Ed Miliband - Brassneck?

[drew]

If Brown and his cronies hadn't been so pig headed when it came to coalition talks then it would be Labour in a power share with the Lib Dems rather than the Tories.

Now they're showing how desperate they are to regain power and are probably regretting not having got rid of Brown during the talks.

I think more to the point, had Labour ditched Brown at the time of the conference, the election would have been far closer and they may even have retained a small majority. I think people underestimate how poor many thought Brown was as leader. However, nobody had the guts to take a gamble on a leadership challenge as they didn't want an election defeat on their cv!

Booted out of government with a seriously small share of the vote, a distinct lack of alternative policies so now casting around for inspiration from the Lib Dems AND - most serious of all - the realisation dawning that they chose the wrong brother. That's a shambles in my book.

David Miliband turned down the top EU job of High Representative For Foreign Policy in the hope of getting the Labour gig. Now everyone's a loser.

How do you describe it as being booted out with a seriously small share of the vote. Just to remind you that Cameron failed to win a majority from a position only a few months before where their lead in the polls was in double figures.

 

[Simster]

Booted out of government with a seriously small share of the vote, a distinct lack of alternative policies so now casting around for inspiration from the Lib Dems AND - most serious of all - the realisation dawning that they chose the wrong brother. That's a shambles in my book.

Absolute RUBBISH. Labour's share of the vote was 29% compared to 36.1% for the Tories and 23% for the Lib Dems. Seriously small? Not really. And who says they chose the wrong brother? He hasn't said anything yet!

The only major party who are a shambles at the moment are the Lib Dems.

 

[Gwylan]

Booted out of government with a seriously small share of the vote, a distinct lack of alternative policies so now casting around for inspiration from the Lib Dems AND - most serious of all - the realisation dawning that they chose the wrong brother. That's a shambles in my book.

David Miliband turned down the top EU job of High Representative For Foreign Policy in the hope of getting the Labour gig. Now everyone's a loser.

I think more to the point, had Labour ditched Brown at the time of the conference, the election would have been far closer and they may even have retained a small majority. I think people underestimate how poor many thought Brown was as leader. However, nobody had the guts to take a gamble on a leadership challenge as they didn't want an election defeat on their cv!

Pav, I think you're barking up the wrong tree here. Drew's got it right: Labour did far better than they expected, and I agree with him that they'd have done even better if they'd ditched Brown earlier.

I don't know where this "picked the wrong brother" comes from either. David Milliband was twice presented as a frontman to stick the knife in Brown and twice bottled it. He could have had a good job in the EU but bottled that and botched the job of being Labour leader by campaigning far too late.

Ed Milliband may or may not be a good leader, but with that sort of record, David Milliband certainly isn't. He was a virtual shoo-in for the leadership and cocked it up - that's scarcely the sort of person you'd want leading a party in a much tougher battle with the other parties. Ed M, on the other hand, was well behind his brother and Balls in the running and campaigned hard and won against all the odds - he looks a much better bet to me.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Because if you tink some one should be in power then you think they are the only ones who can run it well.

Don't take this the wrong way but that sounds like the youth in you talking. It's absolute rubbish to think that most voters only believe in the policies of only one party - that's exactly how we manage to get a change of government every now and then.

This time I believed the Tory policies were the best ( that's not to say I agree with them all ). I also thought the Lib Dems had some decent ideas. In the past I've voted Labour because, at the time, I thought they had the best policies. I often voted UKIP I'm strongly against EU membership.

The problem I have, I would suspect most voters have, is that there are policies I like from most parties but I end up having to vote for a candidate from a single party meaning I have to take a balanced approach to who has the most best policies at the time ( and yes I know that's crap English ). The exception to this is the type of voter who says "I've always voted Tory / Labour / Lib Dem / Green and always will". That just shows a complete lack of intelligence or thought process and they probably don't deserve a vote !

 

[Biscuit]

Ed M, on the other hand, was well behind his brother and Balls in the running and campaigned hard and won against all the odds - he looks a much better bet to me.

