[Misc] F1 2021

[Icy Gull]

Looks like Mercedes have done a U turn. Did Lewis chuck his toys out of the pram after hearing Toto go public, post race, with words to the effect of “no further development this season we are concentrating on next year now”. ?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/57651115

 

[zefarelly]

2 clicks of boost and polish a few bolt heads

5 minute job.

LH should be 'win' competitive @ Sillystone and Spa.

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

Looks like Mercedes have done a U turn. Did Lewis chuck his toys out of the pram after hearing Toto go public, post race, with words to the effect of “no further development this season we are concentrating on next year now”. ?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/57651115

As said to you before, it's all just mind games, cloak and dagger stuff and PR spin. They've assessed the PR / reputation to sponsors and Mercedes and decided Toto's comments weren't positive for the 'brand', even though they probably were completely the right thing to say to your competitors. I doubt anything has changed whatsoever in the background.

 

[Icy Gull]

As said to you before, it's all just mind games, cloak and dagger stuff and PR spin. They've assessed the PR / reputation to sponsors and Mercedes and decided Toto's comments weren't positive for the 'brand', even though they probably were completely the right thing to say to your competitors. I doubt anything has changed whatsoever in the background.

Can’t agree, it’s fecking terrible PR to come out after a race in which your cars have been blown away by the opposition having pretty well dominated for 6 or so years, and say we will not be developing our car any further this year. No fecker outside Mercedes cares what is being done for next season, the “now” is what they’re interested in.The last result must have been an absolute hammer blow to Mercedes. Where are the mind games in looking beaten when you have been?

The brand now looks second best, so to come out with Toto’s comments was a bad misjudgement imo. Maybe Toto was so pissed he was having a little sulk and looking for an excuse as to why they are being outperformed dramatically now.

If your comments carried weight, I imagine most PL teams on a bad run would have used the same mind games and PR, “we have pretty well given up on this season because we are concentrating on next season”

(That last comment is tongue in cheek btw)

 

[Audax]

Suspect the muddled messaging from Mercedes is coming from a scenario like this:

1. Mercedes plan out a series of development updates for the 2021 car.

2. Mercedes have completed the development work, but some of those parts have not yet been rolled out (eg they are earmarked for specific circuits, or had long lead times to get onto the car).

3. Toto declares that they won't be doing any further development on the 2021 car - which could be true.

4. Whoever it was declares that they still have upgrades to go onto the car - also true, as they have parts already developed that aren't on the car yet.

Statements 3 and 4 are not mutually exclusive, *but* they do create confusion around exactly what is going on at Mercedes purely because they way they've made the statements they are easily interpreted as being contradictory and/or a change of planning.

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

Can’t agree, it’s fecking terrible PR to come out after a race in which your cars have been blown away by the opposition having pretty well dominated for 6 or so years, and say with we will not be developing our car any further. The last result must have been an absolute hammer blow to Mercedes. Where are the mind games in looking beaten when you have been?

The brand now looks second best, so to come out with Toto’s comments was a bad misjudgement imo. Maybe Toto was so pissed he was having a little sulk and looking for an excuse as to why they are being outperformed dramatically now.

The point being you don't want your competitor getting any faster or putting even more into their car. That is what Toto would be thinking IMHO, he'd want Red Bull feeling they had enough advantage to also be thinking more about 2022 development, than putting too much more into this car. If Toto comes out and says 'we're putting everything into upgrades for this car' the only message RB hear is they need to do more. Toto wants RB resting on their laurels, not spooked by announcements of upgrades.

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

Suspect the muddled messaging from Mercedes is coming from a scenario like this:

1. Mercedes plan out a series of development updates for the 2021 car.

2. Mercedes have completed the development work, but some of those parts have not yet been rolled out (eg they are earmarked for specific circuits, or had long lead times to get onto the car.

3. Toto declares that they won't be doing any further development on the 2021 car - which could be true.

4. Whoever it was declares that they still have upgrades to go onto the car - also true, as they have parts already developed that aren't on the car yet.

