[Misc] F1 2021

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Richly deserved.

When you think of some of the charlatans, perverts and criminals who have been knighted, Lewis should have had his honour sooner.

Well done Lewis. A shining example for our country

 

[Creaky]

Without getting too involved with the tax thing, sports stars pay 'local tax' on any winnings. I'm not sure what the tax rates are in the Middle East, but Sir LH would have paid tax in Abu Dhabi, therefor not having to pay tax in his country of residence. But of course, Sir LH is employed by Mercedes so the question now would be, where is their country of residence? All of this would bring us back to how many days a year is Sir LH in the UK for. His work schedule means very little time I would guess.

The only reason that the question of tax came up on this thread was because of claims that because various shareholders in McLaren and Williams aren’t British they aren’t really British companies, despite being registered in the UK and paying tax here.

I simply feel that it makes far more sense, on a nationalistic basis, to support a British team based in the UK than an individual driver who works for a German team and doesn’t even reside in the UK.

 

[pasty]

The only reason that the question of tax came up on this thread was because of claims that because various shareholders in McLaren and Williams aren’t British they aren’t really British companies, despite being registered in the UK and paying tax here.

I simply feel that it makes far more sense, on a nationalistic basis, to support a British team based in the UK than an individual driver who works for a German team and doesn’t even reside in the UK.

F1 is a bit odd in that respect. I have no affiliation to any of the constructors teams, I just want the British driver to win. If LH drove for Ferrari, Red Bull, Aston Martin or whoever, I'd still support him.

 

[Audax]

I support the driver not the team so I have been a Williams fan, a Ferrari fan, a Mercedes fan, a Mclaren fan, a Brawn fan and an Alfa Romeo fan among others but never Red Bull, although I did waiver when Ricciardo was there prior to Max.

I am getting my Norris paraphernalia together for when Lewis retires

Same here, in general: I directly support drivers, and indirectly support the teams they drive for. As an Aussie by birth, that's meant backing Webber and Ricciardo primarily for many years now. There was an uncomfortable few years there following Red Bull as a result (from which I still have a brolly and Webber cap thanks to a very wet Spa weekend). Initially, I was happy to do that as they carried on the legacy of Stewart and Jaguar, but increasingly less happily as it became clear the team wasn't one that would support both drivers equally. Mateschitz and Newey I have a lot of respect for, Horner and Marko not so much.

One thing I will say: I love an underdog who does well. So I've generally always had a second (sometimes third) driver/team that I follow closely. In recent years it's been Russell/Williams and this season Schumacher/Haas. In the past I kept an eye on Minardi a lot. Hopefully in 2023 I'll have both Ricciardo/McLaren (title push?) and Piastri/Alpine to keep an eye on. Depending on how Doohan holds up in F2, could also have a 2023/24 Doohan/Alpha Tauri combo to keep an eye on as well (having followed his dad's entire 500cc / MotoGP career, Jack's progress is definitely of interest - if he's got even 80% of his dad's dedication to succeeding he'll be one to watch).

 

[Hugo Rune]

Richly deserved.

When you think of some of the charlatans, perverts and criminals who have been knighted, Lewis should have had his honour sooner.

Well done Lewis. A shining example for our country

I’ve got it good authority that he became a Knight without donating money to the Conservative party, that makes it even more of an achievement!

“….The report also said that in the past 11 years, 22 of the [Conservative] party’s main financial donors have been given peerages after donating a combined £54m.”

 

[Creaky]

I’ve got it good authority that he became a Knight without donating money to the Conservative party, that makes it even more of an achievement!

“….The report also said that in the past 11 years, 22 of the [Conservative] party’s main financial donors have been given peerages after donating a combined £54m.”

Who says the Queen does nothing for the country

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

I’ve got it good authority that he became a Knight without donating money to the Conservative party, that makes it even more of an achievement!

“….The report also said that in the past 11 years, 22 of the [Conservative] party’s main financial donors have been given peerages after donating a combined £54m.”

Wow. I had no idea that was even possible. So what you're saying is he got it through outstanding achievement in his chosen field?

