Coldean/Moulscoomb parking issues

[Tooting Gull]

No, don't think this is right, because they already have this "request" in Moulsecoomb. There are loads of places where parking restrictions only apply on match days. Southampton and Brentford to name but two.

It is possible to move it up a notch from the 'request' ie the blue signs to a full controlled zone on a matchday, but I thought that was a longer process, detailed resident discussions etc and probably took months via the council. Plus there would be objections to a zone from some residents and presumably the shops/pub/bookies. I know there are experts on here in this area though.

 

[Storer 68]

Classic I'm all right Jack stuff. And they say the people who have to drive sometimes are selfish. What a load of crap. What the f**k do you know about what methods I've tried this season. Idiot.

I don't know and quite frankly I don't care.

All I am saying is that a car is not necessary to access the Amex. And the club have made it quite clear that it wants supporters to utilise the sustainable methoids of transport available and only think of using a car as an absolute last resort.

 

[algie]

I don't know and quite frankly I don't care.

All I am saying is that a car is not necessary to access the Amex. And the club have made it quite clear that it wants supporters to utilise the sustainable methoids of transport available and only think of using a car as an absolute last resort.

A car is necessary for some who have to travel straight from work/live miles away or out in the sticks.

 

[Tooting Gull]

I don't know and quite frankly I don't care.

All I am saying is that a car is not necessary to access the Amex. And the club have made it quite clear that it wants supporters to utilise the sustainable methoids of transport available and only think of using a car as an absolute last resort.

That you don't care about anyone else is very evident, as I highlighted.

And that is how some people use it - as an absolute last resort. And they can't afford £15 in the ridiculously limited and expensive official parking. And they've waited for buses for 40 minutes in the rain with Under-5s. And they've almost missed kick-off coming by train from Brighton after work. So you just pat yourself on the back, because you're okay. The club got it wrong, it's that simple. Even with people really trying to do what they want (and they are) the provision for cars is not sufficient. Away fans, in addition, don't give a monkey's about our sustainable transport policy.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

A car is necessary for some who have to travel straight from work/live miles away or out in the sticks.

... and a Park & Ride site is available, even to folk who live miles away.

 

[Tooting Gull]

... and a Park & Ride site is available, even to folk who live miles away.

It is indeed, and it works well in my experience.

One for you Lord B. do you know if the P&R near or at capacity for a normal Saturday/or midweek league game at the moment?

And if Coldean/Moulsecoomb were to be removed from the equation and 8,000 seats added, what might that be like?

 

[kano]

Officially it's actually called vehicle excise duty, and it is a tax on the car itself. People call it road tax out of tradition and an erroneous belief that it goes towards the upkeep of roads (it doesn't, roads are mostly paid for through council tax, I believe).

The car has to be taxed for you to use it on roads and to park on roads, but it doesn't give you a right to park wherever you like.

Which is exactly what i said. Thanks for backing me up. As long as you park legally on a public road there is no problem and indeed you have paid for the privilege. (as long as your not a scumbag with no road tax)

The problem is people give too much time to all these sad lonely curtain twitchers who dont like someone elses car outside their house, my post was more born out of my hatred for this type of person than anger at any potential parking restrictions. 99% of the time i walk, get a coach or get a train depending where i drink first so it doesn't really effect me. But these unreasonable busybodies tend to be much more vocal than the majority of sensible reasonable people, so i think its important to have a common sense rant every now and then to counter their arguments.

If i did rely on the car to get to the games i would be pretty mad if any restrictions in coledean were put in place tho. There is plenty of room and alot of the locals have driveways anyway. Get some stewards out making sure people dont park like idiots but to stop people parking in public roads at all just because it gets a bit busy is a nonsense.

 

[DumLum]

Over about 10 years I lived in two houses close to the old Goldstone. One was in Amhurst Cres and the other near Hove Park.

On match days the roads were full of supporters looking to park up for the games, it was just a fact of life.

Nowadays people have got too precious about that bit of road outside their house and will look for any opportunity to complain.

Its called a public highway for good reason.

If we're going to get heavy about parking in Coldean then lets start booking the residents that park on pavements and grass verges.

This.

