[Music] Fairytale of New York - PC gone mad or correct decision?

[Beanstalk]

Ah here we go, loads of people exploding with righteous rage on social media over something that really isn't actually important to them.

Changing the lyrics to a song because it is offensive to some people shouldn't be an issue. The fact is "you" might not be offended, but there are people out there that genuinely are and, as others have said, this will be played 1,000s of times over the next month - Who really cares if the lyrics are changed as long as it's for the right reasons? I know I don't. Besides, they aren't altering the song, they're just playing a different version by the same artist.

I've also just seen that populist sewer-weasel Laurence Fox is the "frontman" of this protest. On that note, I've never been more certain that this is the correct course of action.

Could a mod do to Fox what we did to Mike Dean? Really should be autocorrected to Herrenvolk Shite.

 

[nicko31]

Would they play Dire Straights' Money for Nothing out of interest?

Vaguely remember this getting banned in Canada for "the little ****** got his own jet airline line..." (I notice NSC have banned this word in auto-correct)

Action on the Pogues seem is a bit OTT, for me its the greatest Christmas Song of All Time

 

[LlcoolJ]

Q; where does NSC stand on Soft Cells 'Sex Dwarf'

A: About 3 foot 6

no doubt ill be banned proberly for being hightist

Regards

DF

Ah, you're the one we're still replying to (it did take a second or two, as ever). I've always loved a parody. Especially when the original account is dead.

 

[Commander]

What actually happens when somebody gets 'offended' by something in a song written over 30 years ago?

Is it something bad? I guess it must be something horrendous, by the sound of things. Those poor people, I wonder if they'll be OK.

 

[LlcoolJ]

Whilst I have sympathy with most of your post, your last statement is a little silly. As previously mentioned, Fairytale is not a homophobic song. I would suggest that things being 'consigned to the unacceptable', as well as ringing a bit of 'Fahrenheit 451', does little or nothing to change the challenges faced by those affected and throws the baby out with the bathwater (Tenpole Tudor anyone?).

Art is complex. It has many intended and unintended consequences. Interpretation is beyond the creator's control and it is perfectly possible to challenge, or even condemn elements of a piece of art, or artist's perceived intent and still learn from, or love other elements.

WB Yeats's 'The Second Coming' is one of my favourite poems. It gave Chinua Achebe the title of 'Things Fall Apart' and Joan Didion 'Slouching Towards Bethlehem'. It was written in post WWI Europe and I interpret it as a warning of the coming of fascism / totalitarianism that is still very relevant today. However, Yeats was an Irish nationalist and supporter of the crypto-fascist 'Blueshirts', so I'm pretty certain didn't intend my interpretation. It doesn't matter. I take what I want from his work. He can't correct me from the past.

Consigning things to 'the unacceptable' because of outdated attitudes, prejudices, or language chucks away the offensive element, but with it goes everything that may be of worth. An understanding of historical context and the ability to separate intent, contemporary attitudes and the experiences / advantages of the creators allows us to consider and discuss why the misogyny, homophobia, racism or classism was expressed. Understanding the origins of prejudice seems far more useful to challenging prejudice than not acknowledging and considering anything or anybody deemed to be displaying it. The latter is a dead end as it only stops prejudice being openly expressed, not being felt.

As per Stato, I basically agree with everything in this post of yours.

Saw The Pogues on a few occasions as a teenager. Once with Kirsty . Class. And Shane was always absolutely shitfaced and having to be held up by the end of it by a couple of bouncers.

How he's still alive I have no idea but I'm very glad that he is

 

[Mr Bridger]

As per Stato, I basically agree with everything in this post of yours.

Saw The Pogues on a few occasions as a teenager. Once with Kirsty . Class. And Shane was always absolutely shitfaced and having to be held up by the end of it by a couple of bouncers.

How he's still alive I have no idea but I'm very glad that he is

Agree, seen them a couple of times and always shitfaced.
Most memorable was at St Andrew’s Birmingham 1989, a couple of months after Hillsborough.
The Pogues came on and started playing the battle March medley before McGowan stumbled on stage with a bottle of Whisky and what looked like a Joint.
He just sat down and watched the crowd for a while before eventually stumbling up to his feet when Boys from County Hell started, by this time everyone was whipped up into a frenzy with anticipation and the surge was superb if you were a youth and in the middle of it, but bearing in mind what had just happened a couple of months earlier they had to stop playing.
McGowan started mumbling some indecipherable shit, so some other bod came on and told everyone to turn around and take a step back to ease the crush otherwise they wouldn’t continue.

Eventually they started up again, and the same thing happened again, glorious day

 

[LlcoolJ]

Agree, seen them a couple of times and always shitfaced.
Most memorable was at St Andrew’s Birmingham 1989, a couple of months after Hillsborough.
The Pogues came on and started playing the battle March medley before McGowan stumbled on stage with a bottle of Whisky and what looked like a Joint.
He just sat down and watched the crowd for a while before eventually stumbling up to his feet when Boys from County Hell started, by this time everyone was whipped up into a frenzy with anticipation and the surge was superb if you were a youth and in the middle of it, but bearing in mind what had just happened a couple of months earlier they had to stop playing.
McGowan started mumbling some indecipherable shit, so some other bod came on and told everyone to turn around and take a step back to ease the crush otherwise they wouldn’t continue.

