David Burke

[KZNSeagull]

Well it is my experience that if you put shit into a data base, you get shit out. Conway, Chicksen and Agustein are eating into our budget and perhaps the data base needs a tweek or two. So if we did not waste money on them, perhaps we could afford one more expensive player who actually adds something to the squad.

Of course if you put shit in you get shit out. Does not explain why not all "his" signings have been shit. We can only really judge that when the 3 you mention have been given a decent chance and in Agustien's case, is fit. Conway does not look up to much, I will give you that. But then neither does Dave so far and we all know he came good last time.
Sadly, I and many others have yet to come up with a Hindsight button on any database.

 

[fosters headband]

Of course if you put shit in you get shit out. Does not explain why not all "his" signings have been shit. We can only really judge that when the 3 you mention have been given a decent chance and in Agustien's case, is fit. Conway does not look up to much, I will give you that. But then neither does Dave so far and we all know he came good last time.
Sadly, I and many others have yet to come up with a Hindsight button on any database.

Surely the skill and experience required to be a top talent spotter, does not rely on a data base on a PC. I am sure one of the best talent spotters this club ever had would not have used a PC and that was the late Peter Taylor. But then again he played football at the top level.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Surely the skill and experience required to be a top talent spotter, does not rely on a data base on a PC. I am sure one of the best talent spotters this club ever had would not have used a PC and that was the late Peter Taylor. But then again he played football at the top level.

Sounds rather like the debates between scouts and stats guys depicted in 'Moneyball'. Sabermetrics is now almost universal in baseball and clearly becoming more and more important in football.

 

[KZNSeagull]

Surely the skill and experience required to be a top talent spotter, does not rely on a data base on a PC. I am sure one of the best talent spotters this club ever had would not have used a PC and that was the late Peter Taylor. But then again he played football at the top level.

Yes, there is that. But we now have a dedicated scout in Scandanavia, 1 in France, 1 in Spain and 1 in Holland. Plus 8 in the UK and others looking specifically at kids. Our scouting network has expanded dramatically.

But he also said in that interview that he did not want the club to be surprised when a particular player signs for another club and we missed out because of ignorance of the players situation, demans etc. Only a comprehensive database can give you that.

 

[trueblue]

Surely the skill and experience required to be a top talent spotter, does not rely on a data base on a PC. I am sure one of the best talent spotters this club ever had would not have used a PC and that was the late Peter Taylor. But then again he played football at the top level.

Presumably the database is just a way of keeping notes on the players they have watched. No different to having a filing cabinet with reports in so what's the problem? It's not Football Manager.

 

[fosters headband]

Yes, there is that. But we now have a dedicated scout in Scandanavia, 1 in France, 1 in Spain and 1 in Holland. Plus 8 in the UK and others looking specifically at kids. Our scouting network has expanded dramatically.

But he also said in that interview that he did not want the club to be surprised when a particular player signs for another club and we missed out because of ignorance of the players situation, demans etc. Only a comprehensive database can give you that.

I think the increase of our scouting network is a great thing and hopefully we will get the benefit from it, but Burkes current signings and waste of budget does not fill me with confidence. So as I said earlier he has still to win me over, so I will leave it there.

 

[KZNSeagull]

I think the increase of our scouting network is a great thing and hopefully we will get the benefit from it, but Burkes current signings and waste of budjet do not fill me with confidence. So as I said earlier he has still to win me over, so I will leave it there.

. Conway will score a hattrick this pm anyway....

 

[fosters headband]

. Conway will score a hattrick this pm anyway....

I hope you are correct on that one.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Is Agustien shit or struggling for fitness? Is Conway shit or has he not settled in to the club yet? Is Chicksen shit or young and settling in to a new club and system?

 

[KZNSeagull]

Is Agustien shit or struggling for fitness? Is Conway shit or has he not settled in to the club yet? Is Chicksen shit or young and settling in to a new club and system?

Indeed.

Would like to hear what TLO thought of Mr Burke.

 

[Goldstone1976]

The thing that David Burke said that most resonated with me was about the sheer scale of the impact of FFP on players' wages over the next 4 years. If I understood correctly he said that if the operating result of BHA over the next few years was breakeven, then Tony Bloom would be allowed to put in £8m pa declining to £2m pa over the next four years. Assuming a squad size of 25, that would translate into average salaries of £5k/week declining to £500/week over the same period.

