EMA

[KneeOn]

Spot on.
The problem is, although some use it in a worthwhile fashion, 90% dont. It goes on alcohol, going out, and even in some cases paying for holidays to Zante or Magaluf as some of my mates prove. Even so i dont understand how someone needs £30 a week to get to college each week and for equipment. What does equipment cost, say £5 being leniant for all you need which would last at least a few months. Those who have trouble writing, as FDM's gloves says he does, i can understand the need for a laptop, but not all college students do. Almost every family has a computer, and if not then a library within close proximity. So what does the other £20/£25 go towards once equipment and travel has been paid for?
I can accept that some need EMA, those who have trouble reading or writing so have the need for a laptop, and those who really do struggle to get to college (bus fares etc). But i can honestly say, the latter does not apply to a single one of my friends or people i know at college, yet large numbers of them get it. That is the problem i have with it.
The worrying thing is (and i by no means blame you for this FDM's gloves, as who would turn down £30+ a week) even you yourself say that its paid for your laptop, equipment etc, but you still have money left out of it to go out and get pissed etc etc. Surely you can see the problem?

Oh no, i totally see the problem, but while i get paid to go to Edinburgh to perform, get laptops and stuff which is useful and then STILL have money left over to kill my liver, follow the albion, eat out and the like each week, as you say no one would say no. Personally, i think 20 quid a week for all with no bonus is the way to go.

 

[Don Quixote]

No one should get free money. Although I wouldn't say no.

 

[Djmiles]

Personally, i think 20 quid a week for all with no bonus is the way to go.

I know it's been discussed on here before, but your idea makes no sense. The whole reason of going to college is to get the grades which will enable you to go out and get a better job.

I left college before EMA was introduced, and believe it or not 99% of us got on fine without the need for pocket money from the government. For the 1% who struggle financially, the EMA should go solely towards travel, books and tutoring.

Dishing out £20 a week to 16 year olds is just giving them a license to spend it on booze and cigarettes because they see it as a bit of extra pocket money (Stop me if I'm wrong). Now if they got it in the form of vouchers (which has been mentioned already), then they can spend it on important things.

£580 million pounds on a scheme which never needed to be implemented in the first place is a joke, and is hopefully something this government will soon get rid of.

 

[Conkers]

To be fair, I didn't know ANYONE that couldn't go to College because they couldn't afford to (yes, I went to college before EMA started).
I still think there should be some sort of means tested system where people who really cannot afford to go should get something but as mentioned already, I would hazard that at least 90% of people who get this EMA money spend it on non-essential items such as fags, booze, Albion games etc.

Or a novel idea, get a part time job! Sorted.

 

[Foolg]

So basically everyone thinks the same, that 99% of people can afford to get to college 5 days a week who want to go. Therefore 90% + of people who get ema CAN afford to get to college, and the money goes on booze and socializing.
In my opinion, give vouchers to those who really do struggle to get to college, and scrap EMA for everyone else. Those who want to socialise, go to the albion etc can get a part time job, thats what i do, and so do a large number of my friends.
The government should not be paying for peoples lives outside of college.

 

[Jimmy Grimble]

I have had students get really arsey because I have dared to stop their EMA payment for a week - even had one phone up from Zanta to ask why I had blocked their bonus! The stupid thing is that even if you block it, they appeal and the "there there" brigade end up overturning valid decisions. I don't doubt that EMA enables some people to come to College, but some of them take the piss - no pens, no paper, no resources, etc, etc - "Can't afford it". In which case I have blocked their EMA with the providers and not just the College. They can afford 20 a day and getting pissed three times a week, so the reality check is sometimes what they need. Of course, there are some where I know that the EMA goes straight into Mum's alcoholism and Dad's drug habit, or pays for the family to eat that week...

Apart from that OP - the Summer £100 should have been paid already. If you don't have it, you may have pissed off a lecturer who has chosen to use the EMA as some sort of power trip. Or, conversely, you could be behind in assignments, not shown a good attitude to learning or have an attendance under 89%. Which one is you?

I don't disagree with what people are saying btw - but I'd be a mug not to take the money if it's being offered to me!

Hmm. At our college we have a system where our teachers have to sign a form to confirm we've attended/completed assesments/shown a good attitude. My attendance is 100%, I attended all my exams and all my teachers signed my form. I think it may be a administration issue at my college because they have been a bit lax in the past with EMA payments.

 

[Tomnorthi]

Im going to college and wont be eligible, but what really annoys me is that rich people can still claim it. An example at our school is their parents have split up, ones really rich and one is under the boundary for claiming EMA. The person in question still gets loads of money from the government as well as receiving f*** loads from the second parent, really pisses me off. There are many cases like this. And just because my parents earn over 30k or whatever that doesn't mean they give me a tenner a week, I work for my money like all young people should.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The whole reason of going to college is to get the grades which will enable you to go out and get a better job.

Wrong, and anti-intellectualist (if there is such a word).

 

[Conkers]

Wrong, and anti-intellectualist (if there is such a word).

The purpose of college is to not get good grades then.......I sure hope you aren't a teacher!

