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Enviramental Issues



REDLAND

Active member
Jul 7, 2003
9,443
At the foot of the downs
IRONIC maybe, Greenpeace have just sent me this, more sad news ..

Polar Bears officially listed as a 'threatened' species.

The good news is the polar bear is likely to given extra protection under US law. The bad news is its home is disappearing faster than ever. With 2007 predicted to be the warmest year on record it looks like they'll need all the protection they can get.
In December 2006 the US Fish and Wildlife Service officially listed the polar bear as a 'threatened' species, due to the meltdown of its sea-ice habitat caused by global warming. Unfortunately it took a lawsuit by Greenpeace and the Natural Resource Defense Council (NRDC) to force the US administration to put the polar bear on the list and even now its listing is a proposal so could take another year to be made official.

But the implications of the listing go far beyond just the polar bear. Listing under the Endangered Species Act will provide broad protection to polar bears, including a requirement that US federal agencies ensure that any action carried out, authorised, or funded by the US government will not jeopardise the continued existence of polar bears, or adversely modify their critical habitat.

"The United States has failed to lead the world in tackling global warming. With under five percent of the world's people, we generate more than 20 percent of the global warming pollution," said Kert Davies, Greenpeace research director. "We must start cutting greenhouse gas emissions or the Polar Bear will be pushed to the brink of extinction within our lifetime."

While the policy news for the polar bear was good, news from the Arctic was distinctly bad. What used to be the Ayles Ice Shelf has broken off from Ellesmere Island, Canada. The shelf was the size of Manhattan.

Polar bears live only in the Arctic and are totally dependent on the sea ice. A growing body of evidence shows that the Arctic ice is vanishing much faster than previously expected. The thick multiyear ice has been shrinking eight to 10 percent per decade, with some climate models predicting that the Arctic could be ice-free in summer as early as 2040. In some polar regions, the sea ice season has shortened as much as three weeks, and scientists have discovered that the polar ice caps are melting at an alarming rate - losing an area the size of Colorado - more than a million square miles - in just the last year.

The polar bear and the melting of the Arctic are probably the most charismatic and dramatic indicators of our changing climate. It's going to take a lot more than the Endangered Species Act to save the polar bear and stop dangerous global warming.

While the talk about taking action to tackle global warming increased in 2006, there was still too much talk and too little action from world leaders.

Carbon up, temperature up

Carbon dioxide emissions, the biggest cause of global warming, are now rising at more than 2 percent a year. The longer measures to reduce carbon emissions are postponed the more drastic those measures will need to be.

As surely as carbon emissions are rising so are global temperatures. It has already been predicted by the UK Met Office that 2007 is likely to be one of the warmest years on record. This is partly due to El Nino and also due to increasing carbon emissions.

What's needed in 2007 is action -- from governments, corporations, but from all of us as well -- to cut carbon emissions and slow rising temperatures.

Next time you leave a light burning unnecessarily, think about the polar bears. The next time you buy a product, look at its energy efficiency and think about the polar bears. And next time a politician isn't crystal clear that the planet has a problem that needs fixing, vote with your paw.
 
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Questions

Habitual User
Oct 18, 2006
25,512
Worthing
Re: Re: Enviramental Issues

Ccider said:
This is bollocks. COWS create the most carbon emissions ...

quote

Livestock are responsible for 18 per cent of the greenhouse gases that cause global warming, more than cars, planes and all other forms of transport put together.

Burning fuel to produce fertiliser to grow feed, to produce meat and to transport it - and clearing vegetation for grazing - produces 9 per cent of all emissions of carbon dioxide, the most common greenhouse gas. And their wind and manure emit more than one third of emissions of another, methane, which warms the world 20 times faster than carbon dioxide.

Livestock also produces more than 100 other polluting gases, including more than two-thirds of the world's emissions of ammonia, one of the main causes of acid rain.

unquote

:angry:





right its vegetarianism then.

