Capitalism v Socialism

[Randy McNob]

I've always been mystified as to why everyday people defend the virtues of capitalism, even more so recently, and socialism is such a dirty word. Whatever people's opinions the very heart of socialism is to benefit everyday people so why wouldn't people be in favour of a system that works for them?

Look at the comparison below, the Norway Democratic Socialism model v US Unfettered Capitalism. I know which i'd rather have

 

[beorhthelm]

you can prove anything with cherry picking how about trying Venezuela and Singapore?

i note no mention of the massive oil exports from Norway. mixed capitalist-socialism (really what it is) is a good idea, when you can afford it and theres a general acceptance of it. we seem to be mostly happy about it here, arguing over how much government should take and spend, rather than the principle if they should take at all. then there are the socialist who'd rather do away with the capitalist part and state control more. that is were it all goes wrong, every time.

 

[The Clamp]

you can prove anything with cherry picking how about trying Venezuela and Singapore?

i note no mention of the massive oil exports from Norway. mixed capitalist-socialism (really what it is) is a good idea, when you can afford it and theres a general acceptance of it. we seem to be mostly happy about it here, arguing over how much government should take and spend, rather than the principle if they should take at all. then there are the socialist who'd rather do away with the capitalist part and state control more. that is were it all goes wrong, every time.

Well, colour me shocked! I agree with you

 

[wallyback]

https://www.lovemoney.com/news/8547...red an,according to recently released figures.

Worth a read

 

[Hastings gull]

I've always been mystified as to why everyday people defend the virtues of capitalism, even more so recently, and socialism is such a dirty word. Whatever people's opinions the very heart of socialism is to benefit everyday people so why wouldn't people be in favour of a system that works for them?

Look at the comparison below, the Norway Democratic Socialism model v US Unfettered Capitalism. I know which i'd rather have

View attachment 132378

I never cease to be amazed at how naive people can be and blind themselves to reality, simply to fit everything in to their narrative. If only you could have been with me outside a lidl in Bavaria in summer 1990, close to the then recently-opened inner-German border, and watched hundreds of freed East Germans push and shove each other to get at nappies, fresh fruit, fruit juice, clothing and fresh bread. Rolls for breakfast had to be ordered a week beforehand in the then socilaist utopia which apparently, accoridng to you, was of benefit to everyday people. You might just have had second thoughts, but somehow, sadly, I doubt it.

 

[Weststander]

Norway is a mixed economy.

Financially, with the UAE, Qatar, Saudi Arabia and Brunei, Norwegians are in a very rare position of sitting on colossal gas/oil reserves, relative to a tiny population. Already giving them a $1T sovereign trust fund that will pay for state benefits and handsome pensions for many generations to come. Whereas the c.200 nations of the world have the opposite of national debts.

Sweden, Denmark and Finland are interesting examples to follow. NSC discussed this in 2019 in the build up to the GE.

For example in Stockholm someone earning SKR325,000 forfeits 59% of their salary in direct taxes. (They have incredibly wealthy folk too, plenty of Ferraris on the streets when we visit the city). Their corporation tax rate is falling to 20.6%, similar to our 19%, so in a competitive global market they don’t tax companies hard.

The direct equivalent salary here of £28,000 sees 19% paid in direct taxes.

Will Brits ever accept giving up a high proportion of income in taxes as the Swedes, Danes and Finns do?

 

[Randy McNob]

I never cease to be amazed at how naive people can be and blind themselves to reality, simply to fit everything in to their narrative. If only you could have been with me outside a lidl in Bavaria in summer 1990, close to the then recently-opened inner-German border, and watched hundreds of freed East Germans push and shove each other to get at nappies, fresh fruit, fruit juice, clothing and fresh bread. Rolls for breakfast had to be ordered a week beforehand in the then socilaist utopia which apparently, accoridng to you, was of benefit to everyday people. You might just have had second thoughts, but somehow, sadly, I doubt it.

I'm struggling to understand how you took the original point of the thread and translated that into an example of the Soviet Union of 40 years ago. Thats quite a reach

 

[portslade seagull]

I never cease to be amazed at how naive people can be and blind themselves to reality, simply to fit everything in to their narrative. If only you could have been with me outside a lidl in Bavaria in summer 1990, close to the then recently-opened inner-German border, and watched hundreds of freed East Germans push and shove each other to get at nappies, fresh fruit, fruit juice, clothing and fresh bread. Rolls for breakfast had to be ordered a week beforehand in the then socilaist utopia which apparently, accoridng to you, was of benefit to everyday people. You might just have had second thoughts, but somehow, sadly, I doubt it.

But according to Mcnob socialism works, it's not like Putin hasn't built himself a 2b hideaway

 

[Randy McNob]

But according to Mcnob socialism works, it's not like Putin hasn't built himself a 2b hideaway

Not according to me, according to the source.

One could argue because of Trump democracy doesn't work

 

[portslade seagull]

Not according to me, according to the source.

One could argue because of Trump democracy doesn't work

Trump would never work,loved himself too much

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

I never cease to be amazed at how naive people can be and blind themselves to reality, simply to fit everything in to their narrative. If only you could have been with me outside a lidl in Bavaria in summer 1990, close to the then recently-opened inner-German border, and watched hundreds of freed East Germans push and shove each other to get at nappies, fresh fruit, fruit juice, clothing and fresh bread. Rolls for breakfast had to be ordered a week beforehand in the then socilaist utopia which apparently, accoridng to you, was of benefit to everyday people. You might just have had second thoughts, but somehow, sadly, I doubt it.

But according to Mcnob socialism works, it's not like Putin hasn't built himself a 2b hideaway

Never ceases to amaze me that people confuse Communism with all forms of Socialism. It's a pretty entrenched view that socialism = post WWII East Germany or the USSR. Democratic Socialism exists right now, working quite happily in countries a short flight or boat ride away. It's not a scary monster.

 

[Randy McNob]

Never ceases to amaze me that people confuse Communism with all forms of Socialism. It's a pretty entrenched view that socialism = post WWII East Germany or the USSR. Democratic Socialism exists right now, working quite happily in countries a short flight or boat ride away. It's not a scary monster.

they are typical of a public gaslit to support a plutocratic Britain

 

[A1X]

Never ceases to amaze me that people confuse Communism with all forms of Socialism. It's a pretty entrenched view that socialism = post WWII East Germany or the USSR. Democratic Socialism exists right now, working quite happily in countries a short flight or boat ride away. It's not a scary monster.

Usually when analysed their argument seems to boil down to "It's socialist because it said it was socialist". Which must mean there are few places on Earth nicer to live in than the Democratic People's Republic of Korea.