[News] Guilty/Free Speech/Grossly Offensive - World gone mad

[BadFish]

I said I was out of this thread but feel I need to counter your trivialization of anti scemitism because it is attitudes like yours that allow extremists to step into the void left by reasonable people. There is no ‘whataboutism’ in my post. I would be equally disgusted by someone filming their dog in a re-enaction of a KKK lynching as the current ‘gas the jews’ case. This begs the question of why you see any difference in the scenarios. Perhaps you could enlighten me ?

Have you actually watched the blokes video to put this in context? Firstly let me clarify that i am not trivialising hate speech, no one should be putting out a youtube video with 'gas the jews' repeated over and over again, it is not on. My point is that in the context of the fellas 'joke' he is quite clearly not advocating that anyone (least of all the dog) should go and gas any jews. For this reason I believe that a criminal conviction is somewhat over the top. I don't think this is that much of an outrageous sentiment, nor do i believe that i am allowing "extremists to step into the void left by reasonable people". To be honest i think this is a pretty extreme position to leap to based on my comments.

In terms of your whataboutism as I perceive it, this is about the crux of the 'joke' and the fact that your scenario of the dog being lynched by the KKK. The point of the joke here is that his girlfriend is always banging on about how 'cute and adorable' the dog is so he has turned his dog into something that is the opposite of cute and adorable, i.e. a nazi. To substitute the Nazi for a black man being hung by the KKK would be suggesting that black people are the opposite of cute and adorable. The only way that you could successfully substitute your scenario to make the 'joke' work would be if you swapped the NAzi dog for the KKK dog to show him as the aggressor and not the victim or if he had dressed the dog up as a jew in the first place. Your scenario suggests that you either haven't watched the video or the crux of the joke passed you by. Either way your whataboutism is inaccurate.

So my point is that although it is not okay to repeat 'gas the jews' on a public forum. if one takes the context of the video into account what we are seeing here is a bloke rather clumsily carrying out a practical joke on his girlfriend rather than a bloke trying to incite racial hatred or indoctrinating a dog into the nazi party and getting it involved in hate crime. Maybe there is more to this than meets the eye and the court knows something we don't but on the face of it it seems to me that a criminal conviction is harsh for this crime. I would also add that as I don't know what the fellas sentence is yet I may change my mind on this.

I must say it is refreshing to be told that i am enabling extremism and trivialising anti-semitism as i am usually being accused of being a snowflake, lefty hangwringer etc. Seeing things from the other side is certainly teaching me a few lessons about methods of debate and discussion.

 

[BadFish]

I think the overreaction to the overreaction to the original usual 'post with an agenda' is a lot more entertaining than the dog's mastery of the Nazi salute (the other bit repeated ad nauseum on here is obviously not funny). However, those suggesting that NSC has either been taken over by Nazi trolls or Snowflakes are off the mark too, it's just that both ends of the spectrum make a lot of noise within their own echo chambers. Most people are either posting sensible responses or are busy wolfing down the Pringles.

Apparently I have moved echo chambers, it is quite enlightening

 

[BadFish]

It is also worth noting here that implied in the video is the fact that 'gas the jews' is a heinous thing to say.

He is making the point that he is making the dog 'the worst thing i can think of' a nazi. So the implication here is that 'gas the jews' is 'the worst thing he can think of'. So are we not allowed to say heinous things even if it is obvious (to anyone who watched the video) that we are saying them in negative terms?

If this is the case i am not sure how it was okay for people to be posting stuff about people's mums and daughters earlier in the thread.

 

[Wrong-Direction]

Well this is going well

Sent from my SM-A310F using Tapatalk

 

[BadFish]

Your words were; ‘Some of the views expressed on here are moderately concerning .’ There are many posts on here seeking to trivialize someone using the words ‘gas the jews’ as a joke. Therefore you are a passive defender of bigotry. I’ll ignore your name calling as it is merely an indicator of immaturity.

'the worst thing I can think of'

 

[looney]

It appears the Nazi pug is going viral with general derision aimed at the court.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Have you actually watched the blokes video to put this in context? Firstly let me clarify that i am not trivialising hate speech, no one should be putting out a youtube video with 'gas the jews' repeated over and over again, it is not on. My point is that in the context of the fellas 'joke' he is quite clearly not advocating that anyone (least of all the dog) should go and gas any jews. For this reason I believe that a criminal conviction is somewhat over the top. I don't think this is that much of an outrageous sentiment, nor do i believe that i am allowing "extremists to step into the void left by reasonable people". To be honest i think this is a pretty extreme position to leap to based on my comments.

In terms of your whataboutism as I perceive it, this is about the crux of the 'joke' and the fact that your scenario of the dog being lynched by the KKK. The point of the joke here is that his girlfriend is always banging on about how 'cute and adorable' the dog is so he has turned his dog into something that is the opposite of cute and adorable, i.e. a nazi. To substitute the Nazi for a black man being hung by the KKK would be suggesting that black people are the opposite of cute and adorable. The only way that you could successfully substitute your scenario to make the 'joke' work would be if you swapped the NAzi dog for the KKK dog to show him as the aggressor and not the victim or if he had dressed the dog up as a jew in the first place. Your scenario suggests that you either haven't watched the video or the crux of the joke passed you by. Either way your whataboutism is inaccurate.

So my point is that although it is not okay to repeat 'gas the jews' on a public forum. if one takes the context of the video into account what we are seeing here is a bloke rather clumsily carrying out a practical joke on his girlfriend rather than a bloke trying to incite racial hatred or indoctrinating a dog into the nazi party and getting it involved in hate crime. Maybe there is more to this than meets the eye and the court knows something we don't but on the face of it it seems to me that a criminal conviction is harsh for this crime. I would also add that as I don't know what the fellas sentence is yet I may change my mind on this.

