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[Sussex] Hastings a Sky News report.



PILTDOWN MAN

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Sep 15, 2004
19,595
Hurst Green
Should've extended all the way in.
They took long enough to build the bypass between Bexhill and Hastings, which has improved things in that respect.
The 8 miles currently is around Hailsham and Eastbourne. There's no dual carriageway on the A21 in E Sussex. I've given up writing to the MP about anything we're just the poor relation in the South East. Kent and West Sussex are like a different country in comparison.
 




North of Robertsbridge

Well-known member
Sep 22, 2023
271
East Sussex
They're spending £42 m improving the A21 a shocking amount of money that is NOT improving one thing. Replacing of signs, laying a few cats eyes it's frankly bewildering where this money is being spent, certainly not on the road itself. 8 miles of dual carriageway in the whole of East Sussex, that is it.
Well they are planning a roundabout at Coopers Corner, north of Hurst Green. Just got a letter about starting surveys of nearby properties. Apparently construction starting in 2025. That will cost a packet and just slow down traffic and inconvenience the locals. After 30 years of different consultations over a dual carriageway south of Lamberhurst that won’t happen in most of our lifetimes
 


PILTDOWN MAN

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Sep 15, 2004
19,595
Hurst Green
Well they are planning a roundabout at Coopers Corner, north of Hurst Green. Just got a letter about starting surveys of nearby properties. Apparently construction starting in 2025. That will cost a packet and just slow down traffic and inconvenience the locals. After 30 years of different consultations over a dual carriageway south of Lamberhurst that won’t happen in most of our lifetimes
They compulsory purchased land and property around Hurst Green and then cancelled the bypass, selling the land back off. They can't buy it again for a long period of time. Unfortunately our MP is more interested in getting inside knickers than he is representing us.
 


anygivensunday

Active member
Jul 5, 2012
209
Singapore
Fond memories of Hastings as a kid. My grandparents (RIP) lived in the old town, specifically in one of those raised houses in the tight high street with the long row of black railings infront.
Haven't been back in about 10 years. Viewing from afar it's very sad to see what's happening to many places like this all over from the UK.
 


North of Robertsbridge

Well-known member
Sep 22, 2023
271
East Sussex
They compulsory purchased land and property around Hurst Green and then cancelled the bypass, selling the land back off. They can't buy it again for a long period of time. Unfortunately our MP is more interested in getting inside knickers than he is representing us.
Oh yes, the bypass was judged too expensive, even the cheapest route closes to the ridge (so going through the cricket pitch). So it's just "safety improvements" south of Lamberhurst. The new roundabout at Coopers Corner is part of that scheme

In 40 years we've seen any number of proposed bypass routes, including one that went through part of our property
 




Grassman

Well-known member
Jun 12, 2008
2,619
Tun Wells
Well they are planning a roundabout at Coopers Corner, north of Hurst Green. Just got a letter about starting surveys of nearby properties. Apparently construction starting in 2025. That will cost a packet and just slow down traffic and inconvenience the locals. After 30 years of different consultations over a dual carriageway south of Lamberhurst that won’t happen in most of our lifetimes
Whereabouts is Coopers Corner? Is it where Merriments Lane joins the A21?
 


PILTDOWN MAN

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Sep 15, 2004
19,595
Hurst Green


BrightonCottager

Well-known member
Sep 30, 2013
2,766
Brighton
One big issue and this article will disappear quickly mainly due to location. The agenda especially the BBC is always the North. Whether it's the main road to Hastings the A21, the crap rail service to the poor housing stock it goes unnoticed by most of the media. I get pissed off listening night after night on the news, on Newsnight etc only ever talking about Newcastle, Liverpool blah blah yet they've had money thrown at them for decades. The A21 up north would be a considered a farm track.
The Government's rhetoric about 'Levelling up' includes places outside the Midlands and North. Smaller coastal towns have long been recognised as a special case, suffering from long term economic decline as the British seaside holiday died, seasonal, low paid jobs, poor housing and health, poor job or educational prospects for the youth and often poorly connected to transport infrastructure. There have been various studies, 2 of the more recent being Chris Whitty's 2021 annual report and a House of Lords Committee chaired by (Lord) Steve 'Squatter' Bassam . In Hastings' case, there has been investment aimed at keeping talented young people in the town, such as the University of Brighton setting up an outpost that was criminally then shut down. The Council has won Town Fund monies to invest, but it costs a lot in time and money to bid for these and they are usually capital projects rather than the revenue that the Council needs. Historically, there was also the decanting of people from London to the town that increased pressure on housing stock and infrastructure. And the Council is virtually powerless to control the housing market - rentals in particular. They will get powers to licence AirBnBs and control the spread of new ones, but that will do little to tackle the existing stock of them.
 




