[Brighton] Council imposing double council tax on second homes in Brighton & Hove.

[Machiavelli]

What is wrong if you can afford to have 2 homes ,
what has it got to do with the council , or anybody else , too much interference with people’s rights by government and councils,
Brighton council is becoming more like a Russian state council

There's nothing wrong if you can afford to have two homes. If you have two homes, you will have to accept whatever taxation regime that is policy. If that changes, you'll have to accept it. Given we have a shortage of properties, any government being honest about the situation and finding ways to address this is fine by me.

 

[Guinness Boy]

There's nothing wrong if you can afford to have two homes. If you have two homes, you will have to accept whatever taxation regime that is policy. If that changes, you'll have to accept it. Given we have a shortage of properties, any government being honest about the situation and finding ways to address this is fine by me.

Spot on.

If you can afford a second property in Brighton, where tiny flats are going for around £300,000, then you can afford a tax hike that might educate kids with special needs, provide adult social care for the most vulnerable and clean up our atmosphere so that kids are at less risk of severe asthma.

 

[The Rivet]

What I find abhorrent is working people struggling so much that they are forced to seek help from the council. The council then have the discretion to pay out up to the max amount of LHA. That equates to the tax payer paying the mortgage for a private BTL landlord. Preposterous.

 

[drew]

What I found strange about the vast housing scheme being built on greenfield next to Ditchling Common, was why there? The wrong side of Burgess Hill to the A27. Folders Lane, the poor road to HH and the congested area by World’s End will see 1,000’s more cars each day. The fields along the link road to the A27 crying out for housing, not just warehouses. Can only think that it makes BH look more balanced on a Mid Sussex planners exciting masterplan.

Because on the other side of town they're building 3500 homes including 3 schools and sports facilities!!

 

[clapham_gull]

Bit pompous aren't you. The OP has missed the point, empty second homes should be double council taxed. Private landlords should not be able to charge double the mortgage in rent. Plain enough for you now? Pffft

That kind of doesn't work if their mortgage repayments are well under market rent.

They really is only two solutions. Build more houses to sell or build more houses to be rented out by the local council with a fixed rent.

Changing the council tax rules with the existing houses (empty or second) is a very short solution and a lazy one.

Many of the owners will simply sell them and the long term uplift in council tax revenue will disappear.

The problem is so much of our economy is based on the price of a house.

If we build millions more, inevitably the price of existing houses will go down.

There will then be pressure to completely re-calculate the current banding for the entire country. That all really needs to happen.

On a slightly different subject, the disparities of the council tax nationally are so unfair. I live in Wandsworth with the lowest in the country, multiple major transport links (no need for a car) and the bins get emptied.

 

[GT49er]

Isn't this second homes rather them homes available for rent? If so, fair enough?

Yes, that was my first thought too.

 

[Weststander]

Because on the other side of town they're building 3500 homes including 3 schools and sports facilities!!

Genuine question as a non Bugger Hiller, what was the exact attraction of heathland near Folders and World’s End with shit roads?

 

[Tim Over Whelmed]

I know the same situations. They consider themselves very switched on, the likes of us naive in missing out. In no time at all under Blair, Cameron, worth far more than most people, in my experience with a largely empty home in France or Spain too.

Lost count of the time I've explained my mortgage position, pension, savings etc and people have said you could buy a portfolio of 20, 30 properties etc, and when I say it's morally wrong and causing suffering they just don't see it, we've become a very selfish society

 

[The Rivet]

That kind of doesn't work if their mortgage repayments are well under market rent.

They really is only two solutions. Build more houses to sell or build more houses to be rented out by the local council with a fixed rent.

Changing the council tax rules with the existing houses (empty or second) is a very short solution and a lazy one.

Many of the owners will simply sell them and the long term uplift in council tax revenue will disappear.

The problem is so much of our economy is based on the price of a house.

If we build millions more, inevitably the price of existing houses will go down.

There will then be pressure to completely re-calculate the current banding for the entire country. That all really needs to happen.

