[Misc] Covid jabs and prioritising

[Chicken Run]

Er, not quite sure that’s right. Your inference was that my judgement was being clouded by my own personal circumstances, if that wasn’t the tenet of your argument, why mention...

“I see why you would feel sad but the discussion is about who should be priority that’s all, btw hope you and your wife are ok.”

I don’t really want to carry on an argument, but as I said, I would have held the same views, whatever my circumstances.

Right well you have started an argument now, I’m telling you straight,I made NO connection to your situation either in writing nor by inference, I’d suggest that you steer clear of these type of debates.


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[A1X]

I absolutely get the current top 4 priority groups. But once they're done I would not go by age, as the risk to an over 40 isn't that much greater than to an over 30. It should go by profession, and those most likely to be exposed. As a man in my 30s working in what would normally be described as a bog standard office job I shouldn't be anywhere near a priority, whereas my younger sister (who would be in the lower age bracket) is a teacher and as such at much more risk of exposure.

 

[Mellotron]

I absolutely get the current top 4 priority groups. But once they're done I would not go by age, as the risk to an over 40 isn't that much greater than to an over 30. It should go by profession, and those most likely to be exposed. As a man in my 30s working in what would normally be described as a bog standard office job I shouldn't be anywhere near a priority, whereas my younger sister (who would be in the lower age bracket) is a teacher and as such at much more risk of exposure.

The noises coming from Gov certainly seem to suggest that once groups 1-9 are done, it will be done on other basis' than just age.

 

[dazzer6666]

The noises coming from Gov certainly seem to suggest that once groups 1-9 are done, it will be done on other basis' than just age.

The good news is with so many centres open/opening and us likely to hit 500k vaccinations a day quite soon (subject to supply) it’s going to be quite easy to flex the groups and target certain cohorts and get them jabbed quickly. I’d certainly have teachers well up the list (including before my own O50 group)

 

[Simster]

Wow.

So just about anyone with their own home goes to the back of the queue. Your list seems to display an incredible amount of jealousy and anger to those you see as more fortunate than yourself. I know young people will find the lockdown tough but so will everyone else too. The education thing will either be addressed by kids being held back a year or by being assessed on course work rather than exams with parameters adjusted for the effects of Covid.

Your parents could catch Covid and die within a couple of weeks (hopefully not of course), but if they had the jab they might have another ten years left. I really am struggling with your thinking here.

Priority should be the vulnerable and health workers first, and then work back towards the least vulnerable. Financial position should not be considered at all.

You always struggle with thinking when it comes to other points of view. It's your modus operandi on any political thread I've ever seen you contribute to. You kid yourself that you're some sort of politically central voice of reason, but are so close minded that you simply get stroppy and uppity. You're only ever 5 minutes from a flounce.

Look at your post here: accusing me of being driven by jealousy and anger towards more fortunate people. That is absurd as anyone who actually knows me will attest. Put it this way, I'm not going to accuse you of being heartless, insensitive or moronic just because you have dismissed financial position out of hand. But maybe you'd think differently if you were like a friend of mine - a self employed electrician whose work has dried up and is meeting his mortgage lender every month as he can't meet his mortgage payments.

I will qualify my position again especially for you: I'm not jealous or angry with anyone over this. I get on well with both of my (divorced) parents, but having lived with my young adult kids and my teacher wife during this pandemic, I am simply questioning whether the priorities really should have been purely on age. I've put forward some coherent arguments for this, and a significant minority on here seem to sympathise if not outright agree. I'm not 100% convinced myself one way or the other, just playing devil's advocate.

 

[darkwolf666]

Right well you have started an argument now, I’m telling you straight,I made NO connection to your situation either in writing nor by inference, I’d suggest that you steer clear of these type of debates.


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This is what I said...
I’m very saddened reading this thread to see expressions like “lived their life” and “boomers” bandied about, as a justification for not vaccinating people.

This is what you said, copied verbatim...

I see why you would feel sad but the discussion is about who should be priority that’s all, btw hope you and your wife are ok

Now, to my understanding of English, your were inferring that I had a preconceived idea of how this roll out should go, because iof my own personal circumstances. You have further backed that up by your telling me to stay out of these sort of threads...

I'm not arguing with you about it, and I stand by my point - it is sad that some appear to be arguing it's ok to push people down the pecking order as they have "had a good innings" or are "well off".

My suggestion to you, if you don't like my opinions, don't answer my posts...

Or is it going to be a case of I can't give an opinion on anything related to Covid because my personal circumstances might cloud my judgement (which it hasn't)? As far as I am concerned my opinion is as good as the next persons.

Best we leave it there now!

 

[Chicken Run]

This is what I said...
I’m very saddened reading this thread to see expressions like “lived their life” and “boomers” bandied about, as a justification for not vaccinating people.

This is what you said, copied verbatim...

I see why you would feel sad but the discussion is about who should be priority that’s all, btw hope you and your wife are ok

Now, to my understanding of English, your were inferring that I had a preconceived idea of how this roll out should go, because iof my own personal circumstances. You have further backed that up by your telling me to stay out of these sort of threads...

I'm not arguing with you about it, and I stand by my point - it is sad that some appear to be arguing it's ok to push people down the pecking order as they have "had a good innings" or are "well off".

My suggestion to you, if you don't like my opinions, don't answer my posts...

Or is it going to be a case of I can't give an opinion on anything related to Covid because my personal circumstances might cloud my judgement (which it hasn't)? As far as I am concerned my opinion is as good as the next persons.

Best we leave it there now!

I never suggested that I didn’t like your opinion, I say again, looking at the language that has been used on thread I can see why anybody (I should have used this phrase instead of “you” but in fairness I was responding to you) looking at this thread would be saddened.