I must say it is refreshing to be told that i am enabling extremism and trivialising anti-semitism as i am usually being accused of being a snowflake, lefty hangwringer etc. Seeing things from the other side is certainly teaching me a few lessons about methods of debate and discussion.

We are just going to have to agree to disagree. I don’t believe the chap’s motive is relevant. The facts before the court were that this video saying ‘gas the jews’ was disseminated on a public forum. The moment this moved from a private to a public forum it became propaganda and caused offence. You imply that I have no justification for my stance but to me it is part of a worrying trend back to attitudes last seen a couple of generations ago. I will wish you good night as it is clear that you and others cannot accept the idea that you are trivializing discrimination and hate speech.

 

[StonehamPark]

I can't believe no one reminded the judge that the theme of the YouTube video was anti-nazi.

I don’t believe the chap’s motive is relevant.

The facts before the court were that this video saying ‘gas the jews’ was disseminated on a public forum.

The moment this moved from a private to a public forum it became propaganda and caused offence.

As you have written those words on a public forum, should you therefore be arrested for inciting hate-speech and taken to trial?

 

[looney]

So a hate group?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2yPZ5OZ4Ik

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

I can't believe no one reminded the judge that the theme of the YouTube video was anti-nazi.



As you have written those words on a public forum, should you therefore be arrested for inciting hate-speech and taken to trial?

Do you understand speech/quote marks ?

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

It appears the Nazi pug is going viral with general derision aimed at the court.

Gone viral eh ? Busy day for the alt right bots I guess. Must be so difficult programming all those fake twitter accounts.

 

[StonehamPark]

Do you understand speech/quote marks ?

Ah yes, so you're saying that you were quoting someone else, and your intentions were not to "gas the jews"?
I suppose if I would have had understood the context of your post without rushing to conclusions, I would have had a better understanding of your intention.

 

[looney]

Gone viral eh ? Busy day for the alt right bots I guess. Must be so difficult programming all those fake twitter accounts.

Im not on twitter so wouldn't know. But keep tellig yourself its the non existent alt right or muh Russians.

 

[StonehamPark]

Gone viral eh ? Busy day for the alt right bots I guess. Must be so difficult programming all those fake twitter accounts.

Oooohhhh, you're one of those types.
I've wasted my time entirely. Good luck to you.

 

[BadFish]

Do you understand speech/quote marks ?

Now apply the same reasoning to the video.

Can I ask again, have you watched the video?

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

 

[BadFish]

We are just going to have to agree to disagree. I don’t believe the chap’s motive is relevant. The facts before the court were that this video saying ‘gas the jews’ was disseminated on a public forum. The moment this moved from a private to a public forum it became propaganda and caused offence. You imply that I have no justification for my stance but to me it is part of a worrying trend back to attitudes last seen a couple of generations ago. I will wish you good night as it is clear that you and others cannot accept the idea that you are trivializing discrimination and hate speech.

We will have to agree to disagree. For the record I don't think you have no justification for your stance, I understand the point you are making and largely agree with it. The only difference as i see it is that the bloke's motive is or should be relevant and that a criminal conviction is a little harsh for this offence. As I have said, maybe there is more to it that meets the eye that the court know about and we don't. I am going to wait for the sentencing and perhaps more information before I say much more.

This to me is a minor difference of opinion on a small part of this case (I have agreed that it is not okay to put out a video stating 'gas the jews' repeatedly whatever the context) and for you to accuse me of trivialising discrimination and hate speech is not only way off the mark but also quite offensive. I think you are out of order here and find it a great shame that this case could not be discussed and opinions shared without such knobbery. If you think that my opinion is part of a worrying trend then please feel free to post any other opinions that I have shared that follow this trend. I would prefer to discuss this case on its own merits and free of personal agendas.

 

[dejavuatbtn]

It’s about as funny as Ricky Gervais making jokes about people with cancer. Stick him in jail and let him make a comedy series about that.

 

[Hungry Joe]

I will wish you good night as it is clear that you and others cannot accept the idea that you are trivializing discrimination and hate speech.

Ok, I really am going to say this for the last time here - no one on this thread is a) saying that it is anything other than deeply offensive and very stupid to either say or put a video out saying what the guy says, and b) no one is trivialising what he has done or being an apologist for discrimination. What some people are trying to do is add some balance and perspective, and questioning whether a prosecution and custodial sentence for hate speech is justified in this case. I would not argue with someone who believes it is as that is fair enough, it's what the law says it is, but that is very different from you labelling people you know **** all about as passive enablers of bigotry or whatever, or closet anti-semites, just because they try to add some context. Context is important, without it we're back to witch trials and everyone is getting strung up. You seem to think you're a one-man NSC army fighting the good fight against the Neo Nazis and everyone else sleep-walking into a new Third Reich, you're not. Grow up, listen to what people are saying rather than just latching onto any snippet that you think justifies your crusade and sense of self importance and ignoring everything else they've said that doesn't fit with your cartoon image of them - that my friend is bigotry and you are a hypocrite for indulging in it.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Mel Brooks would laugh at this.

He'd probably even put the dog in a movie.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

It’s about as funny as Ricky Gervais making jokes about people with cancer. Stick him in jail and let him make a comedy series about that.

Making light of dark often horrible situations is how comedy is supposed to work. It iis often a coping mechanism for people. You are obviously clueless to that.

My Dad died of cancer, even he made jokes about it before he passed away. As he and many others have said, laughter is the best medicine.


Obviously we'll never see you at a Jimmy Carr show. Far too offensive for your sensitive ears.