Meat eaters do have a terrible outlook on things I have always thought anyway.
 
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Dave the OAP

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
46,762
at home
Lammy said:
How are we supposed to convice other nations to clean up their act if we haven't?

that is just horse shit.

We are making huge efforts to save energy, from recycling initiatives, low emission cars, low emission public transport, house insulation, lean burning gas powered power stations, CH&P stations. We have decommissioned coal fired power stations etc etc. Our huge industrial base has been decimated - cars/shipbuilding/steel working/mining in favour of "service "industries which are by defenition lower poluters.

You could always agrue its not enough, but to suggest we are doing nothing is just plain wrong.
 


Ccider

New member
Jul 28, 2004
1,137
50:51:35N 0:08:58W
Re: Re: Re: Enviramental Issues

Questions said:
right its vegetarianism then.

Meat eaters do have a terrible outlook on things I have always thought anyway.

That's right. Eat lettuce and save the planet.

:clap:

PS Don't fart either.
 


Questions

Habitual User
Oct 18, 2006
25,512
Worthing
Re: Re: Re: Re: Enviramental Issues

Ccider said:
That's right. Eat lettuce and save the planet.

:clap:

PS Don't fart either.



Pay tax on your ability to fart, thats my arguement.

Am working on a device to monitor indivual emissions at this very moment.
 






Yorkie

Sussex born and bred
Jul 5, 2003
32,367
dahn sarf
Re: Re: Re: Re: Enviramental Issues

Ccider said:
That's right. Eat lettuce and save the planet.

:clap:

PS Don't fart either.

Turning vegetarian will just replace animal wind with human wind.
 


Ccider

New member
Jul 28, 2004
1,137
50:51:35N 0:08:58W
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Enviramental Issues

Yorkie said:
Turning vegetarian will just replace animal wind with human wind.

That assumes there is no human wind to start with OR that turning veggie will make people fart as much more as the existing animal wind.

Neither of these is likely to be true.
 




Ccider

New member
Jul 28, 2004
1,137
50:51:35N 0:08:58W
Dave the Gaffer said:
that is just horse shit.

We are making huge efforts to save energy, from recycling initiatives, low emission cars, low emission public transport, house insulation, lean burning gas powered power stations, CH&P stations. We have decommissioned coal fired power stations etc etc. Our huge industrial base has been decimated - cars/shipbuilding/steel working/mining in favour of "service "industries which are by defenition lower poluters.

You could always agrue its not enough, but to suggest we are doing nothing is just plain wrong.

This is mis-leading.

Horse shit emits significant quanties of methane (20x worse than CO2).

Recylcing in UK is pathetic when compared to other EU countries; low emmision cars only exist in the UK if foreign manufacturers decide to make them and sell them here; low emmission public transport is virtually non-existant; house insulation in the UK is inferior to Scandinavians; lean burning gas powered power stations emit the same Carbon as non-lean-burning (its the ratio of CO to CO2 that changes); our industrial base has merely been transferred to the far east...

Just stop eating MEAT!
 


Brovion

In my defence, I was left unsupervised.
NSC Patron
Jul 6, 2003
19,871
Dave the Gaffer said:
what is the point in us worrying about carbon offsetting, when India and China are spewing 3x more crap into the atmosphere now than we are.

I think all this environmental stuff is just a great new excuse to tax us more.
I totally agree with you Dave. (Just thought I'd say that as we disagreed a bit earlier on in the week!)

All this "switch off your TV, don't have it on stand-by" is the equivalent of putting sticky tape on the windows when you're expecting a nuclear explosion.
 


Dave the OAP

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
46,762
at home
Brovian said:
I totally agree with you Dave. (Just thought I'd say that as we disagreed a bit earlier on in the week!)

All this "switch off your TV, don't have it on stand-by" is the equivalent of putting sticky tape on the windows when you're expecting a nuclear explosion.



:clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2:


:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:
 




Questions

Habitual User
Oct 18, 2006
25,512
Worthing
Ccider said:
This is mis-leading.

Horse shit emits significant quanties of methane (20x worse than CO2).

Recylcing in UK is pathetic when compared to other EU countries; low emmision cars only exist in the UK if foreign manufacturers decide to make them and sell them here; low emmission public transport is virtually non-existant; house insulation in the UK is inferior to Scandinavians; lean burning gas powered power stations emit the same Carbon as non-lean-burning (its the ratio of CO to CO2 that changes); our industrial base has merely been transferred to the far east...

Just stop eating MEAT!



What about meat substitute ?
 


Questions

Habitual User
Oct 18, 2006
25,512
Worthing
Right.


I am going by train on saturday (better than car )

I will not be having a beefburger ( also because they taste shit)

I will NOT be taking any horse shit to the ground

I will though be drinking lots of beer resulting in excess methane. This is where I need some advice Mr Porrit.
 


ROSM

Well-known member
Dec 26, 2005
6,776
Just far enough away from LDC
Brovian said:
I totally agree with you Dave. (Just thought I'd say that as we disagreed a bit earlier on in the week!)

All this "switch off your TV, don't have it on stand-by" is the equivalent of putting sticky tape on the windows when you're expecting a nuclear explosion.

wasn't it John Bunyan who wrote that a journey of a 1000 miles starts with a single step (obviously he wasn't the first to say it).
 




Questions

Habitual User
Oct 18, 2006
25,512
Worthing
ROSM said:
wasn't it John Bunyan who wrote that a journey of a 1000 miles starts with a single step (obviously he wasn't the first to say it).



It would be hard preaching to the likes of India and China before we have our own house in order in the western world - though the USA might help a little.
 


skr80

New member
Oct 9, 2003
482
Dave the Gaffer said:
what is the point in us worrying about carbon offsetting, when India and China are spewing 3x more crap into the atmosphere now than we are.

I think all this environmental stuff is just a great new excuse to tax us more.

completely agree. we are just a tiny little island in the north sea - this is a cynical tax that won't be put back into 'renewable' green issues. Also USA is pretty bad when it comes to pollution

I would like nice hot weather in the uk - would save on the price of a flight to somewhere warm for holidays (thus reducing these horrible carbon emmisions)
 


ROSM

Well-known member
Dec 26, 2005
6,776
Just far enough away from LDC
Questions said:
It would be hard preaching to the likes of India and China before we have our own house in order in the western world - though the USA might help a little.

I kind of take the view that if we actually did all we could then it is a lot easier to continue our xenophobia by having a go at others who dont.

Like it or lump it, Global warming is the largest crisis facing this planet. Unfortunately you cannot divvy up the ozone layer and apportion it to those who have been good.

I do think though that the tide is turning in the USA and that the Al Gore film The Inconvenient Truth (not sure how many points Unc Spielberg gave it) has certainly had an impact.
 


ROSM said:
wasn't it John Bunyan who wrote that a journey of a 1000 miles starts with a single step (obviously he wasn't the first to say it).

No chance. It's an old taoist/daoist saying originating in the times of Confucious iirc. Possibly it may be even older than that. So something like 2500 years or so.
 




Woodchip

It's all about the bikes
Aug 28, 2004
14,460
Shaky Town, NZ
I'm doing my bit for the environment today, by working from home. No nasty pollution from my trip to work today (only the usual greenhouse cases that my body produces after spicy food - mmmmm).
 


Silent Bob

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Dec 6, 2004
22,172
Dave the Gaffer said:
what is the point in us worrying about carbon offsetting, when India and China are spewing 3x more crap into the atmosphere now than we are.

I think all this environmental stuff is just a great new excuse to tax us more.
More than 3x isn't it? I think we only count for 2% of the worlds carbon emissions. That's not to say we shouldn't change of course, the whole world should.
 


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