General Election 2017

[carteater]

Why should the fees be based on the parents income?

When you go off to university you will be an adult and will be repaying the tuition fees when you have finished your degree and in employment. Your income post degree will be based on your ability and the job involved and not your parents income.

It's more that it is proven that those from the more privileged backgrounds tend to find it easier to get the higher paying jobs.

Idk, I'm tired and was trying to say that I don't agree with the price of tuition fees, not the fees themselves.

 

[AZ Gull]

So your reason for voting conservative is all based on the benefits for you under the conservatives and nothing about wider society.

 

[Raleigh Chopper]

This is the problem which I mentioned earlier. The stereotypical post and then the similar snide response.

What exactly is child poverty and why does it exist?
For example, some children will be in families where the waster their money on gambling, drugs, alcohol, smoking, fast food, sky TV etc etc. These kids could be deemed to be in poverty, but no matter what support you give families like that, the kids will always be in poverty (the only solution is to remove from the parents).
On the other hand, there's a single mum, working her nuts/tits off on 2 part-time jobs and struggling to pay the rent, bills, food, etc.

Who would I be happy to pay taxes to help? Yep, number 2. So, does that make me a nasty, selfish Tory, or someone who feels that we have to accept some degree of responsibility for our own lives? Nothing is ever simple or straight forward, and the media are always very good at finding examples of hardship/abuse of the system to suit their agenda. Yes, there is hardship and there is also abuse. The solution is to accept that both exist and tackle together.

You're right, again, but cut me some slack here after that ridiculous response, I know I shouldn't but I fell for it again, but if not fishing, that response makes my piss boil, child poverty in this country is right up there on my list, we really should not have it in this country.

 

[dazzer6666]

Why should the fees be based on the parents income?

When you go off to university you will be an adult and will be repaying the tuition fees when you have finished your degree and in employment. Your income post degree will be based on your ability and the job involved and not your parents income.

Interesting point......I've got 2 offspring at Uni. Both were educated in the state system.

No 1 - just about to graduate after 4 years with a First Class Honours from a Russell Group Uni (yes I am deeply proud). Course was fee-free, expensive city-centre accommodation was covered by a bursary (in Scotland, so (mostly English) taxpayer funded). Will be starting work as a nurse next month on £20k pa, with very little prospect of that increasing any time soon. She's done 3,000 hours of 'placement' (unpaid work) during the degree. She's not in it for the money that's for sure.

No 2 - just finishing first year at an English Uni. Already has £13k of debt. £9k per annum gets you about 10 hours a week of lectures, and he'll end up owing £40k after 3 years, with no guarantee of a job at then end of it.

I am genuinely struggling with what a good system should look like. I am lucky in that I could afford to fund them both through Uni if I needed to but access to higher education shouldn't be down to finances/parental support

 

[vegster]

No one else has the right to govern though. She has to give it a try.

Beyond that you are correct though. She's taken two months off a project with a drop dead go live date, split her party, made Corbyn look competent, turned Brighton and Hove completely red and green and is now relying on ex terrorists to look "strong and stable". Complete mess of a woman


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I understand her right to try, what I don't get is the way she unblinkingly expects the public to believe that she is still the best person to lead a government now diminished by her incompetence and hubris ! I really hope that when she gets up for a pee in the middle of the night, when all is dark and quiet, the enormity of her disaster sinks in. Then she might do the decent thing.

 

[studio150]

UKIP at their best.

I have been reading that Nutall failed to register where he was standing so was unable to even vote for himself on election day.

 

[Ernest]

Question Time on BBC1 now

 

[Jim in the West]

I understand her right to try, what I don't get is the way she unblinkingly expects the public to believe that she is still the best person to lead a government now diminished by her incompetence and hubris ! I really hope that when she gets up for a pee in the middle of the night, when all is dark and quiet, the enormity of her disaster sinks in. Then she might do the decent thing.

I hope you are right - but I doubt it. That woman has zero self awareness. She probably still thinks we all love her for being "strong and stable" (my arse)

 

[martin tyler]

So your reason for voting conservative is all based on the benefits for you under the conservatives and nothing about wider society. It would seem you dismissed the Labour slogan of for the many not the few, and instead are happy with for the one and not the rest.