Eventually they started up again, and the same thing happened again, glorious day

Superb.

I always remember the first gig me and my mates went to at the Brighton Centre to see them. Loads of Irish trying to finish their booze before they got to the end of the queue. "Go on lads, have a drink. We're not letting these feckers take it off us!" We were hammered.

Can't remember who was the support, but as soon as The Pogues came on and the lights went off, everyone on the balcony jumped off down to the dancefloor. Being helped down by other people or just going for it. Mental.

I was 14 and shitting it about doing my ankle for climbing, so we just walked round to the lower tier entrance and the bouncers had given up.

We walked straight into the mayhem.

 

[LlcoolJ]

Superb.

I always remember the first gig me and my mates went to at the Brighton Centre to see them. Loads of Irish trying to finish their booze before they got to the end of the queue. "Go on lads, have a drink. We're not letting these feckers take it off us!" We were hammered.

Can't remember who was the support, but as soon as The Pogues came on and the lights went off, everyone on the balcony jumped off down to the dancefloor. Being helped down by other people or just going for it. Mental.

I was 14 and shitting it about doing my ankle for climbing, so we just walked round to the lower tier entrance and the bouncers had given up.

We walked straight into the mayhem.

Did always feel a bit guilty about that one though as it was my Mum who first took me to see them (and loads of bands) and she was going to get a ticket for that gig.

I asked her if she couldn't as I was going with my mates and she agreed but was a bit pissed off.

It was definitely the correct decision, but I know it still rankles with her a bit when we talk about it.

In fairness though, I did take her to see Tricky for her 50th birthday and he was her favourite artist at the time.

 

[KZNSeagull]

Does this mean that I won't have to listen to it 6 times a shift at Tesco? That would be good.

 

[Stato]

Superb.

I always remember the first gig me and my mates went to at the Brighton Centre to see them. Loads of Irish trying to finish their booze before they got to the end of the queue. "Go on lads, have a drink. We're not letting these feckers take it off us!" We were hammered.

Can't remember who was the support, but as soon as The Pogues came on and the lights went off, everyone on the balcony jumped off down to the dancefloor. Being helped down by other people or just going for it. Mental.

I was 14 and shitting it about doing my ankle for climbing, so we just walked round to the lower tier entrance and the bouncers had given up.

We walked straight into the mayhem.

If that was the 'If I Should Fall From Grace With God' tour, I was there too. The support was Lynval Golding's post Specials band After Tonite and Lynval came out for the encore to play 'A Message To You Rudy'. Kirsty came on to sing Fairytale and was welcomed with sexist chants about what she should do 'for the lads'. I understand that guesting on that tour helped to cure her long term stage-fright. In phobia treatment terms, facing that every night, seems like some extreme 'flooding'

 

[BRIGHT ON Q]

A classic Christmas song that has been part of Christmas for pretty much as long as I can remember.
Obviously no more....on BBC.

 

[Icy Gull]

If you're over 12, why are you listening to Radio 1 anyway?/QUOTE]

Thanks, that did make me laugh

 

[Surrey_Albion]

 

[Stat Brother]

I'm reliably informed that across the entire continent of Africa people are aware of Christmas time.
I also am aware of stuff growing, rain falling and rivers flowing.

 

[Curious Orange]

It should also be noted that the editorial teams at each of the BBC's radio stations are perfectly entitled to schedule whatever they like to be played provided it matches the remit of that station, and I don't really see the need to justify any specific decision to their audience.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

A classic Christmas song that has been part of Christmas for pretty much as long as I can remember.
Obviously no more....on BBC Radio 1.

EFA. It's still going to be played on Radio 2 and 6Music leaves the choice over which version to play up to the DJ.

 

[The Clamp]

Remember hearing McGowan’s South London accent when he was interviewed some years back. I like The Pogues, they throw a helluva party but I never knew they were English. Didn’t sit that well with me if I’m honest.

Don’t listen to Radio 1 and there’s far, far better Pogues songs to listen to so I care not a jot but if one of the BBC stations decided it doesn’t want someone saying ****** on air, it’s hard to disagree with.

 

[Questions]

My sister says it’s her xmas song along with her late husband. She thinks it’s uplifting......... is it ?

 

[The Clamp]

My sister says it’s her xmas song along with her late husband. She thinks it’s uplifting......... is it ?

One of those songs that has an uplifting melody that belies it’s dark lyrics.

 

[keaton]

What actually happens when somebody gets 'offended' by something in a song written over 30 years ago?

Is it something bad? I guess it must be something horrendous, by the sound of things. Those poor people, I wonder if they'll be OK.

If you want some examples of that sort of thing you could look at the fuss kicked up on here everytime someone calls us a small club or John Barnes mentions us in a tweet.