.

You can't put the roofs on top of the arches - those arches hold the whole thing up !

 

[Is it PotG?]

Would make a great atmosphere though.

If full every week.

 

[Everest]

The only way I can think of adding to the capicity (apart from extra seats in the corners) is taking the roofs off the North and South stands, adding maybe another 15 rows and putting the roofs back on top of the arches. The concourses would probably have to be enlarged and everything behind the stands push further back. Doesn't really seem cost effective. Would make a great atmosphere though.

No chance, IMO.
If you take the roof off one end, you have to take ALL the roof off.

There is a ring of steel going all round the roof.
This helps to hold the arches up, and the arches help hold the roof struts up.
Take away any part of it, and the whole thing collapses.

 

[Dick Head]

You are all missing the point. All the billionaires in London are digging downwards. It would be a piece of piss to lower the pitch in the close season.

 

[Stat Brother]

We need a seperate thread highlighting EVERYTHING that isn't going to happen, as a result of this promotion, no matter how many new threads are posted here:-

- Stadium capacity.
- Wholesale transport changes.
- Shopping for players in Madrid!
- Tony selling up.

I'm sure there's plenty more.

 

[Easy 10]

You are all missing the point. All the billionaires in London are digging downwards. It would be a piece of piss to lower the pitch in the close season.

View attachment 84612

Nicely done! That just gave me a bit of a semi.

They dug down and added another tier at the Nou Camp for the 1982 World Cup, so there is a precedence for it. Not sure if we'd still have room for a full-sized pitch though. Might be a bit of a squeeze.