Why would my reason be any different? I work hard for the little that I have. Call it selfish but I've never been given anything for free. Unfortunately I believe you have to work hard in society to achieve things and that's what I do. I don't really want to then be giving it all away just because someone else has decided they want what I have but don't want to work for it.

 

[larus]

You're right, again, but cut me some slack here after that ridiculous response, I know I shouldn't but I fell for it again, but if not fishing, that response makes my piss boil, child poverty in this country is right up there on my list, we really should not have it in this country.

Sorry, no sleight intended. We voted for different parties, but I bet you our ideals are very similar.

Again, is poverty a relative or absolute measure? If a child is in a family where the household is on say 50% (random figure) of the average wage and this is deemed as poverty then it's relative. However, if the childs parent(s) can't afford proper food due to both working hard yet being on minimum wage, then it's absolute. These people needs and deserve support. I'm not trying to be an ass here, and I feel we should support those in genuine need and hardship. However, I don't feel we should support those who don't try to help themselves.

I also think we need to build a lot more houses so that the supply/demand equation get balanced, and also change the university fees as £9k p.a. is much too high. £3-4k would be acceptable IMO, and again, not paid until a certain level of earnings is reached. I'd even go further - core degrees (medical, engineering, etc.) should be free.

 

[Lyndhurst 14]

Blimey - Labour take Kensington as last seat to be announced

 

[symyjym]

That's a fair question, but what do you propose as an alternative?

I plan to let them get on with it. I didn't vote in Brexit and I didn't vote yesterday because politics these days is a circus sideshow in disguise as democracy. I am just here to mock it and if it ties itself up in knots it will be self inflicted. The advantage of us negotiating Brexit is that we will be too busy to plot regime change so it's a win win as far as I am concerned. Giving the government a virtually impossible job is quite funny.

The only way out for them is to concede that leaving the EU is far too complex to undertake (If it really is?) and be honest about it. To unpick and renegotiate 40 years of agreements could take 40 years.

 

[Dick Swiveller]

Was that Perseus on QT slagging off everyone just now? Utter hatstand.

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[lawros left foot]

Isabella Oakeshote is a vile piece of work, I'm really not surprised she used to write for the Mail.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Isabella Oakeshote is a vile piece of work, I'm really not surprised she used to write for the Mail.

If you mean Isabel Oakshott you're correct.











































I would though.

 

[soistes]

I am genuinely struggling with what a good system should look like. I am lucky in that I could afford to fund them both through Uni if I needed to but access to higher education shouldn't be down to finances/parental support

I agree with this 100%, and think there should be free access to all levels of education including higher education, irrespective of parental income.

There is, however, a financing issue. I got 6 years of free higher education, plus a maintenance grant and ended up with no debt, but in the 1970s when I attended university, only 5-6% of the age cohort went to HE, a tiny elite minority. It's now 40%-plus and that does cost.

I think that one possibly option is a graduate tax, whereby everyone who can enter HE pays nothing, but graduates subsequently pay an extra x% on their income tax, when their income reaches a certain level. That's a progressive tax system under which only those who end up a higher earners as a result of their higher education end up paying more.
It's not completely different from the current system, which also has a minimum income level below which you don't pay back your student debt, but it has the advantage of not being a 'debt' and not reinforcing a debt culture.


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[vegster]

Isabella Oakeshote is a vile piece of work, I'm really not surprised she used to write for the Mail.

I can't warm to her at all, bit of a gobshite by the sound of it tonight.

 

[lawros left foot]

If you mean Isabel Oakshott you're correct.











































I would though.

That's her.


















You're better than that.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Labour crying about unfair coverage, but they fing loved it when farage was getting hammered.

 

[Machiavelli]

Yeah working hard making a success of himself and his family, paying taxes, taking very little out, what a selfish so and so.

Whereas the students who flocked to Labour were in no way influenced by having their debts/fees wiped out.

Students, of course, don't work hard. It's only those from Middle Earth that do so.