[Football] Cheating - pretending to be injured to disrupt the opposition

[Easy 10]

Sounds about right.

Happy to be corrected, but I thought it was for all perceived dives in the box.

Everton striker Niasse given two-match ban for diving against Crystal Palace

The forward will miss the next two games after the club’s appeal was rejected

www.mirror.co.uk

It was actually an Everton player against Palace, as it turns out. Probably took his lead from the BETM though.
Why this isn't implemented more often, I have no idea.

 

[maltaseagull]

No ref is taking on themselves to play on if a player is suspected of having a head injury, and neither should they.

Footballers are cheats pure and simple. They make refereeing almost impossible.

Rugby Union sends players off for a head injury assessment and allows a substitute whilst that takes place.
That would surely stop the cheats?

 

[dadams2k11]

Should have put our chances away. Can't blame Fulham for shithousing a result.

 

[Dave the OAP]

I made the suggestion to basically if there is a stoppage for “ head injury” the game clock is stopped and the player is assessed and is taken off for 10 minutes . If it turns out they are seriously injured and can’t come back, then a substitute is allowed almost immediately. If he has a Lazarus conversion then he stays off for 10 minutes And is cautioned with a yellow card.

this would send a signal that if you are looking to cheat your team will suffer.

btw, we are not angels here…Caciedo tends to fall over as if he has been shot and yesterday, Mitoma was tackled ,stayed down rolling about, we get possession, he leaps up like a salmon and sets off down the wing
.
fulham, villa and bournemouth on the other hand take it to another level.

teams seem to have worked us out….park the bus, hope we don’t score, push up on Mitoma and allow us to play along the back and hit us on the break. We didn’t have the luck yesterday 2 goals disallowed etc, but it is such a shame that if teams come here to play, we compete and dispatch them like Liverpool, but if they come to park, also add Leeds to that list, we really struggle to break teams down and score. That is to take nothing away from us being a very good side who are very difficult to beat and pushing for Europe.

 

[Horses Arse]

According to my new Fulham friend (in the Guardian site naturally) it is an oft used tactic, as is general shithousery. I’ve not seen enough of their games to know, hence I asked ZeeZee.

He doesn't half go on though doesn't he? He'd give Paul Barber a run for his money.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Any ideas how this can be fixed?

Maybe they could just introduce the same rule as rugby where an injured player gets treated whilst the game continues? Or straight off on a stretcher?

Might have its downsides but sure as hell would stop cheats like Robinson getting away with altering the course of the match.

This is a long thread...to reply to you the OP, the answer is yes - stretcher off while play continues if a player waves for one. Once stretchered off the player MUST be subbed.

Then some nuance - train the captain in first aid so he can recognize a concussed player, or a player in cardiac arrest, or a leg break, and charge the captain with the authority to stop the game in such circumstances. Frankly any of these could be quickly identified by most teenagers, so it wouldn't be a stretch for even the dimmest captain to make the right call. Any pissing about, with the player rising like Jesus on Easter Monday, red card the captain.

Disrupting the flow of the game and stamping on feet are the new tackle from behind. Begone!

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I made the suggestion to basically if there is a stoppage for “ head injury” the game clock is stopped and the player is assessed and is taken off for 10 minutes . If it turns out they are seriously injured and can’t come back, then a substitute is allowed almost immediately. If he has a Lazarus conversion then he stays off for 10 minutes And is cautioned with a yellow card.

this would send a signal that if you are looking to cheat your team will suffer.

btw, we are not angels here…Caciedo tends to fall over as if he has been shot and yesterday, Mitoma was tackled ,stayed down rolling about, we get possession, he leaps up like a salmon and sets off down the wing
.
fulham, villa and bournemouth on the other hand take it to another level.

teams seem to have worked us out….park the bus, hope we don’t score, push up on Mitoma and allow us to play along the back and hit us on the break. We didn’t have the luck yesterday 2 goals disallowed etc, but it is such a shame that if teams come here to play, we compete and dispatch them like Liverpool, but if they come to park, also add Leeds to that list, we really struggle to break teams down and score. That is to take nothing away from us being a very good side who are very difficult to beat and pushing for Europe.