 

[Icy Gull]

The only reason that the question of tax came up on this thread was because of claims that because various shareholders in McLaren and Williams aren’t British they aren’t really British companies, despite being registered in the UK and paying tax here.

I simply feel that it makes far more sense, on a nationalistic basis, to support a British team based in the UK than an individual driver who works for a German team and doesn’t even reside in the UK.

Your choice but I support who I support because I do. I have supported Alonso, pre Hamilton, and it hasn’t crossed my mind that I shouldn’t because he is Spanish. I also support Alpine because I love their road cars

Luckily I don’t only support British sports people as I’d have to bin the Albion and support a non League team having checked the nationality of all their players. I’ll take a rain check on that thanks

 

[Icy Gull]

Same here, in general: I directly support drivers, and indirectly support the teams they drive for. As an Aussie by birth, that's meant backing Webber and Ricciardo primarily for many years now. There was an uncomfortable few years there following Red Bull as a result (from which I still have a brolly and Webber cap thanks to a very wet Spa weekend). Initially, I was happy to do that as they carried on the legacy of Stewart and Jaguar, but increasingly less happily as it became clear the team wasn't one that would support both drivers equally. Mateschitz and Newey I have a lot of respect for, Horner and Marko not so much.

One thing I will say: I love an underdog who does well. So I've generally always had a second (sometimes third) driver/team that I follow closely. In recent years it's been Russell/Williams and this season Schumacher/Haas. In the past I kept an eye on Minardi a lot. Hopefully in 2023 I'll have both Ricciardo/McLaren (title push?) and Piastri/Alpine to keep an eye on. Depending on how Doohan holds up in F2, could also have a 2023/24 Doohan/Alpha Tauri combo to keep an eye on as well (having followed his dad's entire 500cc / MotoGP career, Jack's progress is definitely of interest - if he's got even 80% of his dad's dedication to succeeding he'll be one to watch).

How disappointing, no mention of Alan Jones and Sir Jack Brabham

 

[Audax]

How disappointing, no mention of Alan Jones and Sir Jack Brabham

I'm too young - I was 3 when Jones won the title. My earliest childhood Formula 1 memories are of Senna in a JPS Lotus, so that's be 1985.

My other very early motor racing memories are of Alan Moffat running his RX-7 at Bathurst.

 

[GREASED WEASEL]

I'm too young - I was 3 when Jones won the title. My earliest childhood Formula 1 memories are of Senna in a JPS Lotus, so that's be 1985.

My other very early motor racing memories are of Alan Moffat running his RX-7 at Bathurst.

Indeed

Senna's win in Portugal was unforgettable

Even eclipsing his drive at Donnington some years later

 

[Creaky]

Your choice but I support who I support because I do. I have supported Alonso, pre Hamilton, and it hasn’t crossed my mind that I shouldn’t because he is Spanish. I also support Alpine because I love their road cars

Luckily I don’t only support British sports people as I’d have to bin the Albion and support a non League team having checked the nationality of all their players. I’ll take a rain check on that thanks

I tend to agree with you but other posters on this thread have been vociferous in their support of LH, using his nationality as one of, if not the only, reason to support him.

Must say though that I never warmed to Alonso following some of his tactics when Hamilton’s teammate.

Have always enjoyed Ricciardo’s style of racing including his late braking in order to overtake - funny how when he has forced other drivers wide using this tactic that he has not been criticised in the same way, nor ulterior motives implied, that MV has.

 

[Audax]

Have always enjoyed Ricciardo’s style of racing including his late braking in order to overtake - funny how when he has forced other drivers wide using this tactic that he has not been criticised in the same way, nor ulterior motives implied, that MV has.

Key difference here, I think, is that with Ricciardo you know he'll own up if he stuffs up the attempt. He either gets it done fairly and we all shake our heads in amazement, or he stuffs it up and admits it later. Whereas Verstappen will always claim what he did was fair, and the other guy's fault if it goes wrong.

 

[JJ McClure]

Absolute whitewash of a statement from the FIA yesterday.
Apparently it's the teams, drivers and fans that have misunderstood what happened on Sunday and the FIA will work very hard to investigate themselves and come up with an answer to help us understand why we are wrong and not them.