I used to overlook the cricket ground in Hove. I used to have to pay for a permit to park in my road, but i would not get a space anywhwere near my place if there was a game on. Sometimes I would have to put money in a meter to park close by as it was a different zone. I didn't complain because I didn't believe the bit of road outside my place belonged to me.

 

[Acker79]

It is indeed, and it works well in my experience.

One for you Lord B. do you know if the P&R near or at capacity for a normal Saturday/or midweek league game at the moment?

And if Coldean/Moulsecoomb were to be removed from the equation and 8,000 seats added, what might that be like?

I've heard mill road gets really busy, but that the race course isn't, and mithras house also has spaces available in the cockcroft/watts car parks on the other side of the road.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

It is indeed, and it works well in my experience.

One for you Lord B. do you know if the P&R near or at capacity for a normal Saturday/or midweek league game at the moment?

And if Coldean/Moulsecoomb were to be removed from the equation and 8,000 seats added, what might that be like?

I'm told that the Racecourse P&R site has always had spare places available and that it works very well for those who use it.

As for an expanded stadium, I think there is scope for absorbing the extra numbers - with a bit of tinkering of the current travel plan and the provision of some extra parking capacity, such as a dedicated away fans p&r, if a suitable site can be found. A fair amount of work needs to be done, though.

 

[Bozza]

Those who say "there is no problem" or "the residents should just deal with it" are being a bit naive...

1. There are a lot of residents of these areas who are unhappy.
2. Those residents have spoken to their councillors.
3. Those councillors want to be elected next time round, so want to please their constituents.
4. Those councillors sit on a council that has the ability to determine whether the Amex can be expanded (or expanded AND used).

This means something will be done, like it or not.

 

[Gritt23]

It is possible to move it up a notch from the 'request' ie the blue signs to a full controlled zone on a matchday, but I thought that was a longer process, detailed resident discussions etc and probably took months via the council. Plus there would be objections to a zone from some residents and presumably the shops/pub/bookies. I know there are experts on here in this area though.

That's what I was driving at.

Notters - while I know other clubs also have these blue signs, what is teh penalty for ignoring them? I don't think it is a fine / points / towed / clamped, so it's therefore completely ineffective. All very well when it was just a few 1,000 of us shuffling down to the Theatre of Trees, as you could respect it without adding huge amounts of time to your journey, but that's not the case now. So until it is a legally enforceable restriction, then people will park there.

To make it a legally enforceable restriction - I believe - is drawn out, and brings consequences with it that will mean the change is not universally welcomed by the locals.

 

[amexee]

It is indeed, and it works well in my experience.

One for you Lord B. do you know if the P&R near or at capacity for a normal Saturday/or midweek league game at the moment?

And if Coldean/Moulsecoomb were to be removed from the equation and 8,000 seats added, what might that be like?

works well

ROTFL

I spent £60 on travel vouchers for me and a young one. Tried park and ride. I now park in coldean purely because my blood boils when I have to stand and stand and stand, because they are filling one bus at a time.

I am fully prepared to queue and take my turn, but when a jobsworth laughed at the suggestion that they could speed things up a tad, I decided to find a different approach. When I hear that there is a serious attempt to get people away quickly I will return to the queue.

As of now, I scratch my head wondering why on earth no one at the club seems to think that getting people away should be a priority, because if they did, it could easily be improved immensely.

 

[Acker79]

That's what I was driving at.

Notters - while I know other clubs also have these blue signs, what is teh penalty for ignoring them? I don't think it is a fine / points / towed / clamped, so it's therefore completely ineffective. All very well when it was just a few 1,000 of us shuffling down to the Theatre of Trees, as you could respect it without adding huge amounts of time to your journey, but that's not the case now. So until it is a legally enforceable restriction, then people will park there.

To make it a legally enforceable restriction - I believe - is drawn out, and brings consequences with it that will mean the change is not universally welcomed by the locals.

There was a thread a while back about people parking somewhere despite stewards asking them not to.

