Evolution debate.

[BrickTamland]

Catholic view:
You can rape, murder, be a general scum bag your whole life but as ling as you repent you will find a cosy place for you in heaven (especially if you're a Priest or high up in the church)
However
You can be the kindest most selfless and moral person (by any ones account) but live in a place where God has never been heard of (unlikely as they've pillaged their way through most of the world at some point in history) or where you believe in another 'false' God, you would find your self going to hell for not believing? I don't dislike religious people (it's not always their choice, don't underestimate the power of indoctrination from a young age) I do however DESPISE the institution of many religions (especially Catholicism) and there's enough evidence out there to prove they are power hungry, liars preying on peoples mortality in return for power.

 

[Dandyman]

Ken Ham is not the best creationists has to offer there are far better exponents of this belief. Dr John C Whitcombe, Professor John Lennox and many more. This debate will go for on ever because both evolution and creationists are both belief systems and as we all know on NSC beliefs cant be changed that easily.

Evolution is not a belief system, it is a scientific theory. If you want to try and identify flaws in the theory, then go ahead.

 

[Dandyman]

You'll find it is the physicists who contribute most to the philosophical interpretations.

Erwin Schrodinger, Bernard d'Espagnat, David Bohm and Albert Einstein are some good examples of this - none of whom are atheist. Go figure.

"It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it" Albert Einstein 24 March 1954

 

[Dandyman]

I hate it when people start a discourse with the words "as a Christian", because it often means they are going to come out with a stream of self-righteous poppycock.

But..... as a Christian, and in response to your two points, I would say that:
1. I am not sure what will happen to me after my death. The promise of eternal life is certainly not the only, or even the main reason, or perhaps any part of the reason why I am a believer. I am much more interested in the moral, ethical and human(e) side of it, about how you should live your life, about how to treat people etc etc.
2. I don't believe in pre-destination, or that God has got it all mapped out in advance. Like many (most?) others, I believe in free will.

And for what it is worth, going back to the original question, I am not a scientist but I totally accept the arguments for evolution.

PS -and I am not trying to pick a fight.

Interesting. What is your view on Unitarianism ?

 

[Dandyman]

Einstein's views on God were essentially pantheist, even though he was once quoted that he didn't consider himself to be (but on analysis, it's the best description of his theism)

"I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings."

"My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble minds. That deeply emotional conviction of the presence of a superior reasoning power, which is revealed in the incomprehensible universe, forms my idea of God.""

Einstein said that he was not sure that he could describe himself as a pantheistic although he clearly believed in some sort of life force (not necessarily a religious belief). He also had this to say about organised religion:
""I don't like to implant in youth the Church's doctrine of a personal God, because that Church has behaved so inhumanly in the past 2,000 years... Consider the hate the Church manifested against the Jews and then against the Muslims, the Crusades with their crimes, the burning stakes of the inquisition, the tacit consent of Hitler's actions while the Jews and the Poles dug their own graves and were slaughtered. And Hitler is said to have been an altar boy!" (August 1943)"

 

[AmexRuislip]

the evolution of rooney View attachment 51033

 

[Dandyman]

If Einstein had access to the information that we have today, I'm sure he would feel more certain about his intuitions. Most particle & theoretical physicists seem to have pantheist or panentheist views on God and reality.

It would be wise to trust their ideas about God, before an evolutionary biologist like Richard Dawkins, because they understand the nature of reality better than anyone.

Sorry totally disagree. Evolutionary biology is about the origin and development of the species, by definition it is more relevant to any debate about creationism.

 

[beorhthelm]

If Einstein had access to the information that we have today, I'm sure he would feel more certain about his intuitions.

are you talking about the same Einstein who didnt accept the conclusoins an consequences of quatum theory?

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

I love this thread, why do people get so het up about God if he doesn't exist, why bother raising your blood pressure over nothing?

But he does - and he'll get you...... in the end.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Interesting. What is your view on Unitarianism ?

In a nutshell, I'm not one. it is not a question that has ever exercised me greatly.

 

[dangull]

Why is there something and not nothing. Any of the great minds on here got an answer for that question ?

 

[symyjym]

In a nutshell, I'm not one. it is not a question that has ever exercised me greatly.

Serious question; How does one decide on which one of the many Christian religions is the right one, or right one for oneself?

To choose one I presume one would have to study all religious faiths and all branches of them in their own trees of evolution. To really understand and research all beliefs and arguments for and against a on an individual basis can take a lifetime, and there doesn’t seem to be enough hours in the day to dedicate to this mission in the world we live in.