The new evil tactic is to disrupt the flow of the game:

Forest
Bournemouth
Villa
Fulham (a bit, yesterday, but they were sporadic rather than systematic in my tiny opinion)

Time may be wasted but this is not about wasting time. It is about f***ing up the home team's flow.

Note that most of these dweebs don't do this anywhere near as much at home because the home supporters would see their team as shitehouse because supporters all think we should win at home, and be beating teams like (add the name of a team like).

And like many, even I would applaud gamesmanship if we did it away at Citeh - because like everyone else I am a one-eyed hypocrite when we play away. There's something about playing away and our mores entering the twilight zone. Human nature, I guess.

 

[Bodian]

Use VAR? While the injured, or "injured" player is getting treatment VAR reviews the incident and if there's doubt of an injury:

1st time: restart goes to the other team, without any requirement to return it.
2nd time: restart goes to the other team, without any requirement to return it, plus yellow card for the player feigning injury
3rd time onward: restart goes to the other team, without any requirement to return it, plus red card for the player feigning injury

[Edit to clarify: Any player from the team, not that each player gets three chances. So the the first time anyone goes downfeigning injury no card, second time anyone on that team does it gets a yellow, third time gets a red. Otherwise they'll all just take turns, and it is about 'the team' benefitting, so 'the team' should be punished.]

Might need to be tweaked. Because there's always a chance for an injury to occur without contact with the opponent - perhaps somehow build in an option for a substitution to avoid the yellow card (that is, if a player goes down injured without any apparent cause, the team can sub him off, and restart will be the same as genuine injuries - ball being returned to particular team etc)

This should avoid the issue of whatever is done impacting on genuine injuries. Might also help to motivate fans to not want their own team to do it, since they don't want to have their players sent off.

Of course the flaw in this is the same flaw in the simulation law - referees are seemingly reluctant to accuse players of cheating (which a booking for simulation equates to), and this would be that, too. (Quite a few years ago I saw this raised as a reason refs were reluctant to book players for diving as often as fans would like them to, around the time Uefa made an edict that cards for diving could only be given if there was absolutely no contact).

And the thing is - most players know when another player is seriously injured, and stop of their own accord anyway. They know when someone is 'exaggerating'.

 

[willalbion]

He doesn't half go on though doesn't he? He'd give Paul Barber a run for his money.

Yep, generally too long don’t read, unless we’ve just played them he/she is very pleasant & even handed.

 

[BrightonCottager]

I have been told by a Fulham fan (on twitter) the Sky highlights this morning showed a clear elbow to the head for Paulinha.

Anyone seen it?

Yes. I watched the complete replay looking for shithousery, and he did get an elbow to the head. The only clear shithousery from a Fulham player was Vinicius feigning a head injury that the Fulham commentators called out. Robinson was caught in a scissor tackle by March (I think) and slapped hands with him afterwards.

 

[BrightonCottager]

From where I was standing, and from watching the replay, Fulhams's 'shithousery' (when it was that) didn't stop you wasting many clear chances, as the stats and replays show. We did not park the bus, and have used Mr Utility Bobby Decodova Reed as a striker before (he's played all over this and last season). We tried to get the ball to him and Perreira many times but the passes were unusually wayward. Ream, Tete and Diop had good games and nullified Mitoma. Leno performed well. Willian and Palhinha weren't as good as normal. Worthing's Harrison Reed was buzzing around like an angry wasp at a picnic as usual. We had some luck. Vinicius drew your defenders and laid off the dream pass to Solomon who is a revelation.

 

[Bodian]

From where I was standing, and from watching the replay, Fulhams's 'shithousery' (when it was that) didn't stop you wasting many clear chances, as the stats and replays show. We did not park the bus, and have used Mr Utility Bobby Decodova Reed as a striker before (he's played all over this and last season). We tried to get the ball to him and Perreira many times but the passes were unusually wayward. Ream, Tete and Diop had good games and nullified Mitoma. Leno performed well. Willian and Palhinha weren't as good as normal. Worthing's Harrison Reed was buzzing around like an angry wasp at a picnic as usual. We had some luck. Vinicius drew your defenders and laid off the dream pass to Solomon who is a revelation.