On a slightly different subject, the disparities of the council tax nationally are so unfair. I live in Wandsworth with the lowest in the country, multiple major transport links (no need for a car) and the bins get emptied.

'There really is only two solutions. Build more houses to sell or build more houses to be rented out by the local council with a fixed rent'.................Very much agreed. Once upon a time the councils had the power to cap the rent landlords could charge, that's gone.

 

[Weststander]

Spot on.

If you can afford a second property in Brighton, where tiny flats are going for around £300,000, then you can afford a tax hike that might educate kids with special needs, provide adult social care for the most vulnerable and clean up our atmosphere so that kids are at less risk of severe asthma.

That to me is THE benefit, much needed BHCC funds.

 

[zefarelly]

I'm very sorry, but can someone explain why someone needs a second property after they have bought (or got a mortgage) on the one they live in, unless it is part of some sort of business (which I have no issue with, but would then be subject to business rules)

Because they are wealthy enough to indulge in personal luxury . . .lucky them . . . And they should pay For it, because they can, but not at the expense of the moral majority. (An Argument says the moral majority voted to be dry humped so f*** em!)

Aside the fact the country is over populated, by about 20 million ( different subject) a big part of the housing problem is single or under occupation. . . and those who haven't downsized post offspring. . . Our road is 3-5 bed houses, and a few split house flats, a real mish mash . . . But I know of at least 4 places at least 4 bed, with single occupancy, several large 4 bed places with couples. . . I guess a generational cull will change things, and in a few years we'll run out of wealthy pensioners with mega bucks pensions, that will force downsizing. . . I don't mean ill on anyone, but we have a generation of 'normal people' now penioners, who are luckily ( for them ) far wealthier than todays average. . . . I'm sure that is skewing things . .mostly the property situation. . . . You'd like to think things will level out . . . . . . One lives in hope!

 

[drew]

Genuine question as a non Bugger Hiller, what was the exact attraction of heathland near Folders and World’s End with shit roads?

Not entirely sure but there have been estates built off Valebridge Road to the east of the railway line on the north side of the town. As for south of folders lane, I'm guessing it's an opportunity for developers to make money. That area is a little more affluent than others which will probably be reflected in the selling prices. It's also a bit rich for a lot of the occupants on the south side of Folders Lane to moan about it on the basis that pretty much every one of them has capitalised on their large gardens and built large additional houses. I do have some sympathy for a friend who lives along there who spent some time doing a great renovation of one property only to find that as soon as it was finished, the landowner behind them went and built an entire estate!!!

 

[clapham_gull]

'They really is only two solutions. Build more houses to sell or build more houses to be rented out by the local council with a fixed rent'.................Very much agreed. Once upon a time the councils had the power to cap the rent landlords could charge, that's gone.

Rent caps for private landlords aren't going to work long term.

The Landlord can always sell the house to someone who wants to live there and you end up with less stock to rent out.

Also (controversially) I know of instances of people living in social housing who could adequately afford to buy. That is of course THEIR choice, but with limited social housing......

If I was in charge of the economy, I'd have a national savings scheme where the money goes to help fund a national building scheme. You'd get a small return on your money (or no return) when the houses are sold.

Sorry to reiterate but...

1) Build more homes
2) Change the planning laws to allow it to happen
3) Some people are going to have to get used to not seeing fields for miles
4) The price of their home is probably going to go down.
5) Get used to it.. before your house was there , there was probably nothing there.
6) or Sell up and move to Spain

 

[drew]

Because they are wealthy enough to indulge in personal luxury . . .lucky them . . . And they should pay For it, because they can, but not at the expense of the moral majority. (An Argument says the moral majority voted to be dry humped so f*** em!)