On Sunday, another FIA F1 World Championship season of competitive excellence has concluded, and the credit goes to the participating drivers and teams. The FIA congratulates all of them for their performances in this year. It was a hard fight, and the best competition was displayed at each Grand Prix.

The world watched every race with great anticipation, knowing that in the end, there could only be one winner. In this respect, many praised Max Verstappen for his victory, and Lewis Hamilton for his remarkable performance and sportsmanship after the closing event of the season.

The 2021 FIA Formula 1 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix, has prompted a large number of reactions from the F1 community and from motor sport in general, as well as in the public.

The FIA’s primary responsibility at any event is to ensure the safety of everyone involved and the integrity of the sport.

The circumstances surrounding the use of the Safety Car following the incident of driver Nicholas Latifi, and the related communications between the FIA Race Direction team and the Formula 1 teams, have notably generated significant misunderstanding and reactions from Formula 1 teams, drivers and fans, an argument that is currently tarnishing the image of the Championship and the due celebration of the first Drivers' World Championship title won by Max Verstappen and the eighth consecutive Constructors' World Championship title won by Mercedes.

Following the presentation of a report regarding the sequence of events that took place following the incident on Lap 53 of the Grand Prix and in a constant drive for improvement, the FIA President proposed to the World Motor Sport Council that a detailed analysis and clarification exercise for the future with all relevant parties will now take place.

This matter will be discussed and addressed with all the teams and drivers to draw any lessons from this situation and clarity to be provided to the participants, media, and fans about the current regulations to preserve the competitive nature of our sport while ensuring the safety of the drivers and officials. It is not only Formula 1 that may benefit from this analysis, but also more generally all the other FIA circuit championships.

Following that presentation and an extensive discussion, the World Council has decided to unanimously support the President’s proposal.

The FIA will therefore do its utmost to have this in motion within the Formula 1 governance and will propose to the Formula 1 Commission to give a clear mandate for study and proposal to the Sporting Advisory Committee, with the support of Formula 1 drivers, so that any identified meaningful feedback and conclusions be made before the beginning of the 2022 season.

 

[Audax]

Absolute whitewash of a statement from the FIA yesterday.
Apparently it's the teams, drivers and fans that have misunderstood what happened on Sunday and the FIA will work very hard to investigate themselves and come up with an answer to help us understand why we are wrong and not them.

I think that's a very bad misunderstanding of the FIAs intentions here. You've cherry picked a couple of sentences to highlight, but in doing so you've removed the context of the surrounding sentences. In particular, "[...]the related communications between the FIA Race Direction team and the Formula 1 teams[...]" is a key sentence here, especially the part where it refers to Masi (and his team) - this, for me, is a clear indication that they will be looking at the whole picture and not just attempting to sweep things under the carpet.

My reading of what they've said is that they recognise that the events that happened have created the misunderstanding, and that they need to make sure that the rules and procedures that they start the 2022 season with are both clear and fully understood by all. I fully expect to see rulebook revisions come out of this exercise, and I also suspect that we may see Masi stand down as Race Director (not least because many of his broadcast messages exhibit grammatical errors that point to a lack of composure at key moments where clear decision making and communication is essential).

A key element from the FIA statement that guides me in this direction is how they've clearly indicated that they believe what they learn from this exercise will be relevant and applicable across all of the FIA administered motorsports. In other words: they want to avoid ever creating this type of controversy again in future.

Let's give them a chance to actually carry out the exercise and produce a report before judging what their intentions are based on a few paragraphs of text that can be interpreted and re-interpreted any number of different ways.

 

[Nitram]

Absolute whitewash of a statement from the FIA yesterday.
Apparently it's the teams, drivers and fans that have misunderstood what happened on Sunday and the FIA will work very hard to investigate themselves and come up with an answer to help us understand why we are wrong and not them.

On Sunday, another FIA F1 World Championship season of competitive excellence has concluded, and the credit goes to the participating drivers and teams. The FIA congratulates all of them for their performances in this year. It was a hard fight, and the best competition was displayed at each Grand Prix.