I find it interesting the disputes within all faiths like the Sunni, & Shia Muslims each with their own many branch offs.

I guess what I am saying is that it must be impossible to have total faith in one’s own chosen faith.

 

[symyjym]

Why is there something and not nothing. Any of the great minds on here got an answer for that question ?

It would be impossible for nothing to exist.

 

[dangull]

Serious question; How does one decide on which one of the many Christian religions is the right one, or right one for oneself?

To choose one I presume one would have to study all religious faiths and all branches of them in their own trees of evolution. To really understand and research all beliefs and arguments for and against a on an individual basis can take a lifetime, and there doesn’t seem to be enough hours in the day to dedicate to this mission in the world we live in.

I find it interesting the disputes within all faiths like the Sunni, & Shia Muslims each with their own many branch offs. I doubt a God would say' sorry your a catholic, i'm actually a chuch of England God, so your damned' Christianity, Islam, Jews all believe in the same God, but have different ways to worship him/her, not sure about Budhists, they have reincarnation, but in the end will be united with the same God ? Those are the 4 main world religions, though they have different off shoots, i doubt that would be important too a God. All infighting within the religions, would be a man made problem rather than be caused by a God.

 

[dangull]

Serious question; How does one decide on which one of the many Christian religions is the right one, or right one for oneself?

To choose one I presume one would have to study all religious faiths and all branches of them in their own trees of evolution. To really understand and research all beliefs and arguments for and against a on an individual basis can take a lifetime, and there doesn’t seem to be enough hours in the day to dedicate to this mission in the world we live in.

I find it interesting the disputes within all faiths like the Sunni, & Shia Muslims each with their own many branch offs. I doubt a God would say' sorry your a catholic, i'm actually a chuch of England God, so your damned' Christianity, Islam, Jews all believe in the same God, but have different ways to worship him/her, not sure about Budhists, they have reincarnation, but in the end will be united with the same God ? Those are the 4 main world religions, though they have different off shoots, i doubt that would be important too a God. All infighting within the religions, would be a man made problem rather than be caused by a God.

Sorry, my quote started with ' I doubt'

 

[Fungus]

If Einstein had access to the information that we have today, I'm sure he would feel more certain about his intuitions. Most particle & theoretical physicists seem to have pantheist or panentheist views on God and reality.

It would be wise to trust their ideas about God, before an evolutionary biologist like Richard Dawkins, because they understand the nature of reality better than anyone.

You seem very keen to use other people (especially physicists) to justify your views, but I can't imagine ever believing in a god unless I had a personal experience.

 

[turienzo's lovechild]

Serious question; How does one decide on which one of the many Christian religions is the right one, or right one for oneself?

To choose one I presume one would have to study all religious faiths and all branches of them in their own trees of evolution. To really understand and research all beliefs and arguments for and against a on an individual basis can take a lifetime, and there doesn’t seem to be enough hours in the day to dedicate to this mission in the world we live in.

I find it interesting the disputes within all faiths like the Sunni, & Shia Muslims each with their own many branch offs.

I guess what I am saying is that it must be impossible to have total faith in one’s own chosen faith.

Simply put I believe Christianity in this country is moving away from this- mainly as its complete nonsense. I go to a CofE church but I'm certainly not "anglican"- I'm a Christian and dont distinguish myself from any other Christian. I chose my Church due to its location and I stayed there because I was impressed with the work they did...nothing to do woth their demonination as I believe denominations are irrelavent...and I believe Jesus would have also.

 

[pastafarian]

Why is there something and not nothing.

because "nothing" is unstable

according to Quantum Mechanics

 

[Triggaaar]

If you live your life believing there maybe an after life, then you may feel hope and content whatever problems you have in life, and if your wrong it won't matter. However, if you are an atheist and when you die, you turn out to be wrong, then that could be problem if that happens.

Why would it be a problem? If there is an all powerful god, and there is an afterlife, I can't imagine he'll be pathetic enough to turn you away for not believing what some weirdo told you to. If however, the all powerful god is a ****, then he's going to be less bothered about the atheists, than those that devoted their life to worshiping the wrong deity.

Best to play it safe and not believe in any of the hundreds of gods.

 

[Triggaaar]

I have had neither the time nor energy to read all through this thread but OUR LORD has and he's going to be might fcked off with a lot of you atheist shithouses

He can go to hell.