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[darkwolf666]

I never suggested that I didn’t like your opinion, I say again, looking at the language that has been used on thread I can see why anybody (I should have used this phrase instead of “you” but in fairness I was responding to you) looking at this thread would be saddened.


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My apologies for my reaction.

All good at this end!

 

[Simster]

I'm not arguing with you about it, and I stand by my point - it is sad that some appear to be arguing it's ok to push people down the pecking order as they have "had a good innings" or are "well off".

It is only sad because we can't jab everyone on day one. As such, decisions have to be made. And I take issue with both of your quotes:

"had a good innings" and "well off": You're ignoring the nuances to suit your argument that anyone who dares look beyond the elderly is somehow being callous. They're not. I am merely questioning that those who have lived a full and comfortable life and are retired with no financial worries and a secure family support bubble are perfectly capable of sitting it out for another 4 or 5 months and perhaps could drop behind economically active but financially struggling people. I realise not all of the elderly fall into this category, but my parents certainly do and I dare say that applies to relatives of others on this board.

Maybe I should say I find it sad that you don't care about families relying on sole trader income who might well lose their house because work has dried up?

 

[wellquickwoody]

You always struggle with thinking when it comes to other points of view. It's your modus operandi on any political thread I've ever seen you contribute to. You kid yourself that you're some sort of politically central voice of reason, but are so close minded that you simply get stroppy and uppity. You're only ever 5 minutes from a flounce.

Look at your post here: accusing me of being driven by jealousy and anger towards more fortunate people. That is absurd as anyone who actually knows me will attest. Put it this way, I'm not going to accuse you of being heartless, insensitive or moronic just because you have dismissed financial position out of hand. But maybe you'd think differently if you were like a friend of mine - a self employed electrician whose work has dried up and is meeting his mortgage lender every month as he can't meet his mortgage payments.

I will qualify my position again especially for you: I'm not jealous or angry with anyone over this. I get on well with both of my (divorced) parents, but having lived with my young adult kids and my teacher wife during this pandemic, I am simply questioning whether the priorities really should have been purely on age. I've put forward some coherent arguments for this, and a significant minority on here seem to sympathise if not outright agree. I'm not 100% convinced myself one way or the other, just playing devil's advocate.

You are perfectly entitled to play devils advocate, as am I to disagree with your idea.

 

[Chicken Run]

My apologies for my reaction.

All good at this end!

[emoji106]


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[Simster]

You are perfectly entitled to play devils advocate, as am I to disagree with your idea.

That's big of you.

Next time, perhaps leave out the "you seem to display an incredible amount of jealousy and anger to those you see as more fortunate than yourself" drivel then, eh?

 

[darkwolf666]

It is only sad because we can't jab everyone on day one. As such, decisions have to be made. And I take issue with both of your quotes:

"had a good innings" and "well off": You're ignoring the nuances to suit your argument that anyone who dares look beyond the elderly is somehow being callous. They're not. I am merely questioning that those who have lived a full and comfortable life and are retired with no financial worries and a secure family support bubble are perfectly capable of sitting it out for another 4 or 5 months and perhaps could drop behind economically active but financially struggling people. I realise not all of the elderly fall into this category, but my parents certainly do and I dare say that applies to relatives of others on this board.

Maybe I should say I find it sad that you don't care about families relying on sole trader income who might well lose their house because work has dried up?

Another 4 or 5 months, so easy to say isn't it... We have been shielding for the last 10 months, I think that is long enough!

Agree though, there is no easy answer. I just think stopping the most vulnerable from dying should be priority, well off or not, without good support or not ..

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Another 4 or 5 months, so easy to say isn't it... We have been shielding for the last 10 months, I think that is long enough!

Agree though, there is no easy answer. I just think stopping the most vulnerable from dying should be priority, well off or not, without good support or not ..

What is “easier” shielding for 4-5 month more or not being able to pay the mortgage/bills.

No one has said it’s an easy option.

As it stands I will be in one of the priority groups, I would be happy to give it up due to my age/wellness to someone self employed to be able to go back to work in someone’s house.

 

[darkwolf666]

What’s is “easier” shielding for 4-5 month more or not being able to pay the mortgage/bills.

No one has said it’s an easy option.

How do you know we're not struggling to pay the bills too? You don't...

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

How do you know we're not struggling to pay the bills too? You don't...

You’ve said elsewhere you have finically able to do so.

If that’s not the case, it’s also better to allow 1 group to go back to work and support the other than having to support both and passing a bigger bill on to future generations.

 

[WilburySeagull]

This thread is really going round in circles. The pririties in the 1st 4 phases have been decided on medical grounds. The absolute priority is to save the NHS from collapse. My daughter works in critical care and so we know 2st hand just how stretched hospitals are. Unless this situation can be cleared others will not get the treatments they need whatever age they are and the way to do it is to vaccinate those most likely to be hospitalised with covid. Then we can look at other groups like teachers and others who interact with large numbers of people by nature of their job.

 

[METALMICKY]

Judging by some of the attitudes and comments on this thread I'm very surprised that there hasn't been a suggestion to put all the long term unemployed or those on benefits at the back of the queue for the vaccine

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

What is “easier” shielding for 4-5 month more or not being able to pay the mortgage/bills.

No one has said it’s an easy option.

As it stands I will be in one of the priority groups, I would be happy to give it up due to my age/wellness to someone self employed to be able to go back to work in someone’s house.

I didn’t know the self employed had stopped working at people’s houses. We’ve certainly had different tradesmen at ours but with social distancing, masks and full disinfecting when they have left.

 

[Simster]

Judging by some of the attitudes and comments on this thread I'm very surprised that there hasn't been a suggestion to put all the long term unemployed or those on benefits at the back of the queue for the vaccine

I'm curious - which "attitudes and comments" do you find so offensive, and from whom?