Fans Re-united - 24th September @ Home Park, Plymouth

[Doc Lynam]

Yep, that's them Doc.

Heaney wants the ground, and then sell the club to Ridsdale.

Heaney is indeed a property developer which is unnerving in itself.



I also believe there have been delays as there is yet another complication with the BIL deal. The ground has a legally binding covenant on it. It can only be used for the purpose of sport/football (I forget the exact wording, but basically the ground can't be used for anything else). Heaney/Ridsdale/Guilfoyle have had talks with Plymouth City Council. A lot of speculation has been around whether they are trying to get the covenant overturned/rescinded, or whether they have just popped along for a chat to see what they can and can't do. There's talk of a Hotel/Retail outlet. We have a chap over on Pasoti who is our resident sleuth. He spotted the formation of new comapnies at Companies House of PAFC 125 Ltd, PAFC Stadium Ltd and more worryingly, Plymouth Retail Park Ltd. The latter two having Heaney as the sole director.

Aha, just found the covenent in full:

Not to cause or permit the Property or any part thereof to be used for any purpose other than a professional football stadium with other uses associated therewith namely: offices, storage, temporary accommodation, leisure uses (where uses are integral to the stadium), restaurants and bars, the retailing of sport and leisure products and merchandise, health and fitness sports clubs (where uses are integral to the stadium), public entertainment or education and for the holding of shows, conferences and events and also for such other associated purposes as the Transferor (council) may approve (such approval not to be unreasonably withheld or delayed).

It's the delays that are becoming unpallatable. With every delay instigated by BIL, liquidation gets a step closer. It's only the dedication, professionalism and sacrifices made by the playing and non playing staff that have kept us alive thus far.

I may be wrong here, but I think the administrator is now liable for wages. Hence why Guilfoyles boss is keen to pull the plug. Guilfoyle even took BIL to court to try and get them to stump up more cash to pay the wages last month.

He lost.

Again, I may be wrong here, so I'll chose my words carefully. If I recall correctly, part of the preferred bid process was the immediate payment of £1M to pay immediate liabilities. Basically, I think BIL should of stumped up that amount of cash to buy exclusivity in doing the deal. So far, they have paid around £300K, and that's why we can't pay wages.

OK SO WE NEED SOMEONE WITH LEGAL CONNECTIONS TO HAVE A LOOK AT THIS
It seems the council own your ground, tell me if im wrong because they have the covenent detailing what is deemed as (integral to the stadium) can a covenant be overturned by the council? Do we know anyone on twitter or any free legal sites or money sites eg MoneySavingExpert.com Forums that might be able to shed more light on this. What does the council have to gain or lose?

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

Time for Paul Samrah to enter the stage.

 

[peterward]

Also do we have a twitter account set up for this yet? I've been sending the article I penned yesterday round to various journalist contacts. Hope someone picks it up - twohundredpercent.net have already agreed to host it (they're the second google hit if you search fans united plymouth) so its getting out there!

I know a couple of national media newspaper journo's, a channel 4 production company owner and a producer who works for both channel 4 dispatches and BBC panorama .... happy to contact them if needed?

 

[GibGreen]

Doc,

The club bought the ground off the council a couple of years ago. The club payed £2.7M for it, but the covenent remains. I say the club, it's actually mortgaged to Lombard Finance and they have first charge on the mortgage.

The Compulsory Voluntary Agreement to exit administration has been agreed with 0.7p in the pound payable to all creditors with the exception of the football creditors who must be paid in full.

The main football and secured creditors are Lombard, Mastpoint Ltd - £2.1M, Roy Gardner our former chairman who started this nightmare - £400K, Plymouth Argyle Youth Development Trust (note, this is not the Fans' Trust) who are owed £300K and the players contracts.

Incidently, I spoke of ethics earlier. One of the creditors getting 0.7p in the pound is the St Johns Ambulance for heavens sake. How wrong is that!!

A further incidently: the creditors list also revealed that we owed Swindon Town 4p!! A replica kit I reckon.

Gallows humour.

 

[peterward]

Comments welcome, have tried to just provide basic facts and then have the links for more information.


Fans Re-united - 24th September @ Home Park, Plymouth

I'm sure we're all aware of the plight of Plymouth Argyle, not just on the pitch but more importantly the off the pitch situation.

