[Football] England v Costa Rica (on ITV from Elland Road)

[Mellotron]

WHO?

Nigeria. The team we played in the last friendly. The 11 we put out against them looks like it will be the team that starts against Tunisia, with maybe 1 or 2 changes.

 

[Mellotron]

You make good points. In friendlys there have been cracking performances against Germany twice - Vardys superb winning goal a few years back - and Argentina, the last minute 3-2 win spring to mind. For some reason they don't translate to tournaments. Maybe Wilshire isn't going because he hasn't got the personality for weeks away and the temperament to watch Rooney's wedding video half a dozen times? Whatever the reasons, we seem better set this time around. Let's hope so.

We can consistently get decent results against top sides in friendlies. We have the ability, I believe it is a mental block now about tournaments that we need to overcome. Look at our performance against Iceland for proof.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

This is classic “find a way to slag off England”. If we played the same 11 all the time people would say he’s run out of ideas, or why isn’t he giving the fringe players a go as they might be called upon.

It looks like the team vs Nigeria will pretty much be the team barring 1/2 changes.

It was pointed out in the post match discussion, Southgate has looked at every member of his squad now. Friendlies are good for that sort of thing, but as you say, anything to slag off England.

Nigeria. The team we played in the last friendly. The 11 we put out against them looks like it will be the team that starts against Tunisia, with maybe 1 or 2 changes.

He knows, but choosing to ignore the fact that Nigeria are also WC finalists.

We can consistently get decent results against top sides in friendlies. We have the ability, I believe it is a mental block now about tournaments that we need to overcome. Look at our performance against Iceland for proof.

Four years ago, I went to Wembley to watch one of our pre-tournament friendlies against Chile. We lost, and looked out of our depth.
It's another reason why I mentioned (above), that Southgate has won a tournament with the U21s. He is experienced in managing expectations & it's clear he has the respect of the players.

I know he has Palace connections, but he is from West Sussex. If, by any remote chance, he does have great success, you can guarantee, these same people will be bragging about one of our own.

 

[colinz]

Well said. People often blame the Premier League for England being so poor, completely forgetting that we have always been shit at competitive international football. The Golden Age of the English national team did not end in 1992, it ended in about 1922 when the rest of the world picked up the game. 1966 was an aberration that we've never come close to repeating.

This is the most ordinary England Team (on paper) I've ever seen going to a World Cup.

Looking back I think the English Football Team have never recovered from 1970. Alf Ramsay's ridiculous substitutions against West Germany. In pool play we could have beaten Brazil and were worth a draw. Who knows if we had made the final, could have beaten them & qualified for 1974.
The only tournament England can really hold their head in shame is 2014.
Although in previous World Cups I think they have been unlucky. But maybe just punishment for playing uninspiring football.

1982, unlucky to be eliminated.
1986, eliminated by Maradona hand ball.
1990, unlucky to be eliminated, were the better team in the semi final.
1998, unlucky to be eliminated, through Beckham sending off. In a game often thought as being one of the best ever at a World Cup.
2002, eliminated by flukey goal & Goal Keeper error. Knocked out by eventual winners.
2006, Rooney being dumb & getting himself sent off.
2010, Lampard disallowed goal would have been 2all, only to become 3-1 a few minutes later.
2014, Awfull couldn't beat Costa Rica. & avoid defeat against Italy unlike NZ in 2010.

 

[Simster]

When Southgate took over I thought he'd lost his mind no more so than when Walker was a 3rd centre half. It worked, he wasn't swayed by the press - no one else even mooted it - and now its the accepted formation. It was brave as well, there would have been a shitstorm if t went wrong. He seems to have a plan in his head which doesn't involve Kane taking corners, 4-4-2 or practicing penalties to the point of putting pressure on or not bothering at all. I think we are in for a good World Cup.

He handles the media better than any England manager i remember too. Very professional and honest. What's not to like about his tenure so far?

He also won a tournament with the U21s, so has experience of managing expectations.

These.

In my eyes, he's gone from "Palace wànker" to "Proper competent 'stand or fall' Sussex man" in the past few months. I didn't see this coming at all, I thought he'd be a shite appointment, but so far so very very good - and I'm quietly optimistic he can get this group to play at greater than the sum of it's parts - something every other manager over the last two decades has failed to do.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

This is the most ordinary England Team (on paper) I've ever seen going to a World Cup.

