Derry appeal rejected

[Aadam]

This thread is hilarious. I forget which player it was last night that theatrically threw himself to the ground on 19 minutes to try con a penalty, but if a United player does it, he is the biggest cheat going. You need to take off your rose tinted glasses and realise that EVERY club has players that will go down under minimal contact.

They tried to curb this by issuing a yellow card for diving but it doesn't stop people going down under soft contact, or when there's no reason to go down, ala El-Abd rolling around last night like he had been shot. That boy can take a kick or two as evidenced against Roberts all night, he was giving Roberts a tough time all night in his back and out muscling him off the ball but the second he thought he could get Roberts into trouble, he dropped to the ground like he was shot. Then got up as if nothing had happened when he realised the ref wasn't going to do anything about it.

Am I the only one that can watch a game objectively here?

But Ivanovic IS going to be punished by the FA for apparently punching a Wigan player. Go figure.

Because no official saw it. Read the rules. Retrospective action is there for incidents MISSED by the officials. The Balotelli incident was seen, so no further action taken.

What surprises me is that it's taken this incident for people to realise that Ashley Young's a diving cheat. He's been doing the same thing for as long as I can remember.

 

[Dave the OAP]

This thread is hilarious. I forget which player it was last night that theatrically threw himself to the ground on 19 minutes to try con a penalty, but if a United player does it, he is the biggest cheat going. You need to take off your rose tinted glasses and realise that EVERY club has players that will go down under minimal contact.

They tried to curb this by issuing a yellow card for diving but it doesn't stop people going down under soft contact, or when there's no reason to go down, ala El-Abd rolling around last night like he had been shot. That boy can take a kick or two as evidenced against Roberts all night, he was giving Roberts a tough time all night in his back and out muscling him off the ball but the second he thought he could get Roberts into trouble, he dropped to the ground like he was shot. Then got up as if nothing had happened when he realised the ref wasn't going to do anything about it.

Am I the only one that can watch a game objectively here?



Because no official saw it. Read the rules. Retrospective action is there for incidents MISSED by the officials. The Balotelli incident was seen, so no further action taken.

that was the point i was making

 

[The Large One]

This thread is hilarious. I forget which player it was last night that theatrically threw himself to the ground on 19 minutes to try con a penalty, but if a United player does it, he is the biggest cheat going. You need to take off your rose tinted glasses and realise that EVERY club has players that will go down under minimal contact.

It isn't about whether the player dived or not. We know he dived; it's about the refusal by the referee to acknowledge - upon reviewing the evidence - the dive. There was nothing Shaun Derry did that made Ashley Young go over. 'There was contact...' - the pathetic old chestnut that comes out at times like this - has little or no value.

They tried to curb this by issuing a yellow card for diving but it doesn't stop people going down under soft contact, or when there's no reason to go down, ala El-Abd rolling around last night like he had been shot. That boy can take a kick or two as evidenced against Roberts all night, he was giving Roberts a tough time all night in his back and out muscling him off the ball but the second he thought he could get Roberts into trouble, he dropped to the ground like he was shot. Then got up as if nothing had happened when he realised the ref wasn't going to do anything about it.

Have you not read the embarrassment and irritation many feel for El-Abd's elaborate face-clutching?

Am I the only one that can watch a game objectively here?

No.

 

[Aadam]

Hang on. Young was in an offside position - ie he would have been offside if he'd touched the ball.
The red card is for denying a goalscoring opportunity, isn't it?
How on earth can the defender have been denying a goalscoring opportunity, unless Young could score without touching the ball?

As far as I can work out, unless the striker is Yoda, there's no logical way it can be a red card.

Or am I missing something?

The offside has nothing to do with it. Once the first error is made in the offside, the next phase of play is that there was contact made by Derry on Ashley Young.

Lets just say for arguments sake the Derry went two footed on Young and snapped his leg, a little dramatic I know, but bear with me. If the linesman missed the offside, would Derry have had a red rescinded then, because Ashley Young was offside? No. It doesn't work like that. You cannot appeal a decision because an earlier decision was also missed.

The facts are QPR has TWO decisions go against them. Young was offside. The red card was harsh. You cannot appeal one on the basis of the other also being incorrect.

 

[Aadam]

It isn't about whether the player dived or not. We know he dived; it's about the refusal by the referee to acknowledge - upon reviewing the evidence - the dive. There was nothing Shaun Derry did that made Ashley Young go over. 'There was contact...' - the pathetic old chestnut that comes out at times like this - has little or no value.



Have you not read the embarrassment and irritation many feel for El-Abd's elaborate face-clutching?



No.

The problem with the evidence, is that in slow motion from behind Derry's foot is on Young's foot, and his arm is out against Young. So he's made contact in two places. How can a panel of people accurately judge whether Young was already off balance (which it looked like he was to me) and thus only minimal contact is needed with his momentum to go over.

Try leaning at the angle Young is when he is touched, and stand on one leg and see just how much force it takes to put you off balance. Add to this the speed at which he was running. You'll be surprised how hard it is to actually stay on your feet.

That being said. It was soft. And I feel sorry for Derry. But he didn't complain. Which is always a sign that he knew he did something wrong.

And no, I've not seen the El-Abd thread (if there is one). I'm glad people are admitting it was bad from him.

 

[The Large One]

The problem with the evidence, is that in slow motion from behind Derry's foot is on Young's foot, and his arm is out against Young. So he's made contact in two places. How can a panel of people accurately judge whether Young was already off balance (which it looked like he was to me) and thus only minimal contact is needed with his momentum to go over.

Try leaning at the angle Young is when he is touched, and stand on one leg and see just how much force it takes to put you off balance. Add to this the speed at which he was running. You'll be surprised how hard it is to actually stay on your feet.