They are in real danger of them going into liquidation. This would then mean our friends down the road would no longer exist as a team. The knock on effect throughout the football pyramid would be immense. Their players have taken a 60% paycut to ensure the team can survive for another few weeks. We, the fans of the sport, need to show solidarity.

We need to rally the troops and take as many fans from different clubs as possible down there to get behind Argyle. Wear your colours and show them how much support they have from around the country.

Please, if you're registered on a different football forum, copy this into their forum. We need to raise awareness of what is going on and ensure it becomes a successful and productive day. Only a few years ago this club was in a stable condition and we should all remember that this could be YOUR club.

Saturday 24th September is Fans re-united day @ Home Park

Fans Re-united - 24th September @ Home Park, Plymouth

PASOTI View topic - Fans Re-United-Support Is On Its Way

[/QUOTE]

On Woodchips website Fans Reunited - Help Save Argyle may I suggest one page called "Get Involved" to empower fans from other clubs to run with this also, you could place some of the excellent letters already written as standard drafts for them to copy and then;

1) send to their club (to seek involvement/go into matchday programme),
2) their local newspapers/TV
3) to put up something on their own fans forums
4) to contact their official supporters association - I.e to become personally responsible for actively maximising their own clubs/local areas contribution and involvement with these events.
5) Money collecting by bucket or other means at their own matchdays and how to send it that to the greentaverners Plymouth trust.

 

[Lush]

On Woodchips website Fans Reunited - Help Save Argyle may I suggest one page called "Get Involved" to empower fans from other clubs to run with this also, you could place some of the excellent letters already written as standard drafts for them to copy and then;

1) send to their club (to seek involvement/go into matchday programme),
2) their local newspapers/TV
3) to put up something on their own fans forums
4) to contact their official supporters association - I.e to become personally responsible for actively maximising their own clubs/local areas contribution and involvement with these events.
5) Money collecting by bucket or other means at their own matchdays and how to send it that to the greentaverners Plymouth trust.

Also needs Facebook Twitter links adding if poss - and a guest list.

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

Great suggestions, peterward and Lush. To which I'd like to add, perhaps in the letter writing, some kind of pressure is put on the administrator to forgo some of their fee in order to pay St John's Ambulance.

 

[Jimmy's gonna get ya!]

I am a little concerned about money being directed to the PAFC administrators. people with good intentions have already bought scarves etc from the official plymouth website thinking they are helping, but are they? With st johns only getting 7p in the pound surely some kind of seperate fund should be set up to direct money as the supporters of PAFC choose appropriate, not the admins who will screw the most deserving??

 

[peterward]

Stellar work on the website thus far woodchip btw, assuming you can add html to it?, may I suggest you get try and get the code from the greentaverners for their PAYPAL DONATE link and include their PAYPAL DONATE button on every page of your website. If someone just reads the first page give them an opportunity to part with their dosh!

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

This site gets about a zillion hits every second so could we ask Bozza to turn it green for the weekend of the leeds game and fans reunited?

 

[Ste @GoS]

With st johns only getting 7p in the pound ...

I'm ashamed to say, along with all other unsecured creditors, e.g. local small businesses, they got 0.7p in the pound.

 

[Jimmy's gonna get ya!]

I'm ashamed to say, along with all other unsecured creditors, e.g. local small businesses, they got 0.7p in the pound.

Well shit, all the more reason to set up a seperate fund no? We can't allow good intentioned people to continue giving the admins money thinking they are helping The Cause.

perhaps I am being naive, I have no clue about how this all works but the bottom line is, if people are gonna make good willed donations, lets at least make sure that money is being directed to the right places? Somehow?

 

[Doc Lynam]

Doc,

The club bought the ground off the council a couple of years ago. The club payed £2.7M for it, but the covenent remains. I say the club, it's actually mortgaged to Lombard Finance and they have first charge on the mortgage.

The Compulsory Voluntary Agreement to exit administration has been agreed with 0.7p in the pound payable to all creditors with the exception of the football creditors who must be paid in full.

The main football and secured creditors are Lombard, Mastpoint Ltd - £2.1M, Roy Gardner our former chairman who started this nightmare - £400K, Plymouth Argyle Youth Development Trust (note, this is not the Fans' Trust) who are owed £300K and the players contracts.

Incidently, I spoke of ethics earlier. One of the creditors getting 0.7p in the pound is the St Johns Ambulance for heavens sake. How wrong is that!!