Looking back I think the English Football Team have never recovered from 1970. Alf Ramsay's ridiculous substitutions against West Germany. In pool play we could have beaten Brazil and were worth a draw. Who knows if we had made the final, could have beaten them & qualified for 1974.
The only tournament England can really hold their head in shame is 2014.
Although in previous World Cups I think they have been unlucky. But maybe just punishment for playing uninspiring football.

1982, unlucky to be eliminated.
1986, eliminated by Maradona hand ball.
1990, unlucky to be eliminated, were the better team in the semi final.
1998, unlucky to be eliminated, through Beckham sending off. In a game often thought as being one of the best ever at a World Cup.
2002, eliminated by flukey goal & Goal Keeper error. Knocked out by eventual winners.
2006, Rooney being dumb & getting himself sent off.
2010, Lampard disallowed goal would have been 2all, only to become 3-1 a few minutes later.
2014, Awfull couldn't beat Costa Rica. & avoid defeat against Italy unlike NZ in 2010.

Good grief, look for the bad and you will find it. 1970 was one of the biggest travesties in football, where the opposition was so afraid of us, they tried to get Bobby Moore put in jail for an alleged theft of a gold bracelet, and poisoned Gordon Banks.

Substitutions were a brand new concept. Taking into account the altitude, of which the England team had no previous experience, it all added up.
Still, far easier to blame Alf Ramsey.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Got to? It's a training exercise, nothing more than a work out.

Teams that have that mindset do not win world cups.

I don't think I have seen the All Blacks mail in a performance ever, regardless of whether the match is competitive or a friendly.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Teams that have that mindset do not win world cups.

I don't think I have seen the All Blacks mail in a performance ever, regardless of whether the match is competitive or a friendly.

Believe it or not, mindsets can be changed due to circumstances. Friendlies and warm ups, are just that. I'm sure the coaches can get the team fired up in the tournament. It's just another excuse for a moan. If you check the score, we did win, 2-0.

 

[Brovion]

This is the most ordinary England Team (on paper) I've ever seen going to a World Cup.

Looking back I think the English Football Team have never recovered from 1970. Alf Ramsay's ridiculous substitutions against West Germany. In pool play we could have beaten Brazil and were worth a draw. Who knows if we had made the final, could have beaten them & qualified for 1974.
The only tournament England can really hold their head in shame is 2014.
Although in previous World Cups I think they have been unlucky. But maybe just punishment for playing uninspiring football.

1982, unlucky to be eliminated.
1986, eliminated by Maradona hand ball.
1990, unlucky to be eliminated, were the better team in the semi final.
1998, unlucky to be eliminated, through Beckham sending off. In a game often thought as being one of the best ever at a World Cup.
2002, eliminated by flukey goal & Goal Keeper error. Knocked out by eventual winners.
2006, Rooney being dumb & getting himself sent off.
2010, Lampard disallowed goal would have been 2all, only to become 3-1 a few minutes later.
2014, Awfull couldn't beat Costa Rica. & avoid defeat against Italy unlike NZ in 2010.

Blimey, talk about straw-clutching. We didn't win any of them because we weren't good enough. All teams can say "Ah but, yeah but, well but" when they don't win, and in contrast (nearly) all winners often need to have had the rub of the green go their way. (Our 3rd goal in 1966 being a classic example, and Nobby Stiles not getting banned for his assault on a French player). But it's marginal. You can usually pick a small number of teams who will win a tournament before it starts, and bookies have got rich (until this tournament) on people believing that England can be one of them

Anyway, we're off the point to which I was responding, namely that the formation of the Premier League made absolutely zero difference to England's international fortunes.

 

[Easy 10]

The game apart, I thought it was a fantastic atmosphere at ER last night, especially as it was only a friendly. Shame the band was there, but other than that, the ground was raucous and noisy throughout, and gave the team a great sendoff.

This is exactly why I have no issue whatsoever with Wembley being sold, if that eventually goes through. Taking England's autumn/winter Internationals around the country to club stadiums is absolutely what we should do, especially for qualifiers. We've got so many great stadiums dotted around the country where (when it really matters) a tremendous atmosphere can be generated, FAR better than the sterile, corporate, distant feel of Wembley. More England games at Elland Road, St James Park, Hillsborough, Villa Park, Stadium of Light etc would be BRILL.

 

[Brovion]

The game apart, I thought it was a fantastic atmosphere at ER last night, especially as it was only a friendly. Shame the band was there, but other than that, the ground was raucous and noisy throughout, and gave the team a great sendoff.

