[News] Gideon Falter

[Guinness Boy]

Not seen the footage. Not sure I fancy it. What is the gist of it? For me any peace protest with people waving swastikas is krunk as far as I'm concerned.

I don’t think that was the point of the OP.

One of my daughter’s best friends is Jewish and the large extended family have taken her as one of their own. They are beautiful people. Not one of who would suddenly decide to take a walk in the direction of a well advertised march that might contain an anti-Semite or two and several charged up coppers.

If I’ve misunderstood @afters post then apologies, but to me he’s the one making the most sense on this thread.

 

[clapham_gull]

The fact that someone of any religion (or none) doesn't feel safe walking the streets of London is very worrying and very sad in equal measure, IMO.

Not the case 99.99% of the time of course. But the demos in London can be a bit fired.

I made the stupid mistake of venturing up to Vauxhall a few weeks ago and some of a crowd I'm afraid remind of a post football crowd after an away win at a rival.

I made the second stupid mistake of having a moan at someone pushing in a queue. Instantly identified as an "away fan" of course. You are often dealing with a very fired up partisan crowd.

After I had a conversation with a lovely London Underground man who has to deal with it every time. It's relevant to say he was black and a Christian, almost crying at people in HIS city behaving like this.

 

[Guinness Boy]

The fact that someone of any religion (or none) doesn't feel safe walking the streets of London is very worrying and very sad in equal measure, IMO.

When were you last in London out of interest?

 

[aftershavedave]

I don’t think that was the point of the OP.

One of my daughter’s best friends is Jewish and the large extended family have taken her as one of their own. They are beautiful people. Not one of who would suddenly decide to take a walk in the direction of a well advertised march that might contain an anti-Semite or two and several charged up coppers.

If I’ve misunderstood @afters post then apologies, but to me he’s the one making the most sense on this thread.

Thank you, the only point I'm making here is that this is not a jewish man walking cross the street. It took my 15year old to google this early Sunday on the way to football. Maybe a better headline would be "Jewish activist confronts march and unfortunate copper gets tongue-tied"

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I don’t think that was the point of the OP.

One of my daughter’s best friends is Jewish and the large extended family have taken her as one of their own. They are beautiful people. Not one of who would suddenly decide to take a walk in the direction of a well advertised march that might contain an anti-Semite or two and several charged up coppers.

If I’ve misunderstood @afters post then apologies, but to me he’s the one making the most sense on this thread.

Mate, I'm lost now. I'll have re-read later. I thought I had a bit of an idea what was going on, but possibly not. And not for the first time.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Thank you, the only point I'm making here is that this is not a jewish man walking cross the street. It took my 15year old to google this early Sunday on the way to football. Maybe a better headline would be "Jewish activist confronts march and unfortunate copper gets tongue-tied"

Ah, OK. I think I follow, now.

 

[GT49er]

This! Should have waived him through

Why? So he might be assaulted by people who are outraged at what Israel (a Jewish state actually, even if it doesn't represent the views of all Jews) is doing in Gaza. That would be alright, because he represented 'one of the bad guys' would it? Or tell him to go round another way, and save the risk of an unpleasant incident?

Hasn't a phrase something like 'victim signalling' entered the vocabulary of late..............

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I have had a quick look at the news feeds and haven't seen any grandstanding yet. Who has been at it already?

Suella Braverman is screeching for the resignation of the police commissioner. This in turn is feeding the narrative of no go areas in London to attack Sadiq Khan.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Mate, I'm lost now. I'll have re-read later. I thought I had a bit of an idea what was going on, but possibly not. And not for the first time.

Nothing bad. Just trying to bring some real life to @afters OP.

Sometimes I quote for relevance rather than counterpoint.

Sometimes.

 

[Wardy's twin]

In the internet and mobile video world, gotchas are quite easy to obtain.

I posted a few days ago but I was subject to an exchange with some pro Palestinian protestors the other day, who actually approached me to sign a petition.

The exchange was pretty vile and all I questioned was their language had how it might negatively effect their worthwhile humanitarian argument.

IF (and of course I wouldn't), I had recorded the exchange and posted it on Twitter, the other person would be thinking about their job and I've been instantly followed by Lawrence Fox.

Everything now is nuanced. The copper should be subject to a disciplinary, as for the person the exchange did feel pre-planned. Who knows.

At best, they were trying to highlight the fact that outwardly expressions of being Jewish can be effectively a danger to yourself if you walk through a protest in Central London. It's there, I've seen it.

Entrenched positions, beyond reconciliation.

Not sure if the policeman is in he wrong IF he is giving what might be legitimate advise i.e. wearing clothes that indicate you are Jewish might not be clever if approaching a group of pro Palestinian protesters.. same way had he said to me don't wear that Brighton shirt anywhere near the den. The wrong is perhaps the fact he would be unsafe. Maybe I am missing something.