I think the discussion was that if the club ask you to help them meet the obligations of their planning agreement by not parking somewhere, and you park there anyway, they are within their rights to revoke your season tickets/refuse you entry to Amex. Some argued that this would be a breach of fair contract rules (suggesting it's unreasonable for the club to punish you for doing something they've asked you not to, even though you're legally entitled to do it), but I believe it wouldn't. I imagine the club would be aware of all legal technicalities and ensured they followed them and I think Lord Bracknell mentioned that by being a necessity to act in accordance with planning restrictions, the fair contract law wouldn't apply.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

works well

ROTFL

I spent £60 on travel vouchers for me and a young one. Tried park and ride. I now park in coldean purely because my blood boils when I have to stand and stand and stand, because they are filling one bus at a time.

I am fully prepared to queue and take my turn, but when a jobsworth laughed at the suggestion that they could speed things up a tad, I decided to find a different approach. When I hear that there is a serious attempt to get people away quickly I will return to the queue.

As of now, I scratch my head wondering why on earth no one at the club seems to think that getting people away should be a priority, because if they did, it could easily be improved immensely.

As I say, some tinkering with the existing travel arrangements could deliver some considerable improvements.

Bozza is right. The Club have to address not only the realities of parking, but the perceptions that people have of how it is working/not working. And not just residents' perceptions ... supporters' perceptions, as well.

 

[Gwylan]

It is possible to move it up a notch from the 'request' ie the blue signs to a full controlled zone on a matchday, but I thought that was a longer process, detailed resident discussions etc and probably took months via the council. Plus there would be objections to a zone from some residents and presumably the shops/pub/bookies. I know there are experts on here in this area though.

I don't see how this is enforced though: if it's done formally through resident permits, how are you going to stop people? Put barriers across The Avenue? Hillside? Moulsecoomb Way? Coldean Lane? That would inconvenience a lot of people and who's going to staff these, you're talking about a lot of stewards here.

Those who say "there is no problem" or "the residents should just deal with it" are being a bit naive...

1. There are a lot of residents of these areas who are unhappy.
2. Those residents have spoken to their councillors.
3. Those councillors want to be elected next time round, so want to please their constituents.
4. Those councillors sit on a council that has the ability to determine whether the Amex can be expanded (or expanded AND used).

This means something will be done, like it or not.

I'm not sure there are a lot of people moaning about it TBH. I've not heard a single person complain in Coldean.

That's not to say there aren't people - there are some professional cackbadgers in Coldean who moan about everything. If the council decided that a house was to be converted as a residential home for Scandinavian nude sun-worshippers, there'd be whingeing about it.

There are certainly people who moan about drivers parking outside their house - we've had the police round twice in the last couple of years after parking disputes escalated but those were nothing to do with football.

 

[Gritt23]

There was a thread a while back about people parking somewhere despite stewards asking them not to.

I think the discussion was that if the club ask you to help them meet the obligations of their planning agreement by not parking somewhere, and you park there anyway, they are within their rights to revoke your season tickets/refuse you entry to Amex. Some argued that this would be a breach of fair contract rules (suggesting it's unreasonable for the club to punish you for doing something they've asked you not to, even though you're legally entitled to do it), but I believe it wouldn't. I imagine the club would be aware of all legal technicalities and ensured they followed them and I think Lord Bracknell mentioned that by being a necessity to act in accordance with planning restrictions, the fair contract law wouldn't apply.

Well, plenty of people ARE doing it, so if this is in contravention of the planning restrictions, and the club are legally entitled to revoke STs, let's see if that happens. I bet it doesn't.

 

[Tory Boy]

It's all rubbish, there are no problems with Mouscombe and Coldean, it's all in the mind of the tree hungers.

How many complaints have there been? I suspect hardly any.

Coldean is mainly a student area now, same for large chunks of Mouscombe. Has anyone asked the shops and pub there if they object to all that extra trade?

TB

 

[Geriatric Seagull]

Mill road a sustainable transport option- virtually full ninety minutes before kick off- I think not!

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Mill road a sustainable transport option- virtually full ninety minutes before kick off- I think not!

Some people getting to games early (and leaving late, if you prefer travelling by train, for example) are all part of the sustainable package.

People are increasingly learning what works best for them. Sharing those lessons with others (aka Better, Accurate, Honest Travel Information) is another element that can be worked up. Now we are in a period of more stable fixtures (lots of Saturday afternoon games coming up, for example), the opportunities for more learning are, at last, appearing.