PILTDOWN MAN

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Sep 15, 2004
19,595
Hurst Green
The Government's rhetoric about 'Levelling up' includes places outside the Midlands and North. Smaller coastal towns have long been recognised as a special case, suffering from long term economic decline as the British seaside holiday died, seasonal, low paid jobs, poor housing and health, poor job or educational prospects for the youth and often poorly connected to transport infrastructure. There have been various studies, 2 of the more recent being Chris Whitty's 2021 annual report and a House of Lords Committee chaired by (Lord) Steve 'Squatter' Bassam . In Hastings' case, there has been investment aimed at keeping talented young people in the town, such as the University of Brighton setting up an outpost that was criminally then shut down. The Council has won Town Fund monies to invest, but it costs a lot in time and money to bid for these and they are usually capital projects rather than the revenue that the Council needs. Historically, there was also the decanting of people from London to the town that increased pressure on housing stock and infrastructure. And the Council is virtually powerless to control the housing market - rentals in particular. They will get powers to licence AirBnBs and control the spread of new ones, but that will do little to tackle the existing stock of them.
To me it's simple good businesses need good infrastructure, Hastings is abysmal.
 


BrightonCottager

Well-known member
Sep 30, 2013
2,766
Brighton
To me it's simple good businesses need good infrastructure, Hastings is abysmal.
I agree, although I recall a study years ago that showed that Hull's economy was stronger than equivalent sized but better connected towns because it was relatively isolated- it meant businesses serving it had to be located nearby. The theory was that if you improved roads, it meant those businesses would relocate further away because they could have the same costs (time and fuel) and serve a wider market. In this context, if the A21 was massively improved, those Hastings businesses would move up it.
 


PILTDOWN MAN

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Sep 15, 2004
19,595
Hurst Green
I agree, although I recall a study years ago that showed that Hull's economy was stronger than equivalent sized but better connected towns because it was relatively isolated- it meant businesses serving it had to be located nearby. The theory was that if you improved roads, it meant those businesses would relocate further away because they could have the same costs (time and fuel) and serve a wider market. In this context, if the A21 was massively improved, those Hastings businesses would move up it.
You make a good point but the roads leading to Hull are like an intergalactic highway compared to the A21 farm track.
 




Was not Was

Loitering with intent
Jul 31, 2003
1,607
I'm born and bred Hastings, living in Brighton now, and have seen all the younger adults in my family move away, mostly to places in Kent, in order to afford somewhere to live.

I've bought the argument that we need loads more homes built in this country to address this, but a friend sent me this earlier, from today's paper, on the same topic ... and it makes a convincing case that landlords are the problem, not the supply of housing.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeand...risingly-simple-solution-to-uk-housing-crisis
 


beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
36,014
I'm born and bred Hastings, living in Brighton now, and have seen all the younger adults in my family move away, mostly to places in Kent, in order to afford somewhere to live.

I've bought the argument that we need loads more homes built in this country to address this, but a friend sent me this earlier, from today's paper, on the same topic ... and it makes a convincing case that landlords are the problem, not the supply of housing.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeand...risingly-simple-solution-to-uk-housing-crisis
need to look at the supporting evidence, on first pass looks like claim there's enough homes just they are rented privatly, which doesn't explain the apparent lack of property available to rent. also i suspect overlooking national housing stock vs local. may be we're all just wrong about this, and if only southern children moved to where there are empty properties, it'll be solved.
 