Statements 3 and 4 are not mutually exclusive, *but* they do create confusion around exactly what is going on at Mercedes purely because they way they've made the statements they are easily interpreted as being contradictory and/or a change of planning.

Agree, in purely racing competitive terms Toto has nothing to gain by announcing to his opposition that they're putting loads into upgrades and development. Much more to gain by them thinking they have an advantage that is likely to remain intact.

 

[Icy Gull]

2 clicks of boost and polish a few bolt heads

5 minute job.

LH should be 'win' competitive @ Sillystone and Spa.

Don’t both those tracks absolutely require a race winning top speed?

 

[zefarelly]

Don’t both those tracks absolutely require a race winning top speed?

snip a bit off your tea tray, job done.

 

[Icy Gull]

Agree, in purely racing competitive terms Toto has nothing to gain by announcing to his opposition that they're putting loads into upgrades and development. Much more to gain by them thinking they have an advantage that is likely to remain intact.

You really think that RB development is in any way influenced by what Mercedes say in a post match interview? Really?

 

[Icy Gull]

snip a bit off your tea tray, job done.

Be interesting to see if that’s what they do. Red Bull will then gain in the corners, because they are already as quick?

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

You really think that RB development is in any way influenced by what Mercedes say in a post match interview? Really?

Yeah, Horner, Toto, they're massively wound up by each other, always saying stuff to get under each other's skin, take the new rule on pit stops, Horner in a massive strop about it. All adds to the incubated pressure they start to feel, decisions they make and vice versa. When things are going well early pit stop calls etc. are easy, under pressure you get them wrong as Mercedes did. It won't be one thing that get's up Horner's nose and might provoke a wrong move somewhere, it will be many. Do you really think Toto just announces the absolute plans that Mercedes have to the media post race? Really?

 

[Icy Gull]

Yeah, Horner, Toto, they're massively wound up by each other, always saying stuff to get under each other's skin, take the new rule on pit stops, Horner in a massive strop about it. All adds to the incubated pressure they start to feel, decisions they make and vice versa. When things are going well early pit stop calls etc. are easy, under pressure you get them wrong as Mercedes did. It won't be one thing that get's up Horner's nose and might provoke a wrong move somewhere, it will be many. Do you really think Toto just announces the absolute plans that Mercedes have to the media post race? Really?

I initially read that as you calling me Homer

 

[zefarelly]

Be interesting to see if that’s what they do. Red Bull will then gain in the corners, because they are already as quick?

TBH I haven't watched much this season. Typically less aero for the circuits whith big straights, Kemmel and blanchemont are, but you can't get through Blanchemant, or Eu Rouge Flat without something . . . . Have tried in the Cortina and ran out of road.

 

[Hugo Rune]

Lewis now signed to Mercedes until the end of 2023. Time to give the boot to our fun guy with his pit-lane contacts as Hamilton was meant to have been dumped last season!

 

[Icy Gull]

Lewis now signed to Mercedes until the end of 2023. Time to give the boot to our fun guy with his pit-lane contacts as Hamilton was meant to have been dumped last season!

Good news that Hamilton has committed for a few more years

Sadly Lewis is nearly 7/10ths behind Max in final practice. Gonna be yet another damage limitation race

When will Mercedes pull their fingers out? Still not convinced that they are not writing this season off now Red Bull have left them in their dust.

What initially looked like a really close season at the front is looking less likely. Kudos to Red Bull, Max and that smug git Horner….so far

 

[Garry Nelson's Left Foot]

What a lap by Norris!

And Russell getting 9th.

Who remembers when Mercedes were good?

 

[Icy Gull]

That was a stunning lap by Norris. The fact that he is making Ricciardo look shit is also pretty impressive.

Mercs have gone backwards so quickly, maybe the Merc dominance is actually over. All these things come in cycles, remember how long ago it was when RB were as dominant. Good for the sport if not for us Hamilton fans

 

[Icy Gull]

Some seriously impressive pre race track entertainment. The helicopter doing a loop de loop looked VERY dodgy to me!!

 

[Nitram]

That’s how a national anthem should be! Hope the race is up to that standard.