[Football] Euros 2024 - Matchday 12 (Netherlands vs Austria, France vs Poland, England vs Slovenia & Denmark vs Serbia)

[fruitnveg]

Are you mental? Rice has been outstanding screening the defence and does have the legs to get forward, is useful at set pieces in both boxes, etc.

He's been abject; milling around not showing for passes, fluffing whatever possession he finds himself in, camped between the CBs despite their protests. Its telling that when he does show for passes, his teamates would rather go elsewhere. He offers next to nothing and he knows it. Look at his face when he's playing, he is embarassed. It may be Southgate's fault (Lets be honest, it probably is), but he is the one putting on the performance and so far looks nothing like the £100mil player Arsenal supposedly bought. Southgate has managed to find a fraud that looks just like him.

 

[Cordwainer]

The problem is that football changes over time and the same system will only work for so long or else we would still be playing 2-3-5

Of course. But if there was some semblance of a plan throughout the year groups with joined up coaching on consistent styles of play, surely that has a better chance of long term success, rather than lurching from one managerial style to the polar opposite as the FA has done in the past. I thought they’d looked at what France and Spain particularly have done and have attempted to mimic their international set ups? Perhaps they have and we’ve yet to witness the fruits of their labour.

 

[Midget]

He's been abject; milling around not showing for passes, fluffing whatever possession he finds himself in, camped between the CBs despite their protests. Its telling that when he does show for passes, his teamates would rather go elsewhere. He offers next to nothing and he knows it. Look at his face when he's playing, he is embarassed. It may be Southgate's fault (Lets be honest, it probably is), but he is the one putting on the performance and so far looks nothing like the £100mil player Arsenal supposedly bought. Southgate has managed to find a fraud that looks just like him.

This. Just sitting on the CBs all game so nothing moves quickly enough. He's too close for a decent out ball from the defenders and when he has the ball he's too deep to do anything decent with it. He doesn't need to be part of the fannying about at the back, he needs to be in the space that makes. Right now he's just in the way.

 

[JBizzle]

Are you mental? Rice has been outstanding screening the defence and does have the legs to get forward, is useful at set pieces in both boxes, etc.

"Outstanding"? Come on. He's been "fine" in a midfield that has no shape or focus. He's at the base of a midfield that has rotated players around him constantly whilst at the same time being both totally empty and overcrowded.

Rice certainly isn't the problem, neither is the defence IMO. It's the fact that we gave a misfiring front 4 that all look totally shot to pieces and have not cohesion, energy or legs. How much better did we look with Palmer and Gordon on (yes, for those 5 minutes)? How much better did Watkins look than Kane?

 

[Nobby]

Amazing that people on here are still blaming the players!
FFS, have you actually watched the games.
No one, not one of those players has a clue what they're supposed to be doing!

When have we EVER seen any of of the players on the pitch play as badly for their clubs!

The manager is tactically inept, motivationally inept, with no clue how to change anything.
And if he ever does try and change anything, it's just the personnel. So that's just adding another couple of players who aren't sure what they're supposed to be doing to the others.

Just one example,
He has taken Gallacher to the Tournament, and leaves him out of the first two games. (Fair enough)
Then starts him for 45 mins, then hooks him.
So one of our squad players is out for the rest of the Tournament, because why and how can you play him again?

That's just one example.

Southgate is a loser, will never be able to get anything from these (normally) brilliant players, and it will only get worse.

Once again, he's lucked out with the Group where all of the best teams are in the other half. But it won't make a blind bit of difference and we all know it!

And Relax.......

 

[Wozza]

Pundit Christoph Kramer on ZDF:

'What bothers me about Southgate, if I compare him to Julian Nagelsmann: Nagelsmann has a plan in his head.

'If it doesn't work, he stands there and tries to change it. You can tell by his facial expressions and his gestures. Southgate can't possibly have a plan in his head!

'Because he lets the game play out as it happens and just sits there. Normally, as a coach, you have a clear idea and if it doesn't work, you freak out. You try to give your players something to take with them.

'He doesn't do that at all. I find that so strange. He just lets this world-class team play. After the first half that we saw from England, we thought: nothing is happening!

'If you do not have good in-game coaching, then you have to at least change something for the next game.

'But he does not change anything! He simply sends the eleven into the race. It does not matter who plays the game.

Nail. On. Head.

 

[Flounce]

Pundit Christoph Kramer on ZDF:

'What bothers me about Southgate, if I compare him to Julian Nagelsmann: Nagelsmann has a plan in his head.

'If it doesn't work, he stands there and tries to change it. You can tell by his facial expressions and his gestures. Southgate can't possibly have a plan in his head!

'Because he lets the game play out as it happens and just sits there. Normally, as a coach, you have a clear idea and if it doesn't work, you freak out. You try to give your players something to take with them.

'He doesn't do that at all. I find that so strange. He just lets this world-class team play. After the first half that we saw from England, we thought: nothing is happening!

