[Misc] Electric Cars

[thedonkeycentrehalf]

I am getting it as a lease through work where, similar to the ride to work scheme with bikes, the cost is taken from my wages before tax which reduces the cost considerably - a £40,000 car is going to cost me a touch over £200 a month on a three year lease.

If you are employed by a company who have lease cars, it is worth asking if they are looking at implementing something similar. My company has linked up with Tusker and offering a scheme like the one McTavish has for all employees, not just those who qualify for company cars. They are also in the process of putting in a large number of charging points in our car park for people to use.

 

[Audax]

or, its time we stopped subsidising those who can afford a new EV. moving funding to charging is benefical longer term Shirley?

That infrastructure investment was / is happening regardless. Subsidising getting the new cars on the road (so there's a viable second hand market when the infrastructure catches up) remains the better plan IMO, especially as we get closer to the set deadline for when ICE cars begin to get phased out. What this does is hurt the bottom-end of the market where the subsidy helped to encourage those who can stretch to £30k, but not £35k, to take up EV offers instead of putting a new ICE on the road.

They're 2-3 years too early removing it completely. I could accept if it was a phased reduction, but going cold turkey isn't the right approach.

Also - it's not just this change. It's the cumulative effect it has on top of previous changes. For example, a few years back the changes to VED rates that suddenly made buying gas-guzzling heavy Range Rovers more competitive vs low (or no) emission alternatives.

 

[surrey jim]

I had a Nissan Leaf on hire for a weekend and was pleasantly surprised. Its responsive, fun to drive.

That said I cant switch to EV due to the lack of larger cars available. I need 7/8 seater with space in the boot and ability to tow.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

OK then EV car people.

If you were looking into buying or leasing a fairly entry level, small to medium EV what features and specs would you be looking for?

Any models you wouldn't buy?

 

[boik]

I had a bit of a chuckle myself. . . From an equivalence point of view there is a long way to go . . . .but we're a way off electric boy racer world.

Some of the electric variations loose their grille, traditionally one of the most identifiable features of an oncoming car . . .

Sound/noise is another one . . . . As someone who has raced I've heard the noisiest things on the planet which isn't pleasant. I've also heard the most beautiful mechanical noises . . . . Electric . . . R2D2 having a piss is a good one, the rest just annoy cats and run things own that don't look.

When someone comes up with the equivalent of an XR3i or a lotus Cortina, that kind of thing . . . Then the tide will turn . . . Something that appeals to car people, not hippies and religious freaks

You're worried about looks and then cite an XR3i and Cortina? You're weird!!!!

 

[mothy]

I'll drive from Brighton to Newquay & back in a day about 10 times a year - I'll be interested only when an electric vehicle can do that comfortably

 

[North East Seagull]

Interesting discussion this. I have just taken the leap from 5 years of hybrids to full EV. Anyone on here have any recent experience of charging up on a longer journey? I want to do Newcastle to Sussex soon but have no idea about how accessible chargers are on the M1 service areas, how long charging would take, and how much it will cost. Will (try to) research it properly but my quick searches on t'net to date haven't been that informative......

 

[brighton terra]

[video]https://iplayerhd.com/player/video/dae6a69a-adb1-4692-aaba-cff7e6bcd493[/video]

 

[Icy Gull]

You're worried about looks and then cite an XR3i and Cortina? You're weird!!!!

I think you'll find he's a petrol head! Both cars are classics (not that I would want either of them over something Italian though )

 

[Icy Gull]

Interesting discussion this. I have just taken the leap from 5 years of hybrids to full EV. Anyone on here have any recent experience of charging up on a longer journey? I want to do Newcastle to Sussex soon but have no idea about how accessible chargers are on the M1 service areas, how long charging would take, and how much it will cost. Will (try to) research it properly but my quick searches on t'net to date haven't been that informative......