This is exactly why I have no issue whatsoever with Wembley being sold, if that eventually goes through. Taking England's autumn/winter Internationals around the country to club stadiums is absolutely what we should do, especially for qualifiers. We've got so many great stadiums dotted around the country where (when it really matters) a tremendous atmosphere can be generated, FAR better than the sterile, corporate, distant feel of Wembley. More England games at Elland Road, St James Park, Hillsborough, Villa Park, Stadium of Light etc would be BRILL.

Indeed. I don't think I saw a single Mexican Wave last night, which I think the daytrippers and tourists who make up Wembley crowds actually go for rather than the football.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Believe it or not, mindsets can be changed due to circumstances. Friendlies and warm ups, are just that. I'm sure the coaches can get the team fired up in the tournament. It's just another excuse for a moan. If you check the score, we did win, 2-0.

When I posted my original quote the game was 62 minutes old, we had dominated it yet were only 1-0 up. Good teams are ruthless, which is why it was heartening not just to see England grab a second goal but also keep on pressing until the final whistle.

Teams that coast tend to panic when things go bad in tournament play. England have been guilty of this in the past - switching off and allowing the Russians a late equaliser, shitting our pants against Iceland. What Southgate appears to have got right with this squad is a high level of intensity and a general positivity about the playing style.

There's no doubt we lack quality in midfield but the team don't look to be burdened by expectation as we've done in the past. Whether or not they'll be so comfortable under the glare of the spotlight when they arrive in Russia remains to be seen.

 

[pasty]

I'm really looking forward to the World Cup. I've no real expectations for a start, but we really should get out of the group, and will get a round of 16 tie against one of Portugal, Senegal, Colombia or Japan. If we win our respective groups, we should avoid Portugal, so would hope to get to 1/4 finals at least. Then who knows.......?

 

[spring hall convert]

This England squad is nowhere near as bad as people like to moan about it being

Yup. Don't get me wrong I'm not expecting much but we appear to have the most technically gifted and focused squad we've had in a long time and a manager not cowed by reputation who is willing to play a system that suits the players at his disposal rather than trying to shoehorn them into a tactical strait-jacket.

 

[spring hall convert]

the future looks bleak !!!

Did you miss our youth level results last year? I'm sure I'll be corrected if I have this wrong but didn't the U-17's, U-18's & U-19's win their respective tournaments with the U-21's making a semi final?

 

[spring hall convert]

He handles the media better than any England manager i remember too. Very professional and honest. What's not to like about his tenure so far?

I don't think it hurts that he has seen the absolute lowest of the low as far as international football goes. He can stand in front of those players and say wholeheartedly - 'what have you got to be scared of, go out and play.'

 

[Thunder Bolt]

When I posted my original quote the game was 62 minutes old, we had dominated it yet were only 1-0 up. Good teams are ruthless, which is why it was heartening not just to see England grab a second goal but also keep on pressing until the final whistle.

Teams that coast tend to panic when things go bad in tournament play. England have been guilty of this in the past - switching off and allowing the Russians a late equaliser, shitting our pants against Iceland. What Southgate appears to have got right with this squad is a high level of intensity and a general positivity about the playing style.

There's no doubt we lack quality in midfield but the team don't look to be burdened by expectation as we've done in the past. Whether or not they'll be so comfortable under the glare of the spotlight when they arrive in Russia remains to be seen.

Would you be ruthess one week before a big match, in a friendly, where you are a squad member and not wanting to get injured?

 

[Mellotron]

Teams that have that mindset do not win world cups.

I don't think I have seen the All Blacks mail in a performance ever, regardless of whether the match is competitive or a friendly.

By this logic, no chance Germany are winning the WC, as they lost 2-1 to Austria the other day. Spain drew with Switzerland as well so rule them out. Anyone else?

 

[Mellotron]

The game apart, I thought it was a fantastic atmosphere at ER last night, especially as it was only a friendly. Shame the band was there, but other than that, the ground was raucous and noisy throughout, and gave the team a great sendoff.

This. The fans being CLOSE to the pitch gave it a proper retro feel, sounded great. Can only help the players.

 

[blue-shifted]

I'm really looking forward to the World Cup. I've no real expectations for a start, but we really should get out of the group, and will get a round of 16 tie against one of Portugal, Senegal, Colombia or Japan. If we win our respective groups, we should avoid Portugal, so would hope to get to 1/4 finals at least. Then who knows.......?

Look at your wallchart and re-post your message