The world watched every race with great anticipation, knowing that in the end, there could only be one winner. In this respect, many praised Max Verstappen for his victory, and Lewis Hamilton for his remarkable performance and sportsmanship after the closing event of the season.

The 2021 FIA Formula 1 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix, has prompted a large number of reactions from the F1 community and from motor sport in general, as well as in the public.

The FIA’s primary responsibility at any event is to ensure the safety of everyone involved and the integrity of the sport.

The circumstances surrounding the use of the Safety Car following the incident of driver Nicholas Latifi, and the related communications between the FIA Race Direction team and the Formula 1 teams, have notably generated significant misunderstanding and reactions from Formula 1 teams, drivers and fans, an argument that is currently tarnishing the image of the Championship and the due celebration of the first Drivers' World Championship title won by Max Verstappen and the eighth consecutive Constructors' World Championship title won by Mercedes.

Following the presentation of a report regarding the sequence of events that took place following the incident on Lap 53 of the Grand Prix and in a constant drive for improvement, the FIA President proposed to the World Motor Sport Council that a detailed analysis and clarification exercise for the future with all relevant parties will now take place.

This matter will be discussed and addressed with all the teams and drivers to draw any lessons from this situation and clarity to be provided to the participants, media, and fans about the current regulations to preserve the competitive nature of our sport while ensuring the safety of the drivers and officials. It is not only Formula 1 that may benefit from this analysis, but also more generally all the other FIA circuit championships.

Following that presentation and an extensive discussion, the World Council has decided to unanimously support the President’s proposal.

The FIA will therefore do its utmost to have this in motion within the Formula 1 governance and will propose to the Formula 1 Commission to give a clear mandate for study and proposal to the Sporting Advisory Committee, with the support of Formula 1 drivers, so that any identified meaningful feedback and conclusions be made before the beginning of the 2022 season.

That’s the way I read it too - complete whitewash - it’s us and the teams not understanding what was happening - all dressed up in fancy words and they will explain why they are right and we are wrong when they can get round to it.

 

[Hugo Rune]

The circumstances surrounding the use of the Safety Car following the incident of driver Nicholas Latifi, and the related communications between the FIA Race Direction team and the Formula 1 teams, have notably generated significant misunderstanding and reactions from Formula 1 teams, drivers and fans, an argument that is currently tarnishing the image of the Championship and the due celebration of the first Drivers' World Championship title won by Max Verstappen.

FIA President proposed to the World Motor Sport Council that a detailed analysis and clarification exercise.

This matter will be discussed and addressed with all the teams and drivers to draw any lessons……..clarity to be provided to the participants, media, and fans about the current regulations

Yes. I’ve read it the same as you. The bits above say it all. Poor Max can’t celebrate his title properly.

Everyone has ‘misunderstood’.

Unfortunately though, the FIA seem to have a get out which is that the Race Director can do what he likes and make up the rules as he sees fit. Maybe that is the misunderstanding?

If Mercedes don’t appeal this, I’m done with F1. The direction will be clear. Entertainment over sporting integrity.

 

[A1X]

Sorry but I struggle with the idea that you did something properly and everyone misunderstood when almost everyone who works within F1 and has spoken about it (and doesn't have an axe to grind either way) has said they're either unhappy with or confused about what happened. I've heard hardly anyone outside Red Bull who seems to have said "yeah it was great, I can understand entirely".

 

[Hugo Rune]

Sorry but I struggle with the idea that you did something properly and everyone misunderstood when almost everyone who works within F1 and has spoken about it (and doesn't have an axe to grind either way) has said they're either unhappy with or confused about what happened. I've heard hardly anyone outside Red Bull who seems to have said "yeah it was great, I can understand entirely".

It seems they are doing an ‘analysis’ into why there has been so much misunderstanding. They can then clarify or rectify peoples views.

 

[Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo]

Mercedes have withdrawn their appeal and congratulated Max on his world championship. While I don't think they'd have ever got the result over turned I think this is the wrong move and lets the FIA off when there has been a clear inconsistency in how rules were applied this season and the publicity of an appeal would have put more pressure on the FIA to do something about it. I don't hold out much hope of this so called review the FIA have commited too.