[NSC] Caicedo going on loan?

[Kosh]

Obviously you've never read any comments from the club about taking young players out of their comfort zone to see how they respond? I'm sure every young player would have been assessed by the club and looked after by David Weir and his team to gauge what they are and are not ready for? It's Tony Bloom running the club not Del Boy?

I appreciate your loyalty.

But we all make mistakes, misjudgments.

All of us.

 

[B-right-on]

From th eoutside it certainly doesn't look like the ideal move. Struggling team in another country ......... hmmm.

I'd have preferred a loan in the UK - apart from anything else, it makes it easier for us mere fans to follow his progress! Still, it is what it is - so good luck to Moises at ........... err ............... what's the club called?

Beerestival I think.

Haven't a clue why they didn't send AC there too.

Got to trust the club has done the proper DD on this, where he is staying, brand if football, game time etc... Ok it went thru at the last minute but who knows how many weeks it's been in the pipeline.

 

[Kosh]

From th eoutside it certainly doesn't look like the ideal move. Struggling team in another country ......... hmmm.

I'd have preferred a loan in the UK - apart from anything else, it makes it easier for us mere fans to follow his progress! Still, it is what it is - so good luck to Moises at ........... err ............... what's the club called?

Wholeheartedly agree.

 

[nwgull]

Couldn’t agree more. What an absolute shit decision. Lack of duty of care to the lad. He was just starting to grasp English and we then do this. I’d be flying home to Ecuador and telling Ashworth where to stick his loan deal. I have never felt the need to email anyone at the club before to express concern but I may do it on this one.

He's perfectly entitled to refuse the loan deal and stay here earning whatever salary he and his agent agreed with the club last January, which is no doubt in the 10s of thousands per week. No one is forcing him to go to the supposed hell on earth that is Antwerp (must've changed since I last went there about 20 years ago) to get some senior-level European football experience and improve his game, and I'm sure he'll be well looked after by his agent and both clubs.

 

[Mancgull]

He's perfectly entitled to refuse the loan deal and stay here earning whatever salary he and his agent agreed with the club last January, which is no doubt in the 10s of thousands per week. No one is forcing him to go to the supposed hell on earth that is Antwerp (must've changed since I last went there about 20 years ago) to get some senior-level European football experience and improve his game, and I'm sure he'll be well looked after by his agent and both clubs.

I think my initial reaction must have been stoked up by the timing (11pm on deadline day) and our failure to get our first team striker target over the line. It is hardly Siberia.
However, I do wonder why it wasn't a UK based loan to get him used to the physical demands of the English game and help him improve his English. It would be interesting to Understand the decision making and processes in place at the club which result in these loans. Why Kadra to Blackburn, why Caicedo to Belgium etc. There's a lot of them now and I understand that it's David Weir who manages the loan players and keeps in touch, monitors progress etc. He will have quite a ramping up of his workload this year. I assume he uses some of the recruitment staff and scouts to keep tabs.

 

[HAILSHAM SEAGULL]

Wasnt it dependant on International clearance, maybe that was why it was so late.

 

[nwgull]

I think my initial reaction must have been stoked up by the timing (11pm on deadline day) and our failure to get our first team striker target over the line. It is hardly Siberia.
However, I do wonder why it wasn't a UK based loan to get him used to the physical demands of the English game and help him improve his English. It would be interesting to Understand the decision making and processes in place at the club which result in these loans. Why Kadra to Blackburn, why Caicedo to Belgium etc. There's a lot of them now and I understand that it's David Weir who manages the loan players and keeps in touch, monitors progress etc. He will have quite a ramping up of his workload this year. I assume he uses some of the recruitment staff and scouts to keep tabs.

Probably loads of factors at play on the decision about where best to send these players. I agree that in an ideal scenario an English Championship club would seem ideal, but it'd be no good sending him somewhere that he's unlikely to play at as they're already well stocked in that position. Good point on David Weir. The fact that we have a dedicated loan manager suggests that there's a fair bit of thought that goes into deciding the best option. He is a £3.5m depreciating asset after all!

 

[British Bulldog]

I appreciate your loyalty.

But we all make mistakes, misjudgments.

All of us.

Have you emailed the club with your concerns? Just in case they have made a mistake?

 

[albionalex]

I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on the Belgian league but I am not sure why people are so aghast that he's going to a team that's bottom of the league after 5 games. Beerschot finished 9th last season which is pretty respectable.

 

[*Gullsworth*]

I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on the Belgian league but I am not sure why people are so aghast that he's going to a team that's bottom of the league after 5 games. Beerschot finished 9th last season which is pretty respectable.

The Arsenal of the Belgian league then?

 

[Seasider78]

The club see the lad more than we do but the only shock for me is this was someone who was touted by Tim Vickery and others as waltzing into our first team. So whilst I am not against a loan to develop a player this move hardly smacks of a level that is going to prepare him for starts in the PL.