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The purpose of college is to not get good grades then.......I sure hope you aren't a teacher!

it was the last bit about getting a job I was referring to. Everything related to education in this country seems to be geared to the final job and/or salary. I'm not happy with that message. Learning and education can be about personal enrichment as well. I think everyone should be given one shot at university at the tax-payers expense. I'd like to encourage people to learn even if they want to go into a job which is of no relevance to the qualification they get. I know not everyone would be up for it but those who are should be given the chance.

I've now emboldened the last bit so make it clearer.

 

[El Presidente]

My attendance is 100%, I attended all my exams

Did you do that because you wanted to maximise your grades and your future earnings potential or to get your EMA?

EMA seems to be a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The purpose of college is to not get good grades then.......I sure hope you aren't a teacher!

..and I'm not a teacher.

 

[Djmiles]

it was the last bit about getting a job I was referring to. Everything related to education in this country seems to be geared to the final job and/or salary. I'm not happy with that message. Learning and education can be about personal enrichment as well. I think everyone should be given one shot at university at the tax-payers expense. I'd like to encourage people to learn even if they want to go into a job which is of no relevance to the qualification they get. I know not everyone would be up for it but those who are should be given the chance.

I've now emboldened the last bit so make it clearer.

I made the point because it's true, whether you're happy about it or not. Having gone through the whole education process in this country, it's ALL about getting good grades. Let's not sugar coat it.

I got a 2:2, and have struggled to find the ideal job, whereas I know friends who got firsts and 2:1's who got their job based on their final degree grade. Yes of course it will then come down to personality and things like that, but the grade is one of the first things an employee will look at. After all, many graduate jobs require a minimum of 2:1. If you don't get that, you don't get a look in. End of.

If employees are setting benchmarks for grades, then it is impossible for someone like myself to even get a look in. It's a sad fact, but something we all have to live with.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

EMA is just an alternative to dole money , kids know that if they leave school at 16 they wont get a job so its worth going to college for 2 years and copping £30 a week for turning up. EMA should be altered so that those who pass the means test can claim the cash back from allowable expenses with receipts up to a maximum of £30 per week.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I made the point because it's true, whether you're happy about it or not. Having gone through the whole education process in this country, it's ALL about getting good grades. Let's not sugar coat it.

I got a 2:2, and have struggled to find the ideal job, whereas I know friends who got firsts and 2:1's who got their job based on their final degree grade. Yes of course it will then come down to personality and things like that, but the grade is one of the first things an employee will look at. After all, many graduate jobs require a minimum of 2:1. If you don't get that, you don't get a look in. End of.

If employees are setting benchmarks for grades, then it is impossible for someone like myself to even get a look in. It's a sad fact, but something we all have to live with.

I think our wires are getting crossed here. I'm not disputing good grades at all. What I am disputing is motives for further education.

What I'm saying is, if someone wants to study fine art with russian and then do whatever job that suits them, then let them get on with it. I'm happy with this. But, the public would suggest it's a waste of money to sent this person to uni who does not directly use their degree in the work place.

This is all. But I totally agree, get the best grades you can.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Having gone through the whole education process in this country, it's ALL about getting good grades.

I've also been right through the education process.

Just out of interest was the reason you went to uni to get a "better job?"

 

[Djmiles]

I've also been right through the education process.

Just out of interest was the reason you went to uni to get a "better job?"

Yes. What would be the point in getting £15k in debt other than to maximise your earnings in later life?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Yes. What would be the point in getting £15k in debt other than to maximise your earnings in later life?

As I said, you might want to enter FE to enrich yourself intellectually. I went to uni purely because it seemed a great way to move to London. I choose my subject based on the fact it was the subject I was best at. Future employment and earnings played no part in my decision making at all. I ended up around 8k in debt though.

Just before I met my missus she had recently finished a degree in fine art and certainly didnt do that to maximise her earnings.

To recap, my point was to move to London, the missus' was simply because she wanted to study fine art.

 

[Aldo]

Is there difference really that large between year 11 (or below) and year 12 that some students are to need £30 a week?

 

[Wilko]

I think our wires are getting crossed here. I'm not disputing good grades at all. What I am disputing is motives for further education.

What I'm saying is, if someone wants to study fine art with russian and then do whatever job that suits them, then let them get on with it. I'm happy with this. But, the public would suggest it's a waste of money to sent this person to uni who does not directly use their degree in the work place.

This is all. But I totally agree, get the best grades you can.

You raise a very good point, without wanting to sound too much like a looney leftie, the passion has gone from further education and learning. The majority of students now do not take an outside/external interest in their subject and simply want to know what to do to pass the exam - NOTHING ELSE.

In my subject of Sociology I used to get loads of Feminists and Marxists, students interested in political lectures, reading communist articles, staying behind for a chat after the lesson etc.

It is a shame that students now often simply want to be taught how to pass the exam and collect their £30 at the end of the week. I do not blame them though, that is the educational environment they have grown up in. I do not think it is making independent thinkers with an ability for free thinking, it is simply mass producing students who are effective in exam technique.

Although I now teach the subject I did my degree in, I actually took the subject for a love and passion for it rather than the intention to make more money one day. In fact, the very thought that students simply do further/higher education for the sole principle of making more money one day actually depresses and upsets me