Eric Garner's death in New York City.

[User removed 4]

The cause of all this - violent policing and weapons. We havent heard of stories like this in the UK, because (regardless of what some say) - we have got it right with the way we police, ignoring the budget issues that is.

Society in the US needs to change full stop starting with the gun culture. Then they can start sorting out the social divide which does exist, although not as much as some are making out. It would be interesting to know if any white people are shot by black officers though - as for some reason you never hear about things like that.

Or to sum up in simpler terms - this is the difference between the UK and the US -

US Police -

UK Police -

Really ??

 

[daveinprague]

Get on the ground now...pretty redundant after you have shot him 11 times.

 

[Stat Brother]

How many incidents are there a day?bloody loads
These cops are up against it big time and all they get is grief and to be called racists...Yes the USA has big issues and has some very dangerous people flocking into the country via places like Mexico and the Caribbean etc.Its never goner change and with so many nutters on the streets it's inevitable people will get killed and coppers too.

As the chap above said its about stopping the gun culture first and that i don't see happening in the near future sadly.Just don't see why cops are blamed for most things as when cops are killed it's hardly mentioned.

Only time you here about shootings in America is when you get a crazed student opening fire on campus or a Blackman gets shot.

The government or state governments need to sort this out and fast

How many of people who killed police officers, and then subsequently named as the assailant, didn't have to face trial for their actions?

 

[daveinprague]

Shot FIFTEEN times in his own drive.

Amazingly, another unarmed man attacking armed police in his OWN drive.
Police investigating if 'any laws have been broken'.

 

[sir albion]

How many of people who killed police officers, and then subsequently named as the assailant, didn't have to face trial for their actions?

You tell me how many and you tell me if the USA would be a better place without the coppers who have to endure these idiotic gangster's day in and day out.Its in their culture to have guns and to kill people and these are the scum of the earth who need to be stopped.

When you get these dangerous ********s day in day out its no surprise what happens

 

[daveinprague]

You tell me how many and you tell me if the USA would be a better place without the coppers who have to endure these idiotic gangster's day in and day out.Its in their culture to have guns and to kill people and these are the scum of the earth who need to be stopped.

When you get these dangerous ********s day in day out its no surprise what happens

No, youre right. Its no surprise. Ive seen videos of unarmed men with their hands up, shot multiple times by 'professionals' ...
Its the victims fault due to their skin colour. When willl they learn not to look for cigarettes in their own car, in their own drive, when the police are around?

 

[daveinprague]

Better trained police...he was only shot 10 times

 

[daveinprague]

Fair enough, he did just buy a gun in Walmart.

 

[daveinprague]

There are good cops. Sadly, trumped by the many ****ers who kill unarmed citizens

 

[Stat Brother]

You tell me how many and you tell me if the USA would be a better place without the coppers who have to endure these idiotic gangster's day in and day out.Its in their culture to have guns and to kill people and these are the scum of the earth who need to be stopped.

When you get these dangerous ********s day in day out its no surprise what happens

So because the police occasionally have to deal with heavily armed "idiotic gangsters" it's ok to shoot (or use illegal strangle holds) unarmed people and not face any legal proceedings for that death.

You believe the police are above the law.

I'm sorry but you're not making any sense, for that reason I'm out.

 

[daveinprague]

Really ??

Excellent. Respect to the boy. Thats community policing, and not being a ****.

 

[Seagull over Canaryland]

There are good cops. Sadly, trumped by the many ****ers who kill unarmed citizens

Reminds of me of some simple but effective PR by the Police motorcycle escorts accompanying the Tour de France this year. The enthusiastic crowds were at risk of encroaching into the path of the support vehicles and cyclists, mostly dealt with by stewards in reasonable humour although one or two started to get a bit officious.

One little lad was quietly sitting on a straw bale watching in awe when a fierce looking motorcycle cop wearing wrap around glasses pulled up right alongside him and paused. There was a brief collective 'oh, no' from the crowd - before the cop reached out for a 'high five'. The little lad looked startled, but suddenly 'got it', high fives were exchanged and the cop roared off to a huge cheer from the crowd. A few minutes latter two Gendarme motorcyclists stopped alongside a little girl wearing an inflatable sumo outfit (!)....and posed for selfies with her, before roaring away. Again, huge roars of appreciation.

All very simple but effective spontaneous PR but when multiplied along the whole route of the TdF would encourage a different perception of the Police. Hearts and minds etc etc. To be fair everyone was happy that day so not exactly a potential flashpoint - but would have been so easy not to bother.