Clearly, he's just run some back of the fag packet arithmetic and made some very broad assumptions, but, nonetheless, potentially players are looking at up to a 90% reduction in wages in absolute terms (more in "real" terms) over the next four years. There's no way that will happen. In order for it not to happen, the operating situation has to be better than breakeven. There's only two things you can do to make that happen - further reduce non-football related costs (principally overheads) or further increase revenue (e.g. sponsorship, LED advertising, promoting fans' buying beer, pies and merchandise, and ticket prices). On the revenue side, by far the biggest contributor has to be the fans.

Separately, he also said that although it is clear that clubs who have flouted FFP and are promoted to the PL, it is NOT yet clear where those fines will be allocated, since the promoted club will then be under the aegis of the PL, not the FL. If a club who flouts FFP remains in the Championship, FFP rules say that the fine will get shared amongst the clubs in the Championship who have abided by FFP.

Interesting interview. Good job, guys.

 

[KZNSeagull]

The thing that David Burke said that most resonated with me was about the sheer scale of the impact of FFP on players' wages over the next 4 years. If I understood correctly he said that if the operating result of BHA over the next few years was breakeven, then Tony Bloom would be allowed to put in £8m pa declining to £2m pa over the next four years. Assuming a squad size of 25, that would translate into average salaries of £5k/week declining to £500/week over the same period.

Clearly, he's just run some back of the fag packet arithmetic and made some very broad assumptions, but, nonetheless, potentially players are looking at up to a 90% reduction in wages in absolute terms (more in "real" terms) over the next four years. There's no way that will happen. In order for it not to happen, the operating situation has to be better than breakeven. There's only two things you can do to make that happen - further reduce non-football related costs (principally overheads) or further increase revenue (e.g. sponsorship, LED advertising, promoting fans' buying beer, pies and merchandise, and ticket prices). On the revenue side, by far the biggest contributor has to be the fans.

Separately, he also said that although it is clear that clubs who have flouted FFP and are promoted to the PL, it is NOT yet clear where those fines will be allocated, since the promoted club will then be under the aegis of the PL, not the FL. If a club who flouts FFP remains in the Championship, FFP rules say that the fine will get shared amongst the clubs in the Championship who have abided by FFP.

Interesting interview. Good job, guys.

Yes, I did not understand that - the Football League website says that the fines will be split between those clubs still in the championship who did not flout the rules and this only applies to those clubs promoted, as it is only promoted teams who will get fined. Those that remain in the championship get transfer embargoes.

And his figures re the first bit were misleading (at least to my understanding of FFP anyway), as the acceptable loss for all seasons from 2015/16 is 5m per annum. But there is no doubt that wages will have to come down, but they won't come down by 90%, that's for sure.

 

[Goldstone1976]

Yes, I did not understand that - the Football League website says that the fines will be split between those clubs still in the championship who did not flout the rules and this only applies to those clubs promoted, as it is only promoted teams who will get fined. Those that remain in the championship get transfer embargoes.

I think his point was that although the FL have stated their position clearly (which is exactly what you say), promoted clubs won't be under FL regulation - they'll be under PL rules, who may or may not decide to implement what the FL said. He seemed confident that a fine would be imposed (by whom - the Fl or PL??), but not confident about where that money would actually go. One would have hoped that the PL and FL would have sorted such a basic thing out before implementation of FFP; but, in Burke's view, clearly not. Hmmm - a thought: if the PL and FL haven't agreed what happens with the fine money from promoted clubs, how can he be sure that the clubs will be fined at all? Whatever. It'll all come out in the wash. One thing I think we can be sure about is that it won't be implemented as strongly or as "fairly" as we would all wish.

And his figures re the first bit were misleading (at least to my understanding of FFP anyway), as the acceptable loss for all seasons from 2015/16 is 5m per annum. But there is no doubt that wages will have to come down, but they won't come down by 90%, that's for sure.

.....

 

[KZNSeagull]

.....

Yup, I see that. Surely the FL must have sorted this out? Surely? He even mentioned something about the money possibly going to charity or something!?

We will have to wait and see what happens I guess!

 

[The Large One]

Is Agustien shit or struggling for fitness? Is Conway shit or has he not settled in to the club yet? Is Chicksen shit or young and settling in to a new club and system?

It's interesting that Burke is being judged on players that haven't pulled up any trees yet, and yet is being dismissed in his role in, say, acquiring Ulloa.

It might not have been Burke's network who found him, but it was Burke who was head of the team that landed him - a full year into his role.

I don't know if FH was only selectively listening, but he is appearing to 'blame' one person, when it's a team of people who decide whether any given player is wanted - the final say being Oscar's. So I'm not sure of the point he's making.