Aside the fact the country is over populated, by about 20 million ( different subject) a big part of the housing problem is single or under occupation. . . and those who haven't downsized post offspring. . . Our road is 3-5 bed houses, and a few split house flats, a real mish mash . . . But I know of at least 4 places at least 4 bed, with single occupancy, several large 4 bed places with couples. . . I guess a generational cull will change things, and in a few years we'll run out of wealthy pensioners with mega bucks pensions, that will force downsizing. . . I don't mean ill on anyone, but we have a generation of 'normal people' now penioners, who are luckily ( for them ) far wealthier than todays average. . . . I'm sure that is skewing things . .mostly the property situation. . . . You'd like to think things will level out . . . . . . One lives in hope!

How on earth do you arrive at the belief the country is overpopulated by 20m?

 

[dazzer6666]

Genuine question as a non Bugger Hiller, what was the exact attraction of heathland near Folders and World’s End with shit roads?

Developers will buy anywhere where they can get planning permission (it’s just outside the SDNP boundary), landowners will sell if they get the chance. Houses will be cheaper than Brighton but still close, and an easy commute to London with BH having two stations.

 

[Weststander]

Lost count of the time I've explained my mortgage position, pension, savings etc and people have said you could buy a portfolio of 20, 30 properties etc, and when I say it's morally wrong and causing suffering they just don't see it, we've become a very selfish society

There’s a huge chasm, I’ve spoken about it on nsc before. @Machiavelli a nsc rarity as he does too. There’s a social media and politics obsession with non-doms and assorted crooks like the Mone’s.

But under the radar in Southern England, there are 10,000’s of households with incredible balance sheets, which they didn’t have in 2000. it might comprise a £1m home with next to no mortgage, a £300k place in Spain, Cornwall or France, a couple of BTL’s with fantastic equity and £700k under wealth management (SIPP’s, ISA’s). A load of Albion fans will be in this position. A grandparent dies and another £600k hits the pot. Cash is paid out to wipe out their kids student debt, with ease they can find £150k to put loved ones on the housing ladder, that size of deposit getting a much cheaper mortgage deal. Money makes money. It’s not party political, first hand I’ve watched this unfold since about 1995.

They key thing is the £3m net worth was not earned through toil.

 

[portlock seagull]

One life. Live it. One home. Live in it.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Rent caps for private landlords aren't going to work long term.

The Landlord can always sell the house to someone who wants to live there and you end up with less stock to rent out.

Also (controversially) I know of instances of people living in social housing who could adequately afford to buy. That is of course THEIR choice, but with limited social housing......

If I was in charge of the economy, I'd have a national savings scheme where the money goes to help fund a national building scheme. You'd get a small return on your money (or no return) when the houses are sold.

Sorry to reiterate but...

1) Build more homes
2) Change the planning laws to allow it to happen
3) Some people are going to have to get used to not seeing fields for miles
4) The price of their home is probably going to go down.
5) Get used to it.. before your house was there , there was probably nothing there.
6) or Sell up and move to Spain

I’d also build a lot of social housing. This would be ideal for the national savings scheme you mention.

 

[Machiavelli]

That kind of doesn't work if their mortgage repayments are well under market rent.

They really is only two solutions. Build more houses to sell or build more houses to be rented out by the local council with a fixed rent.

Changing the council tax rules with the existing houses (empty or second) is a very short solution and a lazy one.

Many of the owners will simply sell them and the long term uplift in council tax revenue will disappear.

The problem is so much of our economy is based on the price of a house.

If we build millions more, inevitably the price of existing houses will go down.

There will then be pressure to completely re-calculate the current banding for the entire country. That all really needs to happen.

On a slightly different subject, the disparities of the council tax nationally are so unfair. I live in Wandsworth with the lowest in the country, multiple major transport links (no need for a car) and the bins get emptied.

Agree on this. The council tax one needs to be reiterated again and again. One minor quibble: beyond building more for sale and building council houses, you can also change the taxation regime so that more people can own their own home, become a member of a coop, or have a council house.

 

[zefarelly]

How on earth do you arrive at the belief the country is overpopulated by 20m?

One of my scientifically unproven sweeping generalisations. Do you disagree?

And some stuff about self sufficiency, as a nation, and being able to use a road without craters and a load of cockwombles in the way.