 

[pastafarian]

When you consider there are over 900,000 police officers in the US and the ridiculous level of gun crime in that country i'm somewhat surprised that more people are not killed by the police every day, its also worth pointing out that already this year 114 police officers have been killed this year in the line of duty, can you imagine those stats in this country?

given there were over 11 million arrests made last year in US and the gun culture, it is surprising there are not many more people shot by the Police

 

[daveinprague]

How many of them 'really' had guns when they were shot multiple times. The police have an extremely difficult time in the US, but many of the problems are of their own making. Who is going to trust the police when they see people with their hands up being gunned down, over and over again.

 

[The Fifth Column]

How many of them 'really' had guns when they were shot multiple times. The police have an extremely difficult time in the US, but many of the problems are of their own making. Who is going to trust the police when they see people with their hands up being gunned down, over and over again.

Youve made your point with all those video clips but your argument is biased and one sided. I could do what you've just done and cherry pick some clips from youtube of police officers being shot at and gunned down and counter that is it any wonder that so many civilians are being shot when they are routinely armed with powerful weapons and killing police officers every week? Its not the american police who are the problem as you claim its their entire gun toting culture. When officers turn up at incidents not knowing if they will be confronted by someone wielding a gun they will be highly on edge, no doubt nervous and prone to make mistakes, particularly if they are alone. If the US tightened up its gun laws and ownership then less innocent civilians would be shot, fact.

 

[sydney]

Anything about the prick business?

ok ...i'm sorry for the use of the word prick in reaction to your contradictory reply to my post...!

 

[daveinprague]

My argument included police playing basketball with local kids. Sorry, but I would expect the professional officers to be trained, and not to be shooting people when they have they hands up for the crime of getting a drivers license as requested.

 

[Kaiser_Soze]

Seemingly if you are morbidly obese it seems best to avoid any kind of conflict with anyone let alone the police who if the circumstances present themselves may need to get hands on which will inevitably raise your heart rate. The case above really is tragic I'm sure those officers didn't go in there thinking 'yay lets go and duff up the fat downs kid' and the poor lad wouldn't have had a clue what was going on, no winners in this one.

You would appear to benefit from some research into positional asphyxia. Essentially this is where someone that is restrained cannot breathe, normally because they are face down and their lungs can't function to full capacity. Obviously this effect is exacerbated in larger people but there has been cases where more averagely built people have died.

In the UK, police officers are trained to sit or stand someone up once they are handcuffed. This enables them to breathe properly. In the US it would appear that they have a different procedure. It seems fairly common to leave apprehended suspects laying face down.

 

[Hastings gull]

Some sources cite that as high as 3 people are killed by US police every day on average. Others suggest it's closer to one a day. Whatever the reality, it's disgraceful and unacceptable.

...and that's ignoring the fact that 2.6million people are incarcerated in the USA - 25% of the entire worlds prison population.

Some people really try to defend the indefensible...

Whilst I would not presume to question your graph for its accuracy, it does nonetheless tell only half the story. The USA has a population roughly 5 times the size of the UK, and a traditional gun culture that is alien to us in the UK, so the figures would always be higher. We only ever hear of the controversial killings of black people and do not really know if this is the norm. I suspect that proportionately more black people are indeed killed by the Police but then it could be that black people may proportionately be more responsible for the type of offences following which officers get sent to ,in a much heightened state of anxiety as to their own safety.
This is not to deny that some officers are probably trigger happy, but to tar everyone with the same brush is most unfair. When in a position of extreme danger, you do not always react as rationally as when you are in training, and, of course, you can only make a mistake once if you believe you are being confronted by a gun-totting individual. It is not a question of trying to defend the indefensible, just wanting to get to the truth, as opposed to jumping on such tragic situations to confirm one's pre-conceived notions. I have family members in the Police and they are most upset when they later read in the press about a loving person who would not hurt a fly, having allegedly bad treatment when said person has a long criminal record and violently resisted arrest.
Yes, there will be rogues in the Police, and sadly, there will always be cases of over-reaction, and, equally sadly, there will also be those all too ready to jump on convenient bandwagons. But as in any community, the majority will be decent folk, and the Police will be no different.

 

[Stat Brother]

A lively and somewhat diverse debate on NSC is one thing, but this is different gravy:-

Eric Garner death: 76 arrested at London Westfield demo
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-30424338

Surely a gathering in praise of our police, and the fact that these issues are so rare in the UK, would be better.

Some interesting racial stats here:-
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-30341731