Was not Was

Loitering with intent
Jul 31, 2003
1,607
need to look at the supporting evidence, on first pass looks like claim there's enough homes just they are rented privatly, which doesn't explain the apparent lack of property available to rent. also i suspect overlooking national housing stock vs local. may be we're all just wrong about this, and if only southern children moved to where there are empty properties, it'll be solved.
I read the article as saying: the excess of private landlords, combined with poor renter rights, pushes prices up a lot. But iswym that doesn't explain an actual shortage.
 




BrightonCottager

Well-known member
Sep 30, 2013
2,766
Brighton
I read the article as saying: the excess of private landlords, combined with poor renter rights, pushes prices up a lot. But iswym that doesn't explain an actual shortage.
It is difficult to define an 'actual shortage'.
Council planning departments have to identify a 5 year housing land supply which is based on a formula taking into account population trends and forecasts and affordability (less affordable councils have to identify more land). Then the government adds a % if they are in the top 20 most populous LAs (includes B&H), on the basis that it wants dense cities to get denser. Then, if the Council has a history of under delivery of housing land, it adds a bit more to the target.

At that point, the Council has a housing target. It can then argue that the target needs to be reduced because of environmental factors such as a National Park surrounding it on 2 sides and the sea on another. It has a legal Duty to Cooperate with its neighbours (which is about to be scrapped) in the hope that they will increase their housing supply to take up the slack.

The Council then allocates land in its local plan for the number of homes agreed by the Government - it can also assume a certain number of windfall sites coming forward (flat conversions, small sites etc). Then, the co-operative developers build all these homes, including the 'affordable ' ones in the next 5 years.

That's the theory. What is impossible / very difficult for planners to do is take account of issues like homes being sold to foreign investors, left empty 50 weeks of the year (the tower block above Churchill Sq, Brighton marina), Old biddies living alone in 3 bedroom homes, 2nd homes, Airbnb, landlords putting rents up, right to buy, developers getting planning permission for one type of housing then selling to another developer who provides another type (eg the hundreds of flats going up opposite Preston Park that were supposed to be affordable (Hyde Housing) and are now going to be expensive 'build to rent' like those near Hove station and on New England St).

There are also towns and cities in the Midlands and North with loads of vacant housing and low prices, but we no longer have any kind of coherent industrial strategy and have never had a national spatial plan or strategy to join things up.

It's no use blaming the planners (as Rachel Reeves seems destined to do like her predecessor George Osborne) without any kind of policy or the resources to implement it.
 


Weststander

Well-known member
Aug 25, 2011
69,271
Withdean area
I'm born and bred Hastings, living in Brighton now, and have seen all the younger adults in my family move away, mostly to places in Kent, in order to afford somewhere to live.

I've bought the argument that we need loads more homes built in this country to address this, but a friend sent me this earlier, from today's paper, on the same topic ... and it makes a convincing case that landlords are the problem, not the supply of housing.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeand...risingly-simple-solution-to-uk-housing-crisis

The UK’s population has increased by 9.5m since 1997. If the 5m BTL’s were outlawed tomorrow, that may well make houses cheaper and low housing costs over time. But it wouldn’t deal with the sheer weight of numbers from population growth. In every other similar era, the 19th century, inter-war and post WW2 years, mass house building tried to keep up with the need. But not this time. Housing costs and a lack of homes are imho the two biggest issues for the UK just now.

[I don’t own a BTL].
 




North of Robertsbridge

Well-known member
Sep 22, 2023
271
East Sussex
They're spending £42 m improving the A21 a shocking amount of money that is NOT improving one thing. Replacing of signs, laying a few cats eyes it's frankly bewildering where this money is being spent, certainly not on the road itself. 8 miles of dual carriageway in the whole of East Sussex, that is it.
Frankly, they could knock a good amount off travel times up the A21 by putting the gypsum back on trains - Mountfield gypsum mines have their own branch line. Their frickin' trucks are a nuisance, crawling up Silverhill
 




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