Doesn't your giant Ipad screen give you that info? I took a big feck off Tesla taxi from Cascais to Lisbon airport a couple of years ago and made the mistake of asking how the car would cope with long journeys. The guy then proceeded to bore me rigid by showing me the screen that plotted a route to Brighton from Lisbon with all the charging points en route shown. he did this whilst driving which was a little disconcerting but assured me that the car wouldn't let him crash as he looked at the screen and me rather than the road ahead!

 

[zefarelly]

I think you'll find he's a petrol head! Both cars are classics (not that I would want either of them over something Italian though )

I don't think his readings that good, I was speaking in general, not my personal preference. I've never owned either nor been a 'boy racer'. but it is a significant market, RS & GTE still exist . . . M3, AMG etc etc . . what ever marketing 'sells' . . . . an accessible performance EV is a way off.

Likewise something as good as an 18 year old Subaru estate! TBH there isn't much out there now that good whatever the drive train.

 

[North East Seagull]

Doesn't your giant Ipad screen give you that info? I took a big feck off Tesla taxi from Cascais to Lisbon airport a couple of years ago and made the mistake of asking how the car would cope with long journeys. The guy then proceeded to bore me rigid by showing me the screen that plotted a route to Brighton from Lisbon with all the charging points en route shown. he did this whilst driving which was a little disconcerting but assured me that the car wouldn't let him crash as he looked at the screen and me rather than the road ahead!

It may well do that, I haven't really looked - I have just worked out how to turn the radio on the air-con down. Any first hand experience would be appreciated though, rather than getting the info VW want me to get!

 

[Greg Bobkin]

I'll drive from Brighton to Newquay & back in a day about 10 times a year - I'll be interested only when an electric vehicle can do that comfortably

It can. Assuming you're not going to drive for more than five hours – that would be madness – on the way there, take a break and recharge the car. Then do the same on the way back

Or, get an EV with a 300+ range (a few do exist) and use one of the chargers in or around the area while you're there...

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Interesting discussion this. I have just taken the leap from 5 years of hybrids to full EV. Anyone on here have any recent experience of charging up on a longer journey? I want to do Newcastle to Sussex soon but have no idea about how accessible chargers are on the M1 service areas, how long charging would take, and how much it will cost. Will (try to) research it properly but my quick searches on t'net to date haven't been that informative......

Have you got the ZapMap app? Or does the car have sat-nav where you can divert to rapid-charging hubs? I know there's a good new one at Banbury up the M40, but not sure about the M1. A quick glance at the app suggests there are LOADS located at service stations off the motorway, but they are normally more expensive than ones just off the beaten track.

The closest example I can give you was when I went to Manchester and back the other weekend. One rapid charge either way – maybe two on the way back, actually – and didn't add much time the journey.

 

[strings]

OK then EV car people.

If you were looking into buying or leasing a fairly entry level, small to medium EV what features and specs would you be looking for?

Any models you wouldn't buy?

I have just started looking. My criteria are:
- Cheapish
- Higher driving position than my current Honda Civic (because I live around country lanes)
- Can take the family of 4 comfortably (but it will not be our 'main' car - so short-ish trips and the boot need not be massive)
- Can travel the 110ish miles to my office and back without a recharge

Based on that, I am thinking the Hyandai Kona looks to be alright, although I won't do anything until September, so I will carry on looking between now and then. I am lucky in the respect that I have a salary sacrifice electric lease scheme available through work.

 

[thedonkeycentrehalf]

I don't think his readings that good, I was speaking in general, not my personal preference. I've never owned either nor been a 'boy racer'. but it is a significant market, RS & GTE still exist . . . M3, AMG etc etc . . what ever marketing 'sells' . . . . an accessible performance EV is a way off.

Likewise something as good as an 18 year old Subaru estate! TBH there isn't much out there now that good whatever the drive train.

Electric cars have fast acceleration - even a Nissan Leaf is no slouch from a standing start. I think the Tesla's with Ludicrous mode switched on will be significantly faster than any of those old boy racer motors but the price tag makes them far less accessible.

 

[Audax]

OK then EV car people.