Ed was also the brains behind the 1997 manifesto.

 

[glasfryn]

and they will maybe not now but when an election is coming up, some might even walk across to Labour just to keep their seat





VOTE GREEN you know it makes sense

 

[Pavilionaire]

I find it hilarious the Labour voters on here who are in complete denial over what a mess Labour are in.

The one able and respected politician Brown had in his Cabinet was David Miliband. He occupied the centre ground of the party and was CLEARLY the best candidate. Labour members thought so. Labour MPs/MEPs thought so. But the unions didn't. So you've got lumbered with poor old Ed. The best you can hope for is he makes a decent fist of sorting out the party, hopefully the first thing he'll do is "modernise" it and take away the union block vote that put him in power in the first place.

For what it's worth, I know a member of the House Of Lords who has worked closely with David Miliband and had a one-to-one discussion with Ed just after he got the leader gig. The peer was of the opinion Labour had cocked up big time and Ed simply hasn't got what it takes as a leader.

29% is piss-poor when you consider there are large regions of the UK where no-one votes Tory.

 

[Gwylan]

I'm not a Labour voter so I can take a disinterested view on this.

It's nonsense to say that Labour is in a mess - it's running neck and neck with the Conservatives and that's just seven months into a new government, the administration's honeymoon period. Labour is doing far, far better than the Conservatives were at this stage in 1997.

And it's clearly nonsense to say that David M was the better candidate; he was the front-runner with most of the cabinet and had most of the branches and nearly all the Labour big-wigs behind him and still cocked it up. The Labour leader's main job is to win elections and one thing that David has shown that he can't do is win elections. Whether Ed's the man is a debatable point but David is a terminal loser and the Labour party is well shot of him.

Personally, I think that the opposition is rather scared of Ed. There have been three pieces in the Daily Mail since he was elected saying that he's going to be deposed and that people think they've picked the wrong candidate. If the Mail is spreading these stories, you can bet that the Tory party is too and they must be rather jumpy.

 

[Pavilionaire]

I'm not a Labour voter so I can take a disinterested view on this.

It's nonsense to say that Labour is in a mess - it's running neck and neck with the Conservatives and that's just seven months into a new government, the administration's honeymoon period. Labour is doing far, far better than the Conservatives were at this stage in 1997.

And it's clearly nonsense to say that David M was the better candidate; he was the front-runner with most of the cabinet and had most of the branches and nearly all the Labour big-wigs behind him and still cocked it up. The Labour leader's main job is to win elections and one thing that David has shown that he can't do is win elections. Whether Ed's the man is a debatable point but David is a terminal loser and the Labour party is well shot of him.

Personally, I think that the opposition is rather scared of Ed. There have been three pieces in the Daily Mail since he was elected saying that he's going to be deposed and that people think they've picked the wrong candidate. If the Mail is spreading these stories, you can bet that the Tory party is too and they must be rather jumpy.

How do you come to the conclusion that David Miliband personally "cocked up" the election? It was the union vote that lost him the election, therefore you're basically saying he cocked up with the unions. How? For being moderate? Electable? Appealing to Middle England? In 4 and a half year's time Labour will realise these are qualities their leader will need to be elected P.M.

If Ed is so good how come his own party members and own MPs/MEPs thought his brother was better?

As for the polls, if the Tory party in partnership with the Lib Dems can announce record public sector cuts of 20% across the board and a VAT hike to 20% and STILL be ahead then the alarm bells must be ringing for Labour.

 

[Don Quixote]

A peer? What do they know?

 

[Tubby Mondays]

As for the polls, if the Tory party in partnership with the Lib Dems can announce record public sector cuts of 20% across the board and a VAT hike to 20% and STILL be ahead then the alarm bells must be ringing for Labour.

Thats been giving me a bit of concern as well actually. Not the alarm bells for Labour bit, but where the pollsters find the dunderheads to canvass that come out with these figures? Do they do it it soley in Surrey or at the meeting of the Burstow Hunt?!

It will soon change when the rest of the country wakes up and smells the coffe.