'If you do not have good in-game coaching, then you have to at least change something for the next game.

'But he does not change anything! He simply sends the eleven into the race. It does not matter who plays the game.

Nail. On. Head.

Some of us have been saying this since the last Euros, the guy has one plan and one plan only, if it’s not working make some late substitutions and concentrate on not conceding

It pisses me off when people then suggest he plays Potterball which actually worked very well with the right players, Southgate does have the right players but not a clue how to change things in game

 

[jackanada]

I think the problems start at the back rather than misfiring forwards. (Ok the problems start with Gareth but anyway)
Pickford is incapable of joining the passing chain at the back and even if you accept him just sitting behind them he doesn't have a short passing game, particularly not when under any pressure whatsoever.
Stones while we haven't seen it clearly can pass, Geuhi who apparently is our best player I've not seen anything from either.
Trippier is clearly poor. Walker I am confident will play much better with CBs who can pass.
Rice just takes up the space where a CB should be for the vast majority of the game.
If you looked at footballing titans Slovenia last night when they had possession there was seldom more than two outfield players behind the ball. England usually had 4 and sometimes 5.
So start with Pickford out for Ramsdale, Bring Dunk in and let Stones be Calvin Phillips to keep waistcoat happy.
Rice or Bellingham can then be the 8 and given we have no LB that's walker and TAA can be RB.
Of course there are multiple other solutions if you're prepared to change formation but as Gareth only ever swaps players round this is as much as could ever be hoped for.

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

This. Just sitting on the CBs all game so nothing moves quickly enough. He's too close for a decent out ball from the defenders and when he has the ball he's too deep to do anything decent with it. He doesn't need to be part of the fannying about at the back, he needs to be in the space that makes. Right now he's just in the way.

But if you look at a Southgate team that’s what he wants. A DM sat in front of the CB.
Clearly Southgate hasn’t come across CB who can pass.

 

[Midget]

But if you look at a Southgate team that’s what he wants. A DM sat in front of the CB.
Clearly Southgate hasn’t come across CB who can pass.

Agreed. I'm not saying it's Rice himself, it's how/where he's been told to play. He's probably not enjoying it!

 

[Napper]

Kane scores the first chance and palmer the last and that performance gets a lot of praise for its control

Fine margins

Improvement is seen . Think will be fine next game

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

Agreed. I'm not saying it's Rice himself, it's how/where he's been told to play. He's probably not enjoying it!

He certainly doesn’t look like he’s enjoying it.
Southgate style is some 15 years old and he hasn’t realised the football world has moved on.
My frustration is that I like the bloke. If he was an arse I’d take delight in giving him stick but he’s not and I feel bad for doing it.
It’s like a work colleague I once had. Lovely bloke but a disaster when it came to work.

 

[Dorset Seagull]

Of course. But if there was some semblance of a plan throughout the year groups with joined up coaching on consistent styles of play, surely that has a better chance of long term success, rather than lurching from one managerial style to the polar opposite as the FA has done in the past. I thought they’d looked at what France and Spain particularly have done and have attempted to mimic their international set ups? Perhaps they have and we’ve yet to witness the fruits of their labour.

Yes but you can still have a consistent style but it doesn’t have to be utilised with the same formation. A style is just a way of playing eg. Attacking high pressing, counter attacking, defensive solidity etc etc. You can then virtually use most formations to create a system around that. Southgate only has 1 formation which isnt really what the FA were trying to achieve.

 

[Bry Nylon]

BREAKING: Foden has temporarily left the England camp and returned to the UK for a "pressing family matter."

 

[HisBetterBall]

The reason why Southgate isn't doing so well because he doesn't have his kalvin phillips

 

[HisBetterBall]

In this own words

 

[Bry Nylon]

BREAKING: Foden has temporarily left the England camp and returned to the UK for a "pressing family matter."

Update: apparently it is so he be present at the birth of his third child. Good chap

 

[herecomesaregular]

edit - best deleted

 

[dwayne]

This is what it sounds like every GS tournament.

And the team is playing like it. "We'll get good... later... for now, just get the points". But what this England team is showing is TOO far away from being able to compete.

If it was tactics it could perhaps be fixed but they're all frozen with fear. You hear in the interviews, all talk about problems and nothing really about solutions. You can see it on the body language. Won a very easy £100 on Phil Fodens yellow card yesterday, because he utterly hates playing in this team and the dumb role he's supposed to have in it.

Its not going to get less tense and neither Southgate nor many of the leading players know how to deal with the negative thoughts and feelings.

This is definitely worse. A lot worse. We did go through a period where we were unbeatable under Southgate we were winning 5/6/7 nil. Think it was the euro qualifiers for 2020.

Last euros we beat Germany 2-0 we beat Ukraine 4-0.

Last WC we beat Iran 6-2. Wales 3-0 and Senegal 3-0 (2 games in a bloody row)

These results seem impossible now.

 

[The Antikythera Mechanism]