 

[Comrade Sam]

There is no way he just so happened to be passing, the well known Zionist political figure that he is. The copper had been listening to too much GB News shite. I have been on many of the demos, and accompanied by my daughter wearing her star of David. Also with her close friend, an Israeli citizen. On every demo I have seen hundreds of people on the marches in open symbols of Jewishness, even a large group of Hasidic men adorned in pro Palestinian badges. There are also hundreds of placards and banners claiming to be for Jewish supporters of the Palestinian community. I am so bored of this right wing bullshit about the dangers of being Jewish in London, those that push this line are not only using it for their own political ends, but they are creating massive fear and hysteria in the Jewish community.

 

[clapham_gull]

Not sure if the policeman is in he wrong IF he is giving what might be legitimate advise i.e. wearing clothes that indicate you are Jewish might not be clever if approaching a group of pro Palestinian protesters.. same way had he said to me don't wear that Brighton shirt anywhere near the den. The wrong is perhaps the fact he would be unsafe. Maybe I am missing something.

This is London and not Nazi Germany basically.

The optics of "outwardly Jewish" are off the scale. As of the optics of a Police Officer from a few weeks back trying to convince a complainant that there was nuance is the display of a swastika.

At least he needs to be removed from duty for a while.

But this is the MET, they are appalling.

 

[METALMICKY]

Why? So he might be assaulted by people who are outraged at what Israel (a Jewish state actually, even if it doesn't represent the views of all Jews) is doing in Gaza. That would be alright, because he represented 'one of the bad guys' would it? Or tell him to go round another way, and save the risk of an unpleasant incident?

Hasn't a phrase something like 'victim signalling' entered the vocabulary of late..............

Wow just how badly have you misinterpreted my post!

 

[aftershavedave]

Suella Braverman is screeching for the resignation of the police commissioner. This in turn is feeding the narrative of no go areas in London to attack Sadiq Khan.

This is London and not Nazi Germany basically.

The optics of "outwardly Jewish" are off the scale. As of the optics of a Police Officer from a few weeks back trying to convince a complainant that there was nuance is the display of a swastika.

At least he needs to be removed from duty for a while.

But this is the MET, they are appalling.

I really disagree. This was not a "man crossing the road" it was an antagonist. And he was antagosing.

 

[Arkwright]

99% of people at football are there peacefully too.

At Palace the Met treat us all like we’re about to break cordon and go on the rampage. Pretty much everyone just wants to get a train or to their car.

And they LOVE it. Paid hooligans with numbers hidden for the most.

The Italians were the same. All but set the dogs on us before, dumped near Termini after. Loved their shields and batons and searching you 4 times.

To be honest most police officers I know really don't want to be at games and like you just want to get home at the end of a shift.
I'm sure most would rather be on the beat as opposed to being at protests or football. With so much scrutiny and anti police attitudes what chance do they have. I can see why recruitment is so hard, who would want to do the job, your on a hiding to nothing from day one.

 

[clapham_gull]

I am so bored of this right wing bullshit about the dangers of being Jewish in London, those that push this line are not only using it for their own political ends, but they are creating massive fear and hysteria in the Jewish community.

Those who push the line are also within the demonstrators. A very small minority of course, I've seen first hand I'm afraid.

The demonstrator I had an exchange with in Liverpool (who approached me) said anyone who stands, wears, associates themselves with the Star of David is "scum".

Use of the swastika is "a no go area", like mentioning someone's ex-partner in front of their current a dinner party.

I'd be careful with word hysteria by the way. Not required.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Suella Braverman is screeching for the resignation of the police commissioner. This in turn is feeding the narrative of no go areas in London to attack Sadiq Khan.

Ah. As I thought. See post #2 in this thread.

And as for post #3, I was anticipating (correctly) not shit stirring.

 

[Wardy's twin]

This is London and not Nazi Germany basically.

The optics of "outwardly Jewish" are off the scale. As of the optics of a Police Officer from a few weeks back trying to convince a complainant that there was nuance is the display of a swastika.

At least he needs to be removed from duty for a while.

But this is the MET, they are appalling.

Mmm. The policeman noticed he wore an item associated with the Jewish faith...now it's quite possible he is not Jewish e.g. lots of people wear Christian crosses who aren't Christians but the policeman identified him as Jewish and felt it necessary to alert him to a potential threat. So clumsy, definitely, off the scale.. no.

 

[clapham_gull]

I really disagree. This was not a "man crossing the road" it was an antagonist. And he was antagosing.

Mmm. The policeman noticed he wore an item associated with the Jewish faith...now it's quite possible he is not Jewish e.g. lots of people wear Christian crosses who aren't Christians but the policeman identified him as Jewish and felt it necessary to alert him to a potential threat. So clumsy, definitely, off the scale.. no.

I think I've already questioned his motivations. But as a litmus test to the current environment, if a Police Officer is warning somebody being "outwardly Jewish" we are in very very bad place.

 

[Guinness Boy]

To be honest most police officers I know really don't want to be at games and like you just want to get home at the end of a shift.
I'm sure most would rather be on the beat as opposed to being at protests or football. With so much scrutiny and anti police attitudes what chance do they have. I can see why recruitment is so hard, who would want to do the job, your on a hiding to nothing from day one.

No need to cover your number up then eh?