 

[The Large One]

The thing that David Burke said that most resonated with me was about the sheer scale of the impact of FFP on players' wages over the next 4 years. If I understood correctly he said that if the operating result of BHA over the next few years was breakeven, then Tony Bloom would be allowed to put in £8m pa declining to £2m pa over the next four years. Assuming a squad size of 25, that would translate into average salaries of £5k/week declining to £500/week over the same period.

Clearly, he's just run some back of the fag packet arithmetic and made some very broad assumptions, but, nonetheless, potentially players are looking at up to a 90% reduction in wages in absolute terms (more in "real" terms) over the next four years. There's no way that will happen. In order for it not to happen, the operating situation has to be better than breakeven. There's only two things you can do to make that happen - further reduce non-football related costs (principally overheads) or further increase revenue (e.g. sponsorship, LED advertising, promoting fans' buying beer, pies and merchandise, and ticket prices). On the revenue side, by far the biggest contributor has to be the fans.

Separately, he also said that although it is clear that clubs who have flouted FFP and are promoted to the PL, it is NOT yet clear where those fines will be allocated, since the promoted club will then be under the aegis of the PL, not the FL. If a club who flouts FFP remains in the Championship, FFP rules say that the fine will get shared amongst the clubs in the Championship who have abided by FFP.

Interesting interview. Good job, guys.

I've got to be honest, I didn't understand that bit.

However, knowing that people who listen in to a recording can make notes of the figures and digest them, I decided not to challenge him. It could have taken up more time than we realistically had. And I still might not have understood it.

Therefore, I'm hoping that someone like, say, El Presidente can make some sense of them, and post up what he means. If he can't, I can always get back to DB and ask him to give some kind of (idiot-proof) explanation.

 

[AZ Gull]

I've got to be honest, I didn't understand that bit.

However, knowing that people who listen in to a recording can make notes of the figures and digest them, I decided not to challenge him. It could have taken up more time than we realistically had. And I still might not have understood it.

Therefore, I'm hoping that someone like, say, El Presidente can make some sense of them, and post up what he means. If he can't, I can always get back to DB and ask him to give some kind of (idiot-proof) explanation.

My take on what David Burke said was that effectively, if everything else remained equal, the reduction in allowable losses that FFP mandates over time would equate to the average salary of a 25-man squad reducing from £5k per week to £500 per week.

Now, that is obviously not going to happen, and hence clubs need to look at ways of increasing revenue and reducing costs in other areas, in order to NOT have a major impact on the playing budget. (Paul Barber has stated that the budget in 2013-14 is close to the budget of 2012-13; but to fall within FFP, this means that £2million of combined revenue increase/cost reduction has to be found elsewhere).

 

[Dave the OAP]

Which all points really to raising prices significantly over the next couple of years.

It wouldn't surprise me if the season tickets go up by a couple of hundred each year for the next three years. At the moment we have a huge fan base who seem to be able to afford these prices and willing to renew come what may!

That is why the playing side of the club is so worrying at the moment!

 

[Goldstone1976]

My take on what David Burke said was that effectively, if everything else remained equal, the reduction in allowable losses that FFP mandates over time would equate to the average salary of a 25-man squad reducing from £5k per week to £500 per week.

Now, that is obviously not going to happen, and hence clubs need to look at ways of increasing revenue and reducing costs in other areas, in order to NOT have a major impact on the playing budget. (Paul Barber has stated that the budget in 2013-14 is close to the budget of 2012-13; but to fall within FFP, this means that £2million of combined revenue increase/cost reduction has to be found elsewhere).

Yep, that's exactly what I think he said too. Given that PB has already taken cost out of the business, there will come a time soon when he gets seriously into diminishing returns (you can't forever reduce overheads). Thus the principal covering factor will have to be revenue increases. Clearly, there's no way that a hotel will be generating revenue soon, so my guess is that the increased revenue will come from a full season advertising revenue from the LED adverts, a full season of shirt sponsorship from AMEX, whatever incremental revenue has been negotiated with the new kit suppliers (which might be quite a lot?), with the balance coming from us in one way or another.

Clearly promotion would solve all these issues at a stroke. How the "suits" at the club must be ruing the fact we didn't go up last season....

 

[Ⓩ-Ⓐ-Ⓜ-Ⓞ-Ⓡ-Ⓐ]

I will listen to this before passing comment but in general I struggle to warm to this "director of football" role. Surely looking at past examples at other clubs this set up tends to fail miserably WAY more often than it succeeds!