 

[Don Quixote]

How do you come to the conclusion that David Miliband personally "cocked up" the election? It was the union vote that lost him the election, therefore you're basically saying he cocked up with the unions. How? For being moderate? Electable? Appealing to Middle England? In 4 and a half year's time Labour will realise these are qualities their leader will need to be elected P.M.

If Ed is so good how come his own party members and own MPs/MEPs thought his brother was better?

As for the polls, if the Tory party in partnership with the Lib Dems can announce record public sector cuts of 20% across the board and a VAT hike to 20% and STILL be ahead then the alarm bells must be ringing for Labour.

You don't know much do you? How did Tony Blair manage to navigate the unions when he had John Prescott against him? He convinced them he was the right choice, just as Ed has done. Many people thought Gordon Brown should have been leader then but they were wrong. I think Ed will be just fine.

 

[Bold Seagull]

That's a good call, and let's face it, if there is one thing the Labour party has become excellent at, it's spin.

'Spin' is a construct of the press and media and nothing more. They are the only ones who control spin, even if a politician did suddenly start being all honest, truthful, and sincere, the press would soon put the spin on it. We have a insatiable appetite for spin, we are probably to blame. The Daily Mail, The Express, The Sun, The Mirror and The Star account for 8m newspapers sold per month. All the other papers added together only comes to 2m or so.

With that amount of political power, in the hands of the red tops and the Mail and Express, politicians are spun whether they like it or not. All politics is about presentation, otherwise the press will present what they want to present. To suggest it's party related is frankly laughable, no politician from any political background gets to be an MP without mastering 'spin' and the media. But perhaps you've rather see as just one party...

 

[Bold Seagull]

How do you come to the conclusion that David Miliband personally "cocked up" the election? It was the union vote that lost him the election, therefore you're basically saying he cocked up with the unions. How? For being moderate? Electable? Appealing to Middle England? In 4 and a half year's time Labour will realise these are qualities their leader will need to be elected P.M.

If Ed is so good how come his own party members and own MPs/MEPs thought his brother was better?

As for the polls, if the Tory party in partnership with the Lib Dems can announce record public sector cuts of 20% across the board and a VAT hike to 20% and STILL be ahead then the alarm bells must be ringing for Labour.

A Tory party of course, that when up against the biggest deficit in recent political history, with a Prime Minister clearly out of his depth and losing the support of his party, with a country demanding change, still couldn't win a majority in a general election.

You mention the Tory party being ahead despite the 20% cuts and 20% VAT, but they haven't actually happened yet. We're all sat thinking 'this isn't so bad', but none of that has kicked in yet.

Anyway, as usual not sure where you've got you facts from, but recent polls have Labour opinion leading...

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/

 

[drew]

How do you come to the conclusion that David Miliband personally "cocked up" the election? It was the union vote that lost him the election, therefore you're basically saying he cocked up with the unions. How? For being moderate? Electable? Appealing to Middle England? In 4 and a half year's time Labour will realise these are qualities their leader will need to be elected P.M.

If Ed is so good how come his own party members and own MPs/MEPs thought his brother was better?

As for the polls, if the Tory party in partnership with the Lib Dems can announce record public sector cuts of 20% across the board and a VAT hike to 20% and STILL be ahead then the alarm bells must be ringing for Labour.

You try to imply that no Labour MPs/MEPs wanted him. In the first round of the election, Ed got 34.33% and David 37.78. 10.53% of the total vote for Ed was from the MPs/MEPs and for David it was 13.91%. That suggests it was far closer amonst MPs/MEPs than you post suggests.

Welcome to Google Docs

 

[Bold Seagull]

You try to imply that no Labour MPs/MEPs wanted him. In the first round of the election, Ed got 34.33% and David 37.78. 10.53% of the total vote for Ed was from the MPs/MEPs and for David it was 13.91%. That suggests it was far closer amonst MPs/MEPs than you post suggests.

Welcome to Google Docs

Are you suggesting Pavilionaire is guilty of spin!? Surely not....