[Cricket] England vs India Fifth Test - The Oval

[dazzer6666]

That is a contradiction of your words.. Had Root declared at 300 as many, me included, said we would have lost.

I very much doubt it, but you’ve lost me completely now. I give up.

 

[Badger]

These same people set themselves up as being experts and deride any suggestions from mere spectators like me.

You do EXACTLY the same thing on these threads. Which is completely fine by the way. Just don't try and paint yourself as some "mere" spectator, you offer your opinions in the same way.

It's completely unnecessary to have a dig at them if they get something wrong.

 

[Bold Seagull]

WTF are you going on about ?

Anything over 250 was always going to be nigh-on impossible to chase. It always has been, not just at the Oval but anywhere. Just because they got over 300 doesn’t mean they’d have got them if they were chasing a smaller number. Our declaration was more time-based than runs.

That's not strictly true, 263, 253, 242, 225 have all been successfully chased down at the Oval. Anywhere, 400+ has been achieved 4 times, 300+ 29 times, 250+ 61 times (including the 300 and 400 figures).

It was only last summer the West Indies chased down 322 at Headingly to win, no doubt fresh in Root's mind after his declaration on that occasion in order to try to force a win.

 

[big nuts]

You do EXACTLY the same thing on these threads. Which is completely fine by the way. Just don't try and paint yourself as some "mere" spectator, you offer your opinions in the same way.

It's completely unnecessary to have a dig at them if they get something wrong.

The biggest joke is, he’s not even a spectator he only looks at the scorecard. Hence his acronym gibberish about not having to see pudding to know how it’s made.

 

[dazzer6666]

That's not strictly true, 263, 253, 242, 225 have all been successfully chased down at the Oval. Anywhere, 400+ has been achieved 4 times, 300+ 29 times, 250+ 61 times (including the 300 and 400 figures).

It was only last summer the West Indies chased down 322 at Headingly to win, no doubt fresh in Root's mind after his declaration on that occasion in order to try to force a win.

I said ‘nigh on’......most unlikely.....quite uncommon......I know the stats (and posted them earlier in this thread) - all of the above are from 1,000 tests too. @BG seems to think that because they scored over 300, then they’d definitely have chased down 300.......agree they MIGHT have done, but it’s still highly unlikely and absolutely not backed up by the stats (and never at the Oval).

Presumably doesn’t understand that the batting team will find it easier to score runs if they’re chasing 450+ compared with 250 due to field placing etc etc.

 

[Weststander]

I always think that when using the highest SUCCESSFUL run chase statistic which is mostly used, it always hides how many runs unsuccessful chases got to. I think this is what fans don't see. They see 263 as the highest run chase at the Oval, then cannot understand why a captain doesn't declare until after they've got 400+ runs on the board.

A good point.

Radio5's (not TMS) sneering presenters yesterday kept sticking their oar in, that Root should've declared an hour or two earlier. IMO that's a dangerous game where modern IPL level players can accumulate huge amounts of runs in no time at all, so I agreed with Root's strategy. If we'd lost, he would have been derided. Well played Root, you got it right.

 

[dazzer6666]

A good point.

Radio5's (not TMS) sneering presenters yesterday kept sticking their oar in, that Root should've declared an hour or two earlier. IMO that's a dangerous game where modern IPL level players can accumulate huge amounts of runs in no time at all, so I agreed with Root's strategy. If we'd lost, he would have been derided. Well played Root, you got it right.

He also didn’t need to declare any earlier........regardless of the runs, sure he wanted the last hour or so, potentially under lights at them. Difficult conditions and a short enough blast for the bowlers to be completely fresh the following morning (although that didn’t look to clever after the first hour this morning [emoji23][emoji23])

 

[Triggaaar]

The people who said it will know who they are, they do not need me to highlight the fact or them

You're making it up, I've looked through the thread and can't see all these people you talk of.

Most people said that as 263 was the previous highest ever run chase at The Oval for a successful 4th Innings 300 would be more than enough.

Well yes, you said 300 should be enough. So are you just taking the piss out of yourself?

 

[Bold Seagull]

I said ‘nigh on’......most unlikely.....quite uncommon......I know the stats (and posted them earlier in this thread) - all of the above are from 1,000 tests too. @BG seems to think that because they scored over 300, then they’d definitely have chased down 300.......agree they MIGHT have done, but it’s still highly unlikely and absolutely not backed up by the stats (and never at the Oval).

Presumably doesn’t understand that the batting team will find it easier to score runs if they’re chasing 450+ compared with 250 due to field placing etc etc.

Don't disagree with you on field placings, but like I said, after setting an average West Indies 322 last summer, no way he was making the same mistake twice. Although I also agree with you the declaration in the end was about time not runs. I think the thinking is that you don't want too many overs on the ball in the final session so you start the final day still with a bit of shine on it.

 

[dazzer6666]

Don't disagree with you on field placings, but like I said, after setting an average West Indies 322 last summer, no way he was making the same mistake twice. Although I also agree with you the declaration in the end was about time not runs. I think the thinking is that you don't want too many overs on the ball in the final session so you start the final day still with a bit of shine on it.

If there’d have been less time left we possibly might have seen a more sporting declaration with the series already won (I doubt it though) but there was no need to declare until late yesterday.......Root had the luxury of making the game virtually 100% safe and then being able to have that last hour. Good point re keeping the ball newish as well - basically gives you two stabs at it with fresh bowlers.

 

[BensGrandad]

The biggest joke is, he’s not even a spectator he only looks at the scorecard. Hence his acronym gibberish about not having to see pudding to know how it’s made.

I took out a weeks Now Tv on Saturday for the England game and so was able to watch that game, Khan fight, todays cricket , watched all day, and England v Switzerland plus will get Tottenham v Liverpool on Saturday good value for £12.99

 

[banjo]

Well done jimmy.

 

[big nuts]

I took out a weeks Now Tv on Saturday for the England game and so was able to watch that game, Khan fight, todays cricket , watched all day, and England v Switzerland plus will get Tottenham v Liverpool on Saturday good value for £12.99

That's pretty good value for thirteen quid, I'm pleased you made good use of it.

 

[LlcoolJ]

What a great game of cricket and a great series. Have loved it. Especially Cook's performance. He said that Beefy had text him to ask for his script writer back.

 

[Mo Gosfield]

What a great game of cricket and a great series. Have loved it. Especially Cook's performance. He said that Beefy had text him to ask for his script writer back.

The final Test was a throwback, five days of gripping cricket, concluded in the last hour of the last day. Batsman digging in, bowlers getting on top and then losing the initiative, all good stuff.
On reflection, though, even with a 4-1 win behind them, the flaws in the England side are still with us. Time and time again, the lower middle order bailed us out. It is a sad indictment that the selectors are talking about perservering with Keaton. Why? Surely we have all had a long enough look at him to know that he isn't good enough. Ali should not be batting at 3 or 4 and Neither should Bairstow. They are both technically loose players and should be lower down the order. England regularly lost too many early wickets this series but were lucky that India did as well. Root's referrals, in the main, were pretty terrible but thankfully, Kohli was even worse.
The big plus points in the series were Curran, who is a real find and Anderson, who is bowling better than ever. Buttler played some good innings lower down and Stokes showed he could apply himself in times of trouble. The captaincy on both sides was indifferent and the catching below par.
It was a mixed series. I thought the bowlers were generally better than the batsmen. India looked better than us technically but always struggled against the moving ball. Too many England players still need to tighten up techniques and judgement outside off-stump.

 

[Garry Nelson's teacher]

Nice post match interview with Jimmy and Cook. Anderson said that he'd have 600 by now if Cook could catch.