No. It's just got worse. And millions of small businesses are being ruined while most people carry on as "normal".
However I'm not sure what anyone expected with Cummings, sorry Johnson in charge.
Full national lockdown (not education) 4/11 - 1/12 possible
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However I'm not sure what anyone expected with Cummings, sorry Johnson in charge.
Stuart Munday
Well-known member
Went to a National Trust place with the kids on Saturday, booked our slot no problem, when we arrived it was absolutely packed.
Done this loads of times over the last few months and one of the advantages of lockdown meant that even during the really busy times like in August numbers were restricted so as long as you had booked it was easy to park plenty of space nowhere too busy, great for a stroll with the kids.
Saturday was the busiest I have seen anywhere this year, I wonder if the National Trust have increased their numbers otherwise something wasn't quite right.
Done this loads of times over the last few months and one of the advantages of lockdown meant that even during the really busy times like in August numbers were restricted so as long as you had booked it was easy to park plenty of space nowhere too busy, great for a stroll with the kids.
Saturday was the busiest I have seen anywhere this year, I wonder if the National Trust have increased their numbers otherwise something wasn't quite right.
darkwolf666
Well-known member
Do you know, the thing I find most surprising about your story is that National Trust Properties are open!
What exactly IS closed, apart from pubs, cafes and hairdressers? *
* I know there isn't an exhaustive list, but it does seem a bit haphazard lockdown this time!
The Wizard
Well-known member
- Jul 2, 2009
- 18,399
ALL of those current projections bar the Warwick are already miles wrong, I’m sure all of these models were based on the infection rate continuing to increase as well, which clearly hasn’t happened. I was sceptical and against local lockdowns in many areas to be honest but I must say looking at the numbers, it does appear the local lockdowns did help in some areas
The infection rates were already plateauing and the ‘second peak’ now looks to have passed according to many scientific experts, so i’d love for the people who made these projections to explain how we will go from averaging 300 deaths per day to 1500 if the infection rate isn’t going up?
My prediction is we will reach a maximum of 5-600 deaths per day, which as you say is still a horrible number but regardless of agendas of all of us I think it’s clear this lockdown was based on bungled data that wasn’t represented properly, even independent watchdog have said the way the data was presented was wrong.
As an aside point, it’s intriguing that our infection rates aren’t rising anywhere near as steeply as some of our European neighbours, France recording 90k cases and having nearly 30000 in hospital is really shocking, I wonder if there is a correspondence between countries that had harsher lockdowns the first time and there being less immunity and so numbers have got way bigger there?
Stuart Munday
Well-known member
Heard today from a good source that we will come out of this so called lockdown as planned first week of December unless things get seriously worse but there are plans to do another one in the second week of January, certain departments are starting to prepare for this already.
- Jul 10, 2003
- 27,766
Everything you have said makes sense. The one issue I have is that this Government has proven itself completely incapable of planning a lockdown in the 2-3 week period between half term and the start of this second lockdown. There is no possible way they are capable of planning anything in over 8 weeks time.
After all, if they were, they wouldn't have to ask to delay Strictly at 15 minutes notice would they
Jimmy Grimble
Well-known member
Roads are certainly no quieter than before this ‘lockdown’.
darkwolf666
Well-known member
Just fallen foul of the ridiculousness of this current lockdown.
To keep ourselves safe, as a family we only go out once a day for exercise, talking a walk from our home, round the local cemetery and back again, taking us about an hour, good walking exercise, and seeing nobody, apart from the odd grieving relative putting flowers on graves, and squirrels burying their stash for winter.
Today, as we left the cemetery a worker was putting a sign up to say the cemetery is now closed, excepting for funerals...
So I can go shopping, with hundreds of other people, walk around a National Trust property and a myriad other places where I might come into contact with people, but can't walk around a cemetery populated by the already dead - it beggars belief!
To keep ourselves safe, as a family we only go out once a day for exercise, talking a walk from our home, round the local cemetery and back again, taking us about an hour, good walking exercise, and seeing nobody, apart from the odd grieving relative putting flowers on graves, and squirrels burying their stash for winter.
Today, as we left the cemetery a worker was putting a sign up to say the cemetery is now closed, excepting for funerals...
So I can go shopping, with hundreds of other people, walk around a National Trust property and a myriad other places where I might come into contact with people, but can't walk around a cemetery populated by the already dead - it beggars belief!
Might be going into something similar to a lockdown over here. We'll see over the next week.
The positive side: the herd immunity concept seems to be working as things are still pretty calm in Stockholm (that for various reasons normally should be in a really bad spot), and they were far worse off than the rest of the country this spring. If any of you believe that you've had the virus and worry about getting it again, perhaps this could invoke some positive emotions.
The negative side: Sweden is pretty "capital biased". I dont know for sure but I would imagine Stockholm gets more attention and resources compared to the rest of the country than what would be the average in Europe. This means that the previous non-lockdown strategy turns quite dangerous as in some regions, the healthcare system can not deal with the type of spikes seen in Stockholm this spring.