The referee has to know that there was a foul, and he has made a judgement that he did know. Where did he get that from?

You've just answered the point - how, in this instance, can anyone know? And you're talking about it in slo-mo - which, even then, can sometimes actually distort the evidence.

That being said. It was soft. And I feel sorry for Derry. But he didn't complain. Which is always a sign that he knew he did something wrong.

That's quite a presumption. I offer an alternative and suggest it's that he's old enough to know that complaining has no value.

And no, I've not seen the El-Abd thread (if there is one). I'm glad people are admitting it was bad from him.

There's not one thread. There's been several over the years.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

You asked if you are the only one who can be objective, but it doesn't seem to be that way with you and your United.

 

[Common as Mook]

You asked if you are the only one who can be objective, but it doesn't seem to be that way with you and your United.

Quite.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

How anyone can think this is not a dive is beyond me...

Video Man United 2-0 QPR First Half Analysis Derry Red Card Ashley Young was offside-Watch Highlights Online

 

[NMH]

absolutely this. the FA are the guardians of the game. I hate this feigning injury. Why dont we make it a non contact sport and just be done with it. At least theres no ambiguity. Ballotelli's tackle was horrific but even worse was the decision of Mancini to keep him on when EVERYONE knew he was gonna get sent off. Ballotelli can f*** off and piss his talent away elsewhere.

Balotelli IS elsewhere - he's at City, so why should we care if he's a liability?

 

[NMH]

Last week Reina for Liverpool head butted AT a player's face. Little or no contact was made but the victim went to ground. Was he wrong to accentuate the misdemeanor?
I say no, there are times when players need to bring attention to a foul or an intent, or refs might let things go at some cost to the aggrieved player & his team.

 

[Was not Was]

Lets just say for arguments sake the Derry went two footed on Young and snapped his leg ... If the linesman missed the offside, would Derry have had a red rescinded then, because Ashley Young was offside? No.

You're right but that's a completely different situation.

The red card is not for violent play, it's for a DOGSO, as I believe it's called. The offside call had not been made because Young hadn't touched the ball (so it had neither been missed nor called). But (my argument): it is surely not a goalscoring opportunity because Young would be offside if he did touch the ball, and he can't score without touching it!

See what I mean?

 

[NMH]

If a punishment is given by the ref at the time, a review is simply not going to be given to increase the penalty. Ivanovic was a total idiot because regardless of the ref not catching his act, the cameras almost 100% will.
Because it's a red card offence he ought to serve an extra 1 match to account for that. Even that isnt enough because at no point was his team handicapped - perhaps the opposition were though

 

[Mr Burns]

...and el abds theatrics yesterday...or is that OK as he is "one of us"?

Couldn't agree more mate.

I did mention that is the referees thread, that although the ref was shit, he was just as shit for Reading than he was us. The most blantet cock up for us was CMS penatly shout, but also did say El-Abd on another day with another ref could have walked.

COuldn't agree more.

Love Adam El-Abd to bits, he bleeds blue and white stripey blood and if an ALbion player ever gave more effort for the cause ever, then I haven't seen him, but everyone thinks he's different class, whereas if the FA tighten up on the pulling and pushing at corners next season as I am led to beleive they plan to do, then our Adam could be in a spot of bother next year.

We have a few players that play act and try and get others sent off, Adam is one of the main ones. But as you say "he's one of us" so people over look it. It just made Gus' whining at Burnley about the Burnleys tactics and delaying and getting injured even more blaffing, as his side is one of the worst for it. But then again, he was owned so much by Eddie Howe that day, he through his hissy fit and walked off...... surprising to the delight of our own fans.... well most of them anyway.

 

[NMH]

You're right but that's a completely different situation.

The red card is not for violent play, it's for a DOGSO, as I believe it's called. The offside call had not been made because Young hadn't touched the ball (so it had neither been missed nor called). But (my argument): it is surely not a goalscoring opportunity because Young would be offside if he did touch the ball, and he can't score without touching it!

See what I mean?

However an act of God - or another MU player, could still have affected the ball.
Why should a call that has NOT been made, no matter how unlikely, have ANY influence over an *actual* offence committed......at any point in the match?

 

[Arrid]

How anyone can think this is not a dive is beyond me...

Video Man United 2-0 QPR First Half Analysis Derry Red Card Ashley Young was offside-Watch Highlights Online

Absolutely, anyone who can watch that back and think it is a foul, is an idiot. If the FA don't have the rules, laws, infrastructure or powers to overturn that, then something is seriously wrong. Quite frankly, they are making it nigh on impossible to referee a match, if we deem that as a foul. It’s crazy!

 

[Bold Seagull]

Ashley Young was clearly pushed to the extent where I read somewhere he's needed treatment on his neck for minor whiplash. Derry knew he'd given him a massive shove, and walked without complaint. When someone is running in full flow and gets pushed with that sort of force there is little you can do but hit the deck.

 

[Aadam]

You asked if you are the only one who can be objective, but it doesn't seem to be that way with you and your United.

Sorry, please quote where I have said Ashley Young didn't dive and I will accept this.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Sorry, please quote where I have said Ashley Young didn't dive and I will accept this.

You said it was a soft penalty. It shouldn't have been a penalty at all.

 

[Aadam]

That's quite a presumption. I offer an alternative and suggest it's that he's old enough to know that complaining has no value.

Sorry, missed this point. Or it could mean that he was disappointed with his stupidity, with his experience, for giving Young the opportunity to go over like that by putting his arms out when really there was no need to?

But like you say, it's all an assumption. Who knows why he walked off without protest.