A further incidently: the creditors list also revealed that we owed Swindon Town 4p!! A replica kit I reckon.

Gallows humour.

Again well written GibGreen, god this is a mess. Its taking time just to work out who is liable for what!!!
Still think your covenant needs to be checked out independetly, if it hasnt already, so everyone knows where the club (supporters) and council stand.

 

[Doc Lynam]

Well shit, all the more reason to set up a seperate fund no? We can't allow good intentioned people to continue giving the admins money thinking they are helping The Cause.

perhaps I am being naive, I have no clue about how this all works but the bottom line is, if people are gonna make good willed donations, lets at least make sure that money is being directed to the right places? Somehow?

But this might be part of it, giving money to the club is paying the people who seem to be soaking up the money.

 

[Jimmy's gonna get ya!]

But this is part of it giving money to the club is paying the people who seem to be soaking up the money.

Ok, if that is the case, then surely peopleshould be warned about buying PAFC official merchandise for example. Thinking they are helping when they are not? Correct me if I am wrong. If Club money is being "soaked up", donations don't help. Spend the money on a train ticket to Plymouth to invade the pitch? Please forgive me if I am missing the point.

 

[Doc Lynam]

Ok, if that is the case, then surely peopleshould be warned about buying PAFC official merchandise for example. Thinking they are helping when they are not? Correct me if I am wrong. If Club money is being "soaked up", donations don't help. Spend the money on a train ticket to Plymouth to invade the pitch? Please forgive me if I am missing the point.

No i dont think you are missing the point at all, someone who is clearly legally minded needs to go through the recent post by GibGreen because im coming to the same conclusion as you. My instincts are everyone should be outside the ground. We need someone to look at this fast to decide the best way we can help the fans protect the club. And also what level of club they would be left with being a freehold property they may have bankruptcy laws which provide important property protections dont know if this works for a business! But thats a seperate issue.

 

[Doc Lynam]

Doc,

The club bought the ground off the council a couple of years ago. The club payed £2.7M for it, but the covenent remains. I say the club, it's actually mortgaged to Lombard Finance and they have first charge on the mortgage.

The Compulsory Voluntary Agreement to exit administration has been agreed with 0.7p in the pound payable to all creditors with the exception of the football creditors who must be paid in full.

The main football and secured creditors are Lombard, Mastpoint Ltd - £2.1M, Roy Gardner our former chairman who started this nightmare - £400K, Plymouth Argyle Youth Development Trust (note, this is not the Fans' Trust) who are owed £300K and the players contracts.

Incidently, I spoke of ethics earlier. One of the creditors getting 0.7p in the pound is the St Johns Ambulance for heavens sake. How wrong is that!!

A further incidently: the creditors list also revealed that we owed Swindon Town 4p!! A replica kit I reckon.

Gallows humour.

Plymouth Argyle - Heaney Is Already Having An Influence At Argyle!

 

[zego]

... ...
you can see where this is going next? have to sell the ground blah blah...... and waltz off with the cash. That shark Ridsdale totally screwed up Leeds, he lied and screwed up Cardiff and he is going to buy the club an all its land assets for £1??

What a disgrace this is happening again

You missed out the similar episode at Barnsley, after departing from Leeds.

Indeed: "What a disgrace this is happening again"
... and again ... and again ... and ... ?? ??

 

[public school boy]

I'll be there not out of a sense of duty but because I care about Plymouth as a city and it's important that it has a football club.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Many thanks.

I should also point out that opinion on Ridsdale is pretty divided. When he first arrived, back in December 10, there is no doubt that he worked tirelessly to unravel the financial nightmare created by the previous board. He staved off a couple of winding up petitions from HMRC for unpaid tax bills with player sales (including of course the Nooooooooooooooooone deal). Ultimately though, we obviously still ended up in Administration.

Sounds similar to when Archer first turned up at Brighton, sorting out the Stanley/Lloyd mess and selling Mark Beeney to Leeds to stave off the winding-up petition against us. Perhaps one difference is that Risdale is at least a football person, as his Leeds experience shows, but just incompetent at it.

So this is the man attempting to buy PAFC Kevin Heaney, (property developer!!) wanting to buy PA ground. Just not sure why he wants to keep his hands in Truro City a conference south team?

Truro is a club on the up, flying through the leagues ala Histon/Wimbledon. Heaney has said he is more interested in that than Plymouth. Heaney sounds like bad news all round - but does he already own the ground?