So far its no disaster, the number of ICU spots occupied by covid patients is still around 1/5 (meaning ca 100 people) of what it was in March/April, but the development is worrying.
Personally I hope the government and Anders Tegnell stays strong in this and avoid lockdown, but introduce a new set of harsher restrictions. There's additional measures that can be done without disrupting too much of society.
Although not at any cost. Things could get to a level where a lockdown is required. I dont know if this is well-known outside of Sweden despite all the talk about our strategy, but Tegnell from the get-go said that there could be a lockdown in Sweden.
The main difference in the Tegnell vs Other countries attitude to lockdown is that: you can do it once. Repeated lockdowns or going in and out of lockdowns would, according to Tegnell, probably make it inefficient, as people and businesses would get too relaxed about the concept and possibly create counterproductive effects.
You could say he saved the lockdown for a rainy day, and its possible the rainy day is not that far away. We're joining the international community.
The positive side: the herd immunity concept seems to be working as things are still pretty calm in Stockholm (that for various reasons normally should be in a really bad spot), and they were far worse off than the rest of the country this spring. If any of you believe that you've had the virus and worry about getting it again, perhaps this could invoke some positive emotions.
The negative side: Sweden is pretty "capital biased". I dont know for sure but I would imagine Stockholm gets more attention and resources compared to the rest of the country than what would be the average in Europe. This means that the previous non-lockdown strategy turns quite dangerous as in some regions, the healthcare system can not deal with the type of spikes seen in Stockholm this spring.
So far its no disaster, the number of ICU spots occupied by covid patients is still around 1/5 (meaning ca 100 people) of what it was in March/April, but the development is worrying.
Personally I hope the government and Anders Tegnell stays strong in this and avoid lockdown, but introduce a new set of harsher restrictions. There's additional measures that can be done without disrupting too much of society.
Although not at any cost. Things could get to a level where a lockdown is required. I dont know if this is well-known outside of Sweden despite all the talk about our strategy, but Tegnell from the get-go said that there could be a lockdown in Sweden.
The main difference in the Tegnell vs Other countries attitude to lockdown is that: you can do it once. Repeated lockdowns or going in and out of lockdowns would, according to Tegnell, probably make it inefficient, as people and businesses would get too relaxed about the concept and possibly create counterproductive effects.
You could say he saved the lockdown for a rainy day, and its possible the rainy day is not that far away. We're joining the international community.
Weststander
Well-known member
That’s true, with the one big exception of the evening rush hour .... it’s disappeared.
A week ago Dyke Road Avenue every weekday between 4 and 6 was its traditional horrendous jam backing up half a mile going northwards up to the roundabout. Now barely a car.
I assume that office workers are now WFH, with most central Brighton stores closed.
Billy the Fish
Technocrat
For all the moaning on here about lockdown not being worth it, rules being contradictory etc. Offices must be the environment that transmits viruses the most, that alone must make some kind of difference after a month.
darkwolf666
Well-known member
I hope you are right. Although certainly in my area, Swale, it looks like gains in reduction from WFH will be offset against infection spread on school buses.
Oh well, you win some, you lose some!
- Jul 10, 2003
- 27,766
IIRC opticians and dentists were closed on the first lockdown and I would have expected them to be closed again. I guess leaving them and schools open provides justification for it not actually being called a 'lockdown' but whatever terminology they are using for this one ?
Billy the Fish
Technocrat
I know you meant that flippantly but it's probably not too far from reality. HMG, SAGE, PHE, NHS (because I'm sure it's not just Cummings and Boris setting policy in their evil lair) are spinning plates, they're probably having to stop some things in order to keep others going, as mentioned above.
Is it PotG?
Thrifty non-licker
Not personally being impacted by lockdown much at all (other not having seen daughter for months) but struggling to see how this version is going to help much with kids and students potentially carrying the virus everywhere. All we seem to be doing is cutting out pub and restaurant-spreading and killing independent businesses - and the few places we went to pre-lockdown were all operating what seemed like very strong protocols anyway.
I went to the local Tesco a couple of days ago for the first time in months. The number of people ignoring distancing was enormous, particularly the more elderly - leaning across to grab stuff, blocking aisles whilst they have a chat etc. Quite a few without masks too - saw one guy put one on to go through the main doors (where someone was checking) then immediately take it off.
Can’t imagine what the garden centres are like - they’re rammed with meandering silver-tops getting in the way at the best of times.
I went to the local Tesco a couple of days ago for the first time in months. The number of people ignoring distancing was enormous, particularly the more elderly - leaning across to grab stuff, blocking aisles whilst they have a chat etc. Quite a few without masks too - saw one guy put one on to go through the main doors (where someone was checking) then immediately take it off.
Can’t imagine what the garden centres are like - they’re rammed with meandering silver-tops getting in the way at the best of times.
Billy the Fish
Technocrat
Completely agree.