Thought Ream was MoTM myself.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Thought Ream was MoTM myself.

Agree - thought he held them together

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Should have put our chances away. Can't blame Fulham for shithousing a result.

Can't blame people from cheating. Yeah right.

 

[dadams2k11]

Can't blame people from cheating. Yeah right.

Unfortunately it is a tactic that has reared its ugly head, you could say it has replaced Diving/falling over because of the wind. I think I first noticed it a few season back, maybe longer.

The point remains, that if we put away a few of our chances, we probably wouldn't be so invested in this discussion.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

The point remains, that if we put away a few of our chances, we probably wouldn't be so invested in this discussion.

The point remains that if either the teams were more honorable, or if the refs clamped down on this behaviour, we would have a significantly higher chance of scoring as each period of pressure wouldn't be punctuated by fake injuries.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

 

[Audax]

I think this is exactly what should be happening in the mens game as well. From what I saw reported earlier today, it's only come about because Toone's red card was successfully overturned and that brought the simulation into focus.

What Football really needs are full post-match video reviews. Nothing off the table: whether the ref saw it and ruled on it in the game itself is irrelevant. The Video Reviews would fill two purposes:

1. Looking for, identifying, and punishing appropriately any foul play, including both attempted and successful simulation designed to gain an advantage. If said foul play was under-punished during the match, the punishment can be upgraded. Likewise if it was over-punished it gets downgraded. So yellows can become reds and trigger match bans, reds can become yellows and avoid match bans etc. Results of these reviews could then be tracked for specific players and used to highlight behaviour patterns that officials need to watch out for (such as illegitimate face-clutching etc).

2. Rating the performance of the officials. These ratings are then a) published regularly, and b) used to promote / demote officials, and c) used to trigger remedial training for officials who offer consistently poor performances. Over the long term, these ratings could also be used to root out any potential bias by an official - if they are constantly poorly rated against specific teams, that's an indicator that the ref is either consciously or unconsciously biased. If the former is suspected, they never officiate in relevant matches again, if the latter is more likely then they're sent for specific bias removal training.

 

[Acker79]

What Football really needs are full post-match video reviews. Nothing off the table: whether the ref saw it and ruled on it in the game itself is irrelevant.

I've thought similar things in the past - thinking the ref and the assistances should review the match (that way the ref remains the authority of that game, things are still judged by the same ref's opinion), not just to address errors, but because I think it could be a helpful tool for the ref to analyse themselves and improve their own performance by picking up on their own tendancies and habits.

To your second point, I think my thinking was via tracking - if the ref is constantly making the same corrections game after game, that would highlight something their bosses might want to look into.

 

[Horses Arse]

From where I was standing, and from watching the replay, Fulhams's 'shithousery' (when it was that) didn't stop you wasting many clear chances, as the stats and replays show. We did not park the bus, and have used Mr Utility Bobby Decodova Reed as a striker before (he's played all over this and last season). We tried to get the ball to him and Perreira many times but the passes were unusually wayward. Ream, Tete and Diop had good games and nullified Mitoma. Leno performed well. Willian and Palhinha weren't as good as normal. Worthing's Harrison Reed was buzzing around like an angry wasp at a picnic as usual. We had some luck. Vinicius drew your defenders and laid off the dream pass to Solomon who is a revelation.

No one said it caused us to miss chances, it stopped us creating more though through disrupting play/rhythm, which is why teams like fulham do it.

As for parking the bus, fulham offered nothing. Absolutely nothing. Not interested in anything other than 0-0. I could not understand the absence of any ambition. Bournemouth looked a class above fulham, which is damning.

Two brighton players playing 'claud' gifted possession and with us committed to another attack you stole the points.

So pissed of as that was a clash that was anticipated to be a cracking game. Fulham made sure it wasn't. So bloody frustrating.