 

[Gabbiano]

This is for me the strangest one of the window - not the principle of the loan for Caicedo but the destination. For those saying "its all part of the club's strategy and they know what they're doing" yes that is true, but we can all make mistakes. Every year there is a significant proportion of our loan moves which don't work out or were a bit pointless and it would be a real pity if one of those this year is Caicedo, given his talent. As a general rule, given the numbers of talented young players at the club, one bad loan spell and your first team prospects are bleak.

From Ecuador's star player at the Copa America, supposedly being scouted by Man U and being touted as one of the great talents in South America... to the team at the bottom of the Belgian league. Surely if he was all that we could find him a better loan on reputation alone. Those on here who watched him play Copa America said he performed well, as he has in cup matches, so what gives?

From the outside in, we don't know what's been going on but I would have thought a club in the Championship, at the bottom of La Liga or the top of the Spanish second tier would have made more sense (we found Arce a loan in the Spanish second tier before and Caicedo has a much better reputation).

Perhaps visas had something to do with it being Belgium - as a non-EU player being loaned from a non-EU club, maybe the EU visas are easier to get at short notice for Belgium than elsewhere. But then why Beerschot and not USG? Again, if this kid is as good as we're led to believe, he should walk into that USG side...

I hope they all prove me wrong in any case.

 

[chaileyjem]

The club see the lad more than we do but the only shock for me is this was someone who was touted by Tim Vickery and others as waltzing into our first team. So whilst I am not against a loan to develop a player this move hardly smacks of a level that is going to prepare him for starts in the PL.

We gave a player a Premier League debut on Saturday who last season played nearly every week for a team who finished in the bottom half of L1.
Our keeper last season spent the previous year on loan in L1 for a team who finished 18th.

 

[Seasider78]

We gave a player a Premier League debut on Saturday who last season played nearly every week for a team who finished in the bottom half of L1.
Our keeper last season spent the previous year on loan in L1 for a team who finished 18th.

Caicedo has 10 caps for Equador which suggests his starting level should be a bit higher than the players we were giving experience to in the lower leagues. Will have to trust the club on this one but someone who on the surface looked to be coming over to compete for a first team position is now on loan to a club at the arse end of the League in belgium is going to raise a few eyebrows.

 

[HAILSHAM SEAGULL]

Caicedo has 10 caps for Equador which suggests his starting level should be a bit higher than the players we were giving experience to in the lower leagues. Will have to trust the club on this one but someone who on the surface looked to be coming over to compete for a first team position is now on loan to a club at the arse end of the League in belgium is going to raise a few eyebrows.

We have 10 players listed as midfielders in our 25 man squad, where would Caicedo be in that list and how many games would he start.
Just maybe, Potter sees the talent but thinks a season playing every week,even in Belgium, would see him come back and seamlessly replace Biss when he inevitably sold next year to a Champions League side.
I trust Potter

 

[albionalex]

Caicedo has 10 caps for Equador which suggests his starting level should be a bit higher than the players we were giving experience to in the lower leagues. Will have to trust the club on this one but someone who on the surface looked to be coming over to compete for a first team position is now on loan to a club at the arse end of the League in belgium is going to raise a few eyebrows.

Ecuador are ranked 55 in the world, in amongst the likes of Northern Ireland, Jamaica and Canada.

 

[Seasider78]

Ecuador are ranked 55 in the world, in amongst the likes of Northern Ireland, Jamaica and Canada.

Bissouma played for Mali should he have gone out to the lower levels of the Belgian league when he joined as well given they are ranked lower?

 

[Seasider78]

We have 10 players listed as midfielders in our 25 man squad, where would Caicedo be in that list and how many games would he start.
Just maybe, Potter sees the talent but thinks a season playing every week,even in Belgium, would see him come back and seamlessly replace Biss when he inevitably sold next year to a Champions League side.
I trust Potter

I am not disputing a loan being a good option for his development just can’t see where he is going being a stepping stone to replacing Biss as a PL starter. Feels like a significant jump to me which is why I was expecting a loan somewhere stronger

 

[GT49er]

He's perfectly entitled to refuse the loan deal and stay here earning whatever salary he and his agent agreed with the club last January.

Can he really? I doubt it - he could tear up his contract and go home, but would stop earning tens of thousands of pounds. He's an employee - if he wants to keep earning his tens of thousands of ponds, he plays where he's told to play. And I'm pretty sure that will be in the contract he and his agent agreed with the club in January!

That said, like many others on here I'm puzzled by the decision to send him to 'the arse end of the Belgian league'.

 

[albionalex]

Bissouma played for Mali should he have gone out to the lower levels of the Belgian league when he joined as well given they are ranked lower?

My point was that using international appearances to make a judgement about a player is pretty futile.