If you were looking into buying or leasing a fairly entry level, small to medium EV what features and specs would you be looking for?

Any models you wouldn't buy?

Depends on exactly what you're looking for. I got a Zoe 2 years ago, and it's done everything I got it for. I went for the top of the range one with rapid charge etc. Decent size boot for a small car, decent-ish leg room in the back for a small car, plenty comfortable enough in the front (I'm 5'11"). Seating position is a lot higher than the Prius I drove before it.

For the small-car end of the market (without being too small) as it is today, I would think the ID3 is the sweet spot. Slightly more expensive, but you get better specs all around (range, performance, size). Then the Zoe, then the Leaf (no idea why, but the Leaf suffers on range vs the other two last I looked). If you've got the money to spend, the Tesla Model 3 is worth a look.

The area to beware of right now (despite my earlier posts) is the second hand market. Early Leaf's, for example, are known to have suffered with battery degradation (and thus range degradation) as they aged.

To be honest, I'd suggest you draw up you're list of most wanted features then do some solid research. If you go for a Zoe, I would absolutely advise doing it via leasing rather than buying to own (because the Zoe is still done on a model where you buy the car but lease the battery, so the battery becomes an ongoing cost - one of the reasons why I think the ID3 is a better option despite being a bit pricier up front).

Electric cars have fast acceleration - even a Nissan Leaf is no slouch from a standing start. I think the Tesla's with Ludicrous mode switched on will be significantly faster than any of those old boy racer motors but the price tag makes them far less accessible.

A few years back I found myself at the front of the queue on my Suzuki GSX1250 staring at a red light next to a Tesla Model S. I momentarily caught eyes with the driver, and both of us immediately looked at the lights. Moment they went green, we both took off. Was the first time I ever got beaten off the line by a car. That thing accelerated instantly.

 

[Audax]

That infrastructure investment was / is happening regardless. Subsidising getting the new cars on the road (so there's a viable second hand market when the infrastructure catches up) remains the better plan IMO, especially as we get closer to the set deadline for when ICE cars begin to get phased out. What this does is hurt the bottom-end of the market where the subsidy helped to encourage those who can stretch to £30k, but not £35k, to take up EV offers instead of putting a new ICE on the road.

They're 2-3 years too early removing it completely. I could accept if it was a phased reduction, but going cold turkey isn't the right approach.

Also - it's not just this change. It's the cumulative effect it has on top of previous changes. For example, a few years back the changes to VED rates that suddenly made buying gas-guzzling heavy Range Rovers more competitive vs low (or no) emission alternatives.

Having thought about this a little more ... maybe what the government should have done is put in place an ICE > EV scrappage scheme instead of removing the incentives altogether. Couple that with designing the scheme so that it incentivises the manufacturers to bring down the costs for entry level EVs as part of it and we have something useful for hitting their very ambitious targets for EV take up.

 

[mothy]

It can. Assuming you're not going to drive for more than five hours – that would be madness – on the way there, take a break and recharge the car. Then do the same on the way back

Or, get an EV with a 300+ range (a few do exist) and use one of the chargers in or around the area while you're there...

If travelling on my own, I'll do it without stopping. Generally about 5 hours. Sometimes under 4, but can be 6 or 6.5 hours

 

[Icy Gull]

Having thought about this a little more ... maybe what the government should have done is put in place an ICE > EV scrappage scheme instead of removing the incentives altogether. Couple that with designing the scheme so that it incentivises the manufacturers to bring down the costs for entry level EVs as part of it and we have something useful for hitting their very ambitious targets for EV take up.

Can't see that working unless the scrappage scheme takes into account the value of the ICE car. if you have a 30k ICE car and want to move to EV there is no way the government are going to pay the going rate of the ICE car as scrappage. The only way a scrappage scheme works is if what you are scrapping is a valueless heap of crap surely? Even then if someone is driving around in a £500 to £2000 car are they likely to be able to afford a 25k plus car even if they get 2k for the